That was my point mate, he was sat so deep we couldn't get near him to give him a dig without it being late.

A sniper in the stand it is then!

You volunteering Jimmy?

There may not be anything in the rule book about that but it's not really in the spirit of the game.

Oh and to think that I thought that Wiganers didn't have a sense of humour! Being "too nice" is probably the last reason that Wigan have lost a couple of finals!

I don't think it's a coincidence that Wigan's successes over the last couple of years have come when you've actually tried to play rugby. Towards the back end of last year, from the Wire game onwards, you started to play a more attacking, expansive style and it worked. On Saturday, you only attacked when you were chasing the game and it was too late.

In my opinion, Wigan need more belief that they can beat their opposition by bettering them in attack.

On the Clubb try, am I missing something? I thought the rules were, you are allowed to try to reef the ball out when the ball carrier is in the act of scoring a try? In which case it couldn't be a penalty, much less a penalty try, as some have claimed, the only options would be a try or a knock-on?

You can't purposely pull the ball out anywhere on the pitch when 2 or more are in the tackle but tuimavave made absolutely no movement of his arm to dislodge the ball and there was clearly no evidence to suggest he deliberately pulled the ball out of clubb's grasp. It was clubb rolling over that did it as the VR clearly stated. If clubb had stayed on his back the ball wouldn't have come out so the dropped ball was clearly his doing. 100% correct decision. clubb dropped the ball

He did mate. I have no beef with the loss, the better team won and that is that but that was 100% the wrong call.

The full commentary team agreed it should've been a try and even your own coach did. Ultimately though both teams got what they deserved.

It has no bearing on the result but I honestly fail to see how tuimavave can be purposely dislodging the ball when he doesn't move his arm at all. Was he supposed to let go of clubb and let him roll over?

Correct on all points mate. Add to that Lee Radford's opinion was the decision was wrong and his team 'dodged a bullet' and it's enough for me to be convinced. In any case even if we agree Clubb dropped it (which I don't), the ball went back and then he grounded it. Whichever scenario it should have been a try.

One of the worst calls I've seen.

But he's did move his arm and that's the point. He reefed at the ball without any shadow of a doubt. If you get chance watch it again and just focus on his hand. He pulls at the ball a split second before Clubb rolls over.

We didn't do enough to win the game and Hull did. That decision gives us a talking point but I'm not kidding myself in to feeling robbed. We scored our last try just after Marshall appeared to step on the dead ball line for example so this isn't me sitting here trying to build a case for being robbed. It was an ordinary decision backed up by Lee Rashford (which tells you everything).

Re the Tony Clubb try/no try - bit late to the party on this one so forgive me if its already been mentioned. Live in the stdium I didn't think it was a try. When was the last time you saw a try like that awarded? When it went to the VR I thought it might have a chance as James Child likes to pull a mystery decision out of his backside from the recesses of therule book, but just shrugged my shoulders when it wasn't given. If that had happened anywhere else on the pitch and a penalty had been given it wouldn't have caused any fuss (as it wouldn't if a knock on had been given). It's a bit like in football when 2 players go up for a header in the centre circle. If it's a free kick nobody bats an eyelid. If the same situation occured in the penalty area and a penalty was given it woud cause a riot.

Move on everybody. On balance, the best team won.

Well said. I know Child is the guy we all love to hate, but given the onfield decision of no-try, his decision was hardly surprising, given the guidelines. We all moaned (rightly) when Thaler ignored the rules with his decision the other week; we can hardly complain now when Child sticks by them.

My main gripe was Child's reasoning; saying Tuimavave had no impact on the ball coming free. It was a loose carry but if Tuimavave isn't wrapping the ball out, it doesn't come out. Tiumavave has dislodged the ball but it was a loose carry.

the original post was about "being nice" not about the try or no try and i think the whole of rugby league is "too nice" it's time to get back to threatening each other with what we are going to do to them not saying the best team will win and who completes best will win lets see some aggression from coaches and captains verbally, some year ago this always created lots more interest among rival fans.

Well are we too nice?

Young halfback makes his debut in a game which is crucial to the opposition.

Do they

(a) Afford him the freedom of the park

(b) Let him know - legally - what first team rugby is all about.

Answers on a postcard to the Coaching team, Wigan RLFC.

They just need to ask the 19s coaching staff how they sorted him out a couple of weeks ago.

IMHO we need a rough tough prop to build around akin to when we brought Graeme West to Wigan. In the past we have had some forwards like Brian McTigue, Greg Dowling and the unforgettable Kelvin Skerrett . Unless we beef up that pack we could have the besthalf backs in the world and we will struggle. To me, too many of our players are not of Wigan standard. I said almost from the start of Wane's tenure that in my opinion he wasn't good enough for that job.' Madge'' was no idiot and would be of degree standard. Wane for all his keenness lacks the intellect to take our team forward. RL is very much like a game of chess today. Wane has been very blessed by his length of time in the top job. I compare that with how Graeme West was sacked many years ago - a very poor treatment by the club of 'Westie'.

What do you mean "too nice"? Are you saying that it is ridiculous you haven't had as much success as you'd like by playing within the rules and the coach referring to the performance of other teams in a complimentary way, in much the same way as other clubs and coaches do?

So you're suggesting, as you appear to be, that you should break the rules more to win more, because all that matters is Wigan winning. God forbid that other fans refer to Wigan fans as arrogant .....

Well that's one interpretation I suppose.

The days of Kelvin Skerrett are long gone, for better or worse. If he was playing today, he's never complete a game! You just can't get away with the sort of thing he used to do any more.

That doesn't mean, though, that we couldn't and shouldn't improve our pack.

I'm suggesting we need a strong pack leader. If you want to go even earlier where some of the play was even more brutal then Bill Ashurst could also dish it out in the so called 'bad old days' that were very entertaining IMHO. In the old derby matches against the saints if there wasn't a punch up in the first scrum, the crowd thought they were being ripped off.

I could be wrong, but I don't think McTigue got sent off in his life. He never got caught in the scrum.

We could sign the best prop in the world but if he plays in our current game plan of 'back set' after 'back set' then he wouldn't improve us much.
It's very clear our forwards are playing to instructions. Our backs do the graft when we're in possession and our forwards defend. I'm not sure how a new prop changes that.