I don't remember either ever getting caught on a break

Kevin Penny, but he lets himself down by being crap at rugby.

And I don't recall either beating anyone on pace alone I think Richards has done a long range try once or maybe twice this season [ugiven a start[/u. Roberts has not scored one such try and I don't think either of them have left anyone for dead. And before anyone says "you can't expect Martin Offiah pace anymore" these two are not as fast as Mark Preston, Henderson Gill, Brett Dallas or even - dare I mention his name, Mark Calderwood. There is no substitute for pace.

Dave

Is this the same Phil Clarke that openly says how much he admires Stains?

NO. And I mean [size=200NO[/size Wigan fan would make said comment

I'm sure they play for diff clubs.


The fact that Jukes is tryna make is that we have two of the best wingers IN ONE TEAM. However they both Aussies so they both crap

People keep saying it and saying that but does anyone ever really question it? I think Calderwood proved that there is a substitute for pace, even in a winger things like the ability to outjump defenders (Richards), strength (Vainikolo) and agility (Robinson). I would back Calderwood to beat all three of those in a race, but I'd pick all three ahead of him. Of course wingers have to be fast but there's more to it than that. iIn my opinion a more accurate saying would be "There's no substitute for momentum"

Facts:
Great performance by Wigan
Great win for Wigan
Phil Clarke is an awful pundit and biased

Facts

It was a "Very Good" performance by Wigan
It was a "Very Good" Win for Wigan
Phil Clarkes one of the Best Pundits in the game.
Your talking Nonsense

Oh Sorry, those are opinions not facts - Apart from the last one!

Thats really made me laugh. id rather have a cone on the wing

I must have been watching a different Calderwood he was fast at Leeds but when he was at Wigan and now Hull, my 80 year old nan could out run him.

I bet she couldn't!

Along with 90% of the other wingers in SL!

Name me 1 occasion when at Wigan where he got in the clear and got caught?

Name me one occasion when he showed blistering pace both for us and FC. I know for a fact that a lot of FC fans think he is poor.

The giddy twins are shat commentators. Simple really.

Dave, your argument always falls down when you harp back to Calderwood as if he was some kind of genius who we should never have released.

The man may be fast, but his attitude was rank-poor while he was at Wigan. Ask any of the players or coaching staff.

It's no good having a guy who can run, if other aspects of his personality are causing problems in the team.

In any case, he's gone and I think you need to get over it.

Your dislike for Amos Roberts is well-known (though I still think it's part of your anti-IL prospectus), but to lump Pat Richards in with this is, to be honest, quite ridiculous. The 'best tries' tape that was played at the end-of-season awards dinner was interesting in that Pat Richards was involved in nearly all of them. It isn't just speed, you know - it's strength, courage, being in the right place at the right time, determination, etc. Mark Calderwood showed very few of these things while he was at Wigan, apart from in his last match, which did neither us nor him any good at all.

Think you're a tad harsh on Calders there. He always chased back when teams broke against us which few other players did. His main problem was that he played outside 2 centres who couldn't pass.

Leeds at home end of last season from a loose ball he went 90 yards going away from chasing defenders.

Bradford play offs from a loose ball/interception - 90 yards again going away from defenders!

Countless occasions when he covered from right wing to catch breaks made down our left centre.

Notice both weren't from good passes from centres which he struggled to get in his 3 seasons at Wigan.

His main problem was that he was gash and his heart wasnt in it. If he had Gidley or Carmont next to him he still wouldn't have been interested.

Perhaps a little harsh, but neither was he the two-legged phenomenon that Dave O seems to think he was. I'd sooner have Pat Richards any day.

I'd stick to fishing in Grimsby mate

End of the day in a wigan shirt 58 sl games 17 tries, in a FC shirt 19g 6 tries. End point = gash.

He never touched the f*cking ball unless he picked it up from dummy half. He played outside Phil Bailey and Darryl Goulding FFS. One can't pass and the other refuses to.

Oh so the question you asked is not the answer you wanted!

32 tries in 72 games for Wigan = Try every 0.44444

Roberts has scored 12 in 32 = Try every 0.375 - Is he Gash as Well?????? (That's not a question for DaveO or anyone else

)

Richards in his 1st 2 x seasons scored 28 in 58 = Try every 0.48 Yet at the end of 2007 he was being voted as "Superman!".

I for one think Roberts is a Far better All round Winger and I am glad we did the swap.

But to criticise Calderwood for his strike rat or for not being quick enough or not b eing interested is just ludicrous!

If you want to say he's Gash then fair enough your entitiled to your opinion but to make up "Facts" to try and prove your point! Your going to have to come up with some better ones!

And just where have I been making up facts

?
The stats come from the SL site itself not wikipedea (and I know you've got them for C&W)icon_wink.gif . And I think your blinded by your love of our former no2 to see that in fact he was poor at his time here. He let countless tries against us when stopped and let opposing winger ground the ball. I remeber him having one good half against Bradford in the PO and a good game against Leeds the following year, O' yeah and against PIA when Bailey (who can't pass) gave him a field day at least 2 where over the line and all he had to do was drop with the ball.
Also as I stated earlier a lot of the FC fans dont rate him either, so we are all wrong? Or perhaps you think I am making that up as well?

I do have a lot of time on my hands fishing and all to make up stuff.

Roberts & Richards are infinately better than Calderwood.

Him not getting a pass is a falacy, how many tries have we scored wide this year?

Richards & Roberts have heart/quality. Calderwood doesnt.