No, yes it is! Thats is what he is saying!

i think you meant, "yes, you do"

gawwwd, i wish i hadn't have put anything!

When all is said and done we need big crowds at all our grounds. In the current climate we should be looking at getting families of four in for £25

Especially as you regularly go home the losers.

In business terms and profit margins probably a yes.

20000@ £10 ..........£200 000 (Wigoon Land)
15000@ £16.......... £240 000 (Saints Ghetto)

No wonder y0ur club can,t buy any decent players if the club is mathematical deficient.

You have not included for any refreshments in your total, the queues were there all through the game

It isn't an embarrassment. It's an artifact!

Besides, someone had to pay for the dodgy floodlight (along with the dodgy roofs and dodgy toilets and dodgy pretty much everything else). I think all the money from the gate goes into just keeping Knowsley Road standing. It's, er, why we need a new stadium!

At least you get a roof at your end, unlike when you visit Leeds (who charge £20 for the privilege). Just a pity more of you didn't turn up on Friday. There were fewer of you than the last time you played at our place but I thought there would be more given that you beat us the previous time out.

Surely, as you are all such wonderful suportive fans, you should be able to fill the "Artifact" all on your own, each week, But for some reason, you get nowhere near. God help you if you ever become less succesful..

Will you be using the 2500 fans at Central Park when you got relegated as a typical example.

If you're going to compare at least compare like for like opponents (and using your maths formula):

[uWigan[/u
22,000 @ £16 ...........£352,000 v Stains at JJB
20,000 @ £10 ...........£200,000 v Leeds at JJB

[uTotal Revenue - £552,000[/u


[uStains[/u
15,000 @ £16 ...........£240,000 v Wigan at KR
14,000 @ £16 ............£224,000 v Leeds at KR

[uTotal Revenue - £464,000[/u


Then again we could discuss revenue for over the season as both Wigan & Stains have had 11 home games, Hell.....I'll even knock a pound off the whole season to cover reduced prices for the Leeds game:

[uWigan[/u

Total attendance so far - 157,097 @ £15 = £2,356,455
Average so far= 14,282


[uStains[/u

Total attendance so far - 129188 @ £16 = £2,067,008
Average so far= 11,744

[u
Left to play[/u

Wigan - Warrington (h) 20K plus expected & Hull FC (h) 15K plus expected


Stains - Hudds (h) less than 10K expected, Catalans (h)less than 9K expected.

I'd expect Wigan to come in 400-500K over and above Stains at the end of the season.

So what was you saying about our club not buying any decent players as we are mathematically deficient?

You've just proved my point, if Wigan are say 0.5 million over Saints turnover, how come Wigan don,t have better players and are a more successful team than saints. Is it because saints players give better value for money and the wigan get there maths wrong by overpaying average players. Surely this mathematically deficient.

Also if you look at Asset values the Wigan club is of little value, where as in 2011 saints new stadium will have an asset value of £25 000 000.
Surely this is mathematically defecient.

It's because we are only two years of being a proper run club. Between late 1999 and late 2007 we were bankrolled appallingly by Dave Whelan who just never run the club in a proper way. That's why we did nothing on the field of play. Throughout that spelt it just went worse and worse and worse with no real idea of how to control the salary cap. Compare that to Saints who have been very well run and thats the difference between the clubs.

You can't just change it overnight but Lenegan will get there I'm confident of that.

Totally agree.

Talk about changing the Goalposts (or in this case Rugby Posts)



Suddenly you're now talking about players on the pitch and Stadium ownership.....not revenue from attendances (which is what you were initially insinuating)



Both clubs spend upto the maximum on the cap, players class, worth or performances are irrelevant.

Stadium ownership??? We have a 50 year lease with the Stadium Company, where we have 'as IL admitted' a very very generous tenancy. We don't have to worry about maintenance, costs...etc..!! It's all in the deal..!!

Given the choice which would you rather have?

A 50 year mortgage at £1200 per month and all the costs.

A 50 year lease at £250 per month from your millionaire mate to stay in his house, all expenses covered.

Don't state crap about passing the house down to dependants, this is a club! (Who's to say RL will even be being played professionally in 50 years)?


Oh and I'm 100% convinced that if we were ever served notice (which we won't) we would find the £25million for a new stadium within months anyway..!

Edge Hall Road is a pretty big asset on the Wigan balance sheet - Saints new stadium is still just aspiration for the moment.

As for the better players dig - the previous poster is on the money about the management situation, but its also a legacy of a supposed level playing field that Saints have been finding every risky loophole and fiddle possible to keep the team at the top. No surprises that since the tax loopholes were closed, there are now more outgoings at Saints than incomings. Good job you have some decent youngsters to fall back on for now, but don't tell me they are a straight substitute for the wages of Sculthorpe, Long, Gilmour, Cayless, Talau, etc, that will have disappeared over the last two years.

What the hell does that have to do with anything? Who is funding Stains new stadium?



A discussion about attendance revenues turns into a mystery valuation of a non-existant stadium

Think I would have the mortgage:

After 5 years I am going bankrupt, sell the house, get some residual value and I am saved.

After 5 years millionaire going bankrupt has to sell ground, tenant contract terminated, and as they say in the weakest link. "You go away with nothing".

So if Stains go bankrupt they can just sell off their shiney new stadium, bank the equity and all is well



Tenant contract terminated if DW goes "bankrupt" and sells the stadium?



Deary me today.

Trying to explain accounts to idiots....why do people bother?

The argument was income, which comes from multiple sources, not just crowds.

And the "mystery valuation" of which you speak is no such thing, the cost to build is £25million, so ergo, its worth £25million, simples?

Saints fund part of it, a sizable chunk coming from the sale of Knowsley Road, the council, Tesco, and McManus's back pocket.

£15, if you were on the ball, which is pretty cheap for what was a top class game of RL.

im not insulted either.
i was a sceptic about this "big one", but i was wrong and it was a good move.

the problem with wigan-saints games is that over the last few seasons we have played too many and its lost its appeal imo

i much prefer playing leeds now.

oh..and the OP must be one sad person for writing that article......and i thought i moaned a lot.
fellow deserves the title "moaner of the year"

For a start you need to take off the season tickets holders from both figures as they will have not paid those prices.

Another thing you need to do is compared the attendances against the same teams from last season to see what the true comparison is. When you've tried and failed to get your head around that simple principle, I'll show you the answer and how Wigan actually made money on the discounted ticket prices against Leeds.

I'm an auditor, what would I know about accounts?





I don't dispute that, so I'm not sure what you're getting at. I don't know how the stadium will be funded or how ownership will be divided up, but having a £25m new stadium on the balance sheet doesn't to equate to "income".



Nothing to do with ticket price/attendance revenues which was the direction of the thread. Infact I'm struggling to see what warranted a mention of Stains' unbuilt stadium