Are you not happy Wigan have been proactive to address the problems? What more can they possibly do at this stage?

More to the point the FB is now the second receiver who links up outside (on either left or right side) outside of the half back.

I think the positional names throw people off. Really they should be called something like:

FB= Deep lying second receiver
Winger= still pretty apt
centres=outside edges (only in union do they play in the centre)
Prop/13=Middles (props hardly prop up the scrum anymore)
Hooker=dummy half (do they ever hook for the ball?)
SR=Edges (a scrum is made up of whoever, they don't specifically need to be in the SR of a scrum)
scrum half/stand off=left and right halfback

something like that.

Ah I see we're getting to the straw man part of the discussion. Where have I said I wasn't happy? I've simply identified a number of issues, I and a number of other fans saw as problems on the field last season and things that happened during the off season. Let's see if Wane has sorted them out.

You're clearly unhappy to list several issues you have.

And as I replied, all your issues have been addressed in pre-season. I don't see what else you'd want or expect at this stage. I'm happy issues have been addressed. At this stage all Wigan and Wane can do is be proactive, to identity then address the issues which they have.

You're happy issues have been addressed without knowing if the issues have actually been addressed.

I'll wait to see a number of games (probably 10 or so) before deciding.

I can't see that there's any real argument with this.

I've been accused of being a happy-clapper in the past, but I wasn't in that category at the end of last year. We are all fans, and we will attend games loyally, but we do have a right to be critical if things are going sideways, and that certainly was the impression many of us were left in at the end of 2017. More to the point, while we can't possibly know which issues have and haven't been addressed in training, there's no denying that it's the same team who messed up so badly last year, and the same coaching staff.

I don't think it's an OTT reaction to reserve judgement until we've got a few wins on the board.

WANE OUT!!!! Just thought i would get that one in early..

It does seem people are going overboard with the performance at Leigh,lets be fair we won't know if the issues have been addressed for a good while yetis I'll join you in waiting a good few games and see how things are then, not off the back of a friendly.

And how is that any different from what anyone else us saying? In 10 games time we'll all have a clearer picture of whether they've been addressed in full, part or not at all. It doesn't take some kind of special ability to work that one out. It'll be there for all to see Not really sure what the point is you're making. I'll tell you at the end of the season if we've won any trophies or not. I'm guessing you won't need me to tell you though.

I fully agree we need to wait until at least a couple of months in to the season to see which problems have and haven’t been addressed but all clubs could make a list of 4 or 5 things that need attention. Even if we’re going well in mid season we could still probably list a number of things that could be improved.

It’s all on attitude, effort and spirit for me. We have the talent in the side to win things but the players looked bored and disinterested last year at times. The main thing I took from the Leigh game was that the spirit looked excellent and the players looked happy to be back out there.

Some posters here are not reading anything into the result of a friendly, because we won... If we had lost MELTDOWN!!!

Quote ="NickyKiss"I may be getting confused here but to my mind I always felt Sarginson looked like he’d be a better fit over on the right. The reason being that he seems to love that step back to the right, which over on the left kept taking him away from his winger (which was hugely frustrating). On that right side if he straightens and then goes right that should see him being able to link with his winger on far more occasions. If the space becomes tight then as is the norm, the winger comes inside to give his centre an option.'" Sarginson's left foot step whist playing at right centre would surely result in him stepping into touch would it not, Or he would surely run his winger out of his space? Big year for Shaun Wane coming up,especially after Radlinski reckons that they are SL's highest salary capped spending club https://www.wigantoday.net/sport/rugby- ... -1-8949792

Quote ="NickyKiss"I may be getting confused here but to my mind I always felt Sarginson looked like he’d be a better fit over on the right. The reason being that he seems to love that step back to the right, which over on the left kept taking him away from his winger (which was hugely frustrating). On that right side if he straightens and then goes right that should see him being able to link with his winger on far more occasions. If the space becomes tight then as is the norm, the winger comes inside to give his centre an option.'" Sarginson's left foot step whist playing at right centre would surely result in him stepping into touch would it not, Or he would surely run his winger out of his space? Big year for Shaun Wane coming up,especially after Radlinski reckons that they are SL's highest salary capped spending club https://www.wigantoday.net/sport/rugby- ... -1-8949792

Quote ="The Chin's Back"Sarginson's left foot step whist playing at right centre would surely result in him stepping into touch would it not, Or he would surely run his winger out of his space? Big year for Shaun Wane coming up,especially after Radlinski reckons that they are SL's highest salary capped spending club https://www.wigantoday.net/sport/rugby- ... -1-8949792'" This is my worry - his step would move him closer to touch and leave less space for Davies. Hopefully he can overcome his instincts and give Davies the option of both outside and inside runs.

Quote ="The Chin's Back"Sarginson's left foot step whist playing at right centre would surely result in him stepping into touch would it not, Or he would surely run his winger out of his space? Big year for Shaun Wane coming up,especially after Radlinski reckons that they are SL's highest salary capped spending club https://www.wigantoday.net/sport/rugby- ... -1-8949792'" This is my worry - his step would move him closer to touch and leave less space for Davies. Hopefully he can overcome his instincts and give Davies the option of both outside and inside runs.

Quote ="The Chin's Back"Sarginson's left foot step whist playing at right centre would surely result in him stepping into touch would it not, Or he would surely run his winger out of his space? Big year for Shaun Wane coming up,especially after Radlinski reckons that they are SL's highest salary capped spending club https://www.wigantoday.net/sport/rugby- ... -1-8949792'" That would be the worry but I’d rather him go towards his winger then away from him like he kept doing on the other side. I think back to top wingers centres over the years like Lyon and Gidley and they went towards the touch line and worked with minimal space to get their wingers in. We’re obviously talking about a much lower quality of player here but to be a good wingers centre, you’re going to have to take that risk of dealing with a lack of space imo. We had Darrel Goulding who did a similar job and would use a flick pass to get his wingers in close to the touch line.

Quote ="The Chin's Back"Sarginson's left foot step whist playing at right centre would surely result in him stepping into touch would it not, Or he would surely run his winger out of his space? Big year for Shaun Wane coming up,especially after Radlinski reckons that they are SL's highest salary capped spending club https://www.wigantoday.net/sport/rugby- ... -1-8949792'" That would be the worry but I’d rather him go towards his winger then away from him like he kept doing on the other side. I think back to top wingers centres over the years like Lyon and Gidley and they went towards the touch line and worked with minimal space to get their wingers in. We’re obviously talking about a much lower quality of player here but to be a good wingers centre, you’re going to have to take that risk of dealing with a lack of space imo. We had Darrel Goulding who did a similar job and would use a flick pass to get his wingers in close to the touch line.

I’m feeling positive about the year for the following reasons

1.) Lealuai not playing 7 ( in game kicking was dreadful)

2.) Players starting the year fully fit, Tomkins especially

3,) there’s a chance we’ll avoid a massive injury crisis for the first time in 2 years.

4,) a fit Clubb and Flower plus Hamlin and Naverette pushing should see improved play from the props (or they’ll be dropped)

5.) Our left side could be similar to Cas’ last season.

6.) Escare

7,) we have the best squad numbers 20-40 in the league, excited that this year the likes of Ganson, Wells, Field can come in to a side full of experience rather than last year when it was half first team half under 19s.

8.) small sample size but in game kicking was miles better last weekend. Goal kicking should improve too.

9.) Think the media thought McIlorum was a bigger player for Wigan than he actually was last year. Just wasn’t the same, missing tackles and only managing 20 min spells, although had a better WC. May have let him go a year too early but better than a year too late.

10.) the media has written us off, a lot of people saying 7th place!

Can’t wait

Surprising to read a lot of negativity already towards the Sarge/Davies combo...no doubt in my mind it will be a success and can see both players having a largely successful season. The link up play shown since Sarge started pre-season has looked top notch...Dans step toward touch may well become quite a tricky play to deal with for a few teams, especially with the power TD has when he comes in on the inside. Both have personal targets of 15+ tries. There was little to no chemistry between Gells and TD and a few felt TD was almost pushed out due to Gells popularity.

I don't understand the surprise in us being written off as contenders...we have pretty much the same spine as last year, albeit re-jigged. We still have SOL who may only manage 60% of the league games and I know that is a worry as if we lose the other 40%, chances are we will be nowhere near the top. All in all it should be a very competitive year and that is great for the game.

I am under no illusion that should things not go well, the club are more than ready to make some changes.

Great post Richie. I’m excited to see Sarge and Davies combine. Confident it’ll go well but if we need to change anything there who do we bring in? Forsyth disappears but is playing against Swinton today, he seems to be out of favour. Joel is no longer a centre, Wane doesn’t want Bateman there (neither does Bateman) and Isa is poor on the edge. Hope Sarge can stay fit and find some form.



Not sure about this part though. We have had a greatly competitive league for 5+ years now and the game over here is still sinking. It’s harder than ever to attract new supporters, playing numbers are down and general interest is down. There has been zero build up to the new season, barely any talking points, we still have no transfer market or any marketable players outside of the towns clubs play in and we are about to take a game 10,000 miles away for the sake of a few £000s profit when I’m sure with a few ideas and effort we could make the same playing the game in this country... but that’s for another thread.

Doesn’t make much difference seeing as he hardly ever passes to his winger anyway.

It’s hardly proactive, it’s incredibly reactive to last years poor performances and cohesion. We did nothing last year to try and change anything, it’s all happened in the off-season.

Last year we were hampered with injuries. I'm sure Wane would have made changes if possible.

How did injuries hamper not having a kicking game or a recognised kicker for several seasons?
I think that at the end of the season we had virtually a full squad and we still played like strangers with zippo flair and nil intensity.
In my opinion last season we were complete shoite and you would have to be a blind man not to recognise it.

It's a new season and hopefully we can only improve on generally a very poor season. I am happy to move on but we haven't played a game yet with any meaning so personally I don't know if lessons have been learned. I am hoping for improvements and there are some early signs that they may be delivered but we probably wont know until we have several games under our belt.

So negative. Coach makes key changes in preparation for a new season and still people are unhappy. I prefer to be positive. For one I'm happy with the changes made positionally, happy with the squad depth in key positions and happy we brought in a kicking coach to help out.

If changes don't occur then they need dealing with, until then the coach and team can only do what they have.

Sorry LSOW but I just don't see where I have been negative? We haven't played a game in anger yet so how can I judge if anything has changed for the better? With regards to your point of positional changes I think technically non have been officially confirmed? Powel to 7 and TL to 9 is the only major change in squad numbers but SW has I think stated that he hasn't finalised yet who will play where? Its pretty nailed on that Powel & TL will swop but apart from that no other major unforced changes?

It's not early at all

. Don't rate him. Based on his abject failure to address the issues last season I think we'd be better with even with this squad which has some question marks over it (Sarge, FPN and some others) with a different coach.