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| Only thing i can think of is Goulding has more SL experience than Ainscough as he was in the Wigan team for the first part of last year until we signed Gleeson. Then he went on loan to Salford where he did play very well on the wing before coming back to us.
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Quote ="Richard1"How long does Ainscoughs contract run for? Because it would not surprise me if he moved on upon completion of his present one after the lack of confidence shown by the Wigan coaching staff over the last 18 months. People seem to be more worried about the few weaknesses he has rather than the massive ability he has. Even Slater of Melbourne makes the odd mistake.'"
November 2011
wigan.rlfans.com/fusion_pages/in ... age_id=122
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Quote ="Richard1"How long does Ainscoughs contract run for? Because it would not surprise me if he moved on upon completion of his present one after the lack of confidence shown by the Wigan coaching staff over the last 18 months. People seem to be more worried about the few weaknesses he has rather than the massive ability he has. Even Slater of Melbourne makes the odd mistake.'"
November 2011
wigan.rlfans.com/fusion_pages/in ... age_id=122
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| Quote ="Cruncher"How do you know?
No. I said that you, who speculates plenty when it suits you, don't like other folk doing it if it's something you don't want to hear. Perhaps, rather than hearing possible explanations, you just prefer to imagine that the world is against Shaun Ainscough.'"
Too many posts to quote just one thing you have said but you are Spot on Crunch on EVERYTHING you say there on ALL issues.
End of the day MM made this decision, Yes or No?
We are 4 from 4 if I'm not mistaken?
Anyone has a right to their OPINION on this, but I'm the same as you Crunch. It does my head in when people want to state their opinion as FACT and when others state their opinion it's torn to shreds! Same goes as you say for Speculation on an issue!
In what way has ANYONE FROM THE WIGAN CLUB said that they don't want Ainscough to stay with Wigan?
Haven't we all agreed in the past that getting younger players to play at a Higher level than reserve Grade will benefit them & Us long term?
I think most of us are in agreement that we don't want Ainscough to leave the club however ATM playing Reserve grade isn't doing him much good?
MM has taken the decision not only to 1st of all send him on a Dual contract to Widnes but then to move him on to Cas to again play at a Higher Level when the opportunity came along.
I for one applaud that decision because although we may lose out short term I have no doubt long term it will benefit both himself & the Wigan club.
As Cruncher as said, MM MUST have his reasons for this and he will stand & fall by those decisions over a period of time. In this instance is he right or Wrong?
I think He's right, many others may think he's wrong.
One thing is for sure, IN EXACTLY THE SAME WAY as i said last year that BN should pick the team HE WANTS, then I say it again that MM should pick the team HE WANTS.
This is going to be a problem moving forward and it's a Problem I've been hoping we would have for a long time! A SQUAD that is big enough to cope with injuries etc and A SQUAD that has many versatile, flexible attributes that means if 1 player drops out we aren't significantly weaker in that or any other position because of it.
I say Well done to IL,BN & MM for achieving that over the last 2 x years?
What I will say is the same as the Prescott/O'Carroll issue, I would go for Prescott EVERY TIME!
It didn't stop me from getting behind O'C on Friday and even if he would have been picked over Prescott (Instead of Feka) I still would have come on here and given OC the praise he deserved for a Great Job well done.
If MM picks O'C on a regular basis over Prekky this season then I will take it on the chin and admit that Maybe, just maybe, a RL Coach with far more experience and knowledge than anyone on here MAY just know what he's doing a touch more than me!
I just wish some of those who are incredulous at MM's action in sending Goulding on loan could admit, that Maybe, just Maybe, MM knows what he's doing!
And as Crunch has said, when something happens/is said at the club that they don't want to hear, rather than believe that everyone else is wrong and only they are right, maybe they could just be a touch more Pragmatic and pause for a second and admit that Maybe the people who are making these decisions May know a touch more about the day to day issues leading to these decisions being Made?
Come the end of the season, I hope SA stays, 100%!
However, I would have picked Goulding at Wire, I would also have kept him in against Catalans.
Do I think Ainscough would have done any better, Don't know?
Maybe though MM thinks he would have but also feels that more 1st team experience under slightly less Pressure is the way to go with SA.
Long term, I think SA's future at Wigan is safe, If he can be patient, work hard, take a few knock backs and bounce bac from them stronger.
Maybe it's a test that MM thinks he needs?
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| Quote ="Richard1"How long does Ainscoughs contract run for? Because it would not surprise me if he moved on upon completion of his present one after the lack of confidence shown by the Wigan coaching staff over the last 18 months. People seem to be more worried about the few weaknesses he has rather than the massive ability he has. Even Slater of Melbourne makes the odd mistake.'"
TBH the whole coaching staff has changed so he can't hold that against us.
Every player will have a clean slate under MM so MM probably watched that game last night and thought I want that lad on my wing instead of Goulding and will watch the next few games for Cas and if he does well enough he will bring him back into the team.
IMO Pat Richards should be moved to centre if George Carmont gets injured and Ainscough outside of Richards so Pat can deal with the high balls or
If Deacon/Leuluai get injured Sam goes to 7, Phelps to 6, Roberts to 1 and Ainscough to 2.
There are going to be opportunities for Ainscough he just needs to carry on doing his best or Cas and wait for the opportunity to come along and grab it with both hands like Mossop did when he went on loan to Hudds, with Hock and Bailey out he got his chance and took it with both hands.
If it was up to me he would be on the wing instead of Goulding.
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| Daz gouldings contract is up at the end of this year. A present we have Goulding, Ainscough, Pryce Marsh and possibly even Thornley who can cover wing if we have injuries.
There is no way we can keep everyone happy and loans are the only real option.
Pryce can and will go at the end of the season for me.
We presently have Ainscough, farrell and davies out on loan with hints that Chris Tuson may also be going out on loan shortly.
I cannot remember a time in the recent past when we had so much depth to the squad.
The challenge is going to be keeping everybody happy.
The end of this season will be very interesting. At least 1 if not 2 props will go, and at least 1 if not 2 threequaters will go.
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| Quote ="Tricky Dicky"
The challenge is going to be keeping everybody happy.
The end of this season will be very interesting. At least 1 if not 2 props will go, and at least 1 if not 2 threequaters will go.'"
And maybe one hooker.
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| Quote ="Rogues Gallery"And maybe one hooker.'"
So you think we will be releasing Micky Mac then rogues?
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| Quote ="Tricky Dicky"So you think we will be releasing Micky Mac then rogues?'"
Rumours coming out of oz that Riddell wants to go back next year
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| I don't know whether Shaun would be prepared to wait this long, but if it were my choice on what to do, my plan would be to loan Ainscough out for the next two years similar to what Saints have done with Moore, so that he can then come into the team in two years time in place of a retiring Amos. That would be my way of dealing with the situation, however it all depend on whether Ainscough is willing to wait that long.
I'm sure with some reassurances by the club and a longterm contract in place he'd wait, especially if he was rejoining a successful Wigan side.
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| im MM and SW we trust
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| Quote ="LovesToSpooge"I don't know whether Shaun would be prepared to wait this long, but if it were my choice on what to do, my plan would be to loan Ainscough out for the next two years similar to what Saints have done with Moore, so that he can then come into the team in two years time in place of a retiring Amos. That would be my way of dealing with the situation, however it all depend on whether Ainscough is willing to wait that long.
I'm sure with some reassurances by the club and a longterm contract in place he'd wait, especially if he was rejoining a successful Wigan side.'"
I must admit I thought the same last night!!
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| Quote ="loobyfromorrell"Rumours coming out of oz that Riddell wants to go back next year'"
One of the quota list then, wouldn't be too bothered TBH. Half decent player with a decent rep but not done much in my eyes, no better than say Ben Fisher.
Cameron Smith perhaps?
IMO - if Deacon retires at the end of the season we bring in Danny Brough,
- if Riddell goes back to Aus the hooking duties shared between TL and MM
- if Riddell stays MM gets a 2 year deal but goes out on loan untill Riddell goes, in fact I would loan him to Wakey now once he gets back from injury as they could prob do with him and he could do with the game time playing superleague.
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| Quote ="post"One of the quota list then, wouldn't be too bothered TBH. Half decent player with a decent rep but not done much in my eyes, no better than say Ben Fisher.
Cameron Smith perhaps?
IMO - if Deacon retires at the end of the season we bring in Danny Brough,
- if Riddell goes back to Aus the hooking duties shared between TL and MM
- if Riddell stays MM gets a 2 year deal but goes out on loan untill Riddell goes, in fact I would loan him to Wakey now once he gets back from injury as they could prob do with him and he could do with the game time playing superleague.'"
He isent good enough for Wakefield.
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| Quote ="Panda Antics"Alot won't like this, but for the time being, I'm a lot happier with Ainscough playing away from Wigan than at Wigan, and until he sorts his defense out my opinion won't change.
That isn't to say I don't appreciate all the hard work he does in attack, and I'd love him to sort out the defensive aspect of his game because he will score tries, and he's clearly passionate about playing for Wigan, but for every couple of tries he gets, he costs the team one.
I'm in two minds about whether I even want him out on loan. He's clearly a try scorer, and doesn't lack confidence in attack, so it may be better to have him here, under the guidance of our coaches, who are clearly achieving wonders with the rest of the squad. That way, we can focus almost solely on his defensive game i.e. ability and confidence under the high ball, positioning and judgment of situations.
I know he needs game time, but if he continues to make the same mistakes, is it really beneficial him being away from our coaching staff?
I know this post is very harsh on him, and he did perform very well tonight, but a brilliant performance with ball in hand is too often let down by a howler in defense, normally costing the team a try.'"
If all his team mates did that every game that team would never ever lose a game.
It's a [size=200team[/size game for God's sake.
Just get off his back.
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| Funny isn't it - Ainscough scores a hat-trick and all some people want to do is overly focus on his defensive mistake.
Some of those people would be shouting for a first team start for Pryce had he had the same game.
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| Quote ="Wigan/Leeds Andy"Funny isn't it - Ainscough scores a hat-trick and all some people want to do is overly focus on his defensive mistake.
Some of those people would be shouting for a first team start for Pryce had he had the same game.'"
You are completely missing the point.
It's the same type of mistake he has been making for almost five years. I'm quite happy to let the coach decide who plays and who goes out on loan.
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| Quote ="Rogues Gallery"You are completely missing the point.
It's the same type of mistake he has been making for almost five years. I'm quite happy to let the coach decide who plays and who goes out on loan.'"
I'm not missing the point at all - I'm just pointing out the double standards some people have when discussing players.
Has anyone said they aren't happy for the coach to decide who goes where?
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| Quote ="Wigan/Leeds Andy"I'm not missing the point at all - I'm just pointing out the double standards some people have when discussing players.
Has anyone said they aren't happy for the coach to decide who goes where?'"
It's hardly double standards is it? Massive massive praise - he praises and posts some balance, Massive massive criticism - he posts some positives and acknowledges some limitations to. I'd call it trying to present a rounded opinion, about the only player i've ever seen Rogues post a non balanced opinion over is Rhys Evans
Ainscough is a fantastic talent, and long may he be a Wigan player - he has a few small issues in his game that need work (so does every single player including the experienced pros), but he's a cracking talent. I just hope he doesn't have his head turned by the small few who hail him as the messiah and demand he's in the team now - personally I don't think he will, I think he's level headed enough, and the current regime will look after him.
Currently him playing at Cas, in my opinion is the best for both parties.
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| Quote ="Steve Ella's Beard"It's hardly double standards is it? Massive massive praise - he praises and posts some balance, Massive massive criticism - he posts some positives and acknowledges some limitations to. I'd call it trying to present a rounded opinion, about the only player i've ever seen Rogues post a non balanced opinion over is Rhys Evans
Ainscough is a fantastic talent, and long may he be a Wigan player - he has a few small issues in his game that need work (so does every single player including the experienced pros), but he's a cracking talent. I just hope he doesn't have his head turned by the small few who hail him as the messiah and demand he's in the team now - personally I don't think he will, I think he's level headed enough, and the current regime will look after him.
Currently him playing at Cas, in my opinion is the best for both parties.'"
He's not the messiah, he's a very naughty boy! (he let a try in). [size=50even though he scored three.[/size
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| Quote ="Steve Ella's Beard"It's hardly double standards is it? Massive massive praise - he praises and posts some balance, Massive massive criticism - he posts some positives and acknowledges some limitations to. I'd call it trying to present a rounded opinion, about the only player i've ever seen Rogues post a non balanced opinion over is Rhys Evans
Ainscough is a fantastic talent, and long may he be a Wigan player - he has a few small issues in his game that need work (so does every single player including the experienced pros), but he's a cracking talent. I just hope he doesn't have his head turned by the small few who hail him as the messiah and demand he's in the team now - personally I don't think he will, I think he's level headed enough, and the current regime will look after him.
Currently him playing at Cas, in my opinion is the best for both parties.'"
Who said I was talking about Rouges? Unless he was outing himself - are you doing the same?
Mentioning Pryce seems to have touched a nerve with some.
In terms of Ainscough, I wouldn't have him in the team until he sorts out the brain farts in defence especially with the wingers we currently have ahead of him. However, no matter what he does (like scoring a hat-trick) there are some that are only too ready to focus on his known issues when they are all too ready to criticise people who do the same with other players.
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| Pryce will not be at Wigan in 2011.
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| Quote ="thepriestman85"This is the exact same type of post that keeps popping up regards Ainscough.
The kid has just scored 3 very good tries against a very good team. Not only that but he’s had another disallowed and was by far the most dangerous winger/back on the pitch making excellent yards on most of his kick returns but yet there are sly digs going in against him?
I actually think his kick on the last play was the right option as well and if he’d gone for the corner I’m sure there would also be other out there calling him greedy.
Again his attack far out ways his occasional flaw in defence which some on here go way OTT about.
Show me another 20 year old winger who can do what he can'"
Totally agree.
I don't get this talk about him not being good enough in defence and for every 2 or 3 trys he scores he'll let one in..............so what! He's young and inexperienced and will improve with gametime in the first team(wheather it be at Wigan or Cas). If somebody said to me 'he's going to score 3 trys a game but be at fault for one at the other end' would you take it? I'd bite their hand off especially when you consider he can iron out these flaws in time.
Whats his superleague first team record now? Something along the lines of 22 trys and 14 games(in all comps)?
I'm in total agreement with the people that say at the minute there isn't a way into our side when everybody is fit but what a player to have waiting in the wings! I just wish all our fans would back him instead on constantly picking out flaws.
I just hope we can keep him happy with these loan spells in a similar way to how Saints have with Scott Moore. It may be a few months or it may be a couple of years before this lad can find a spot in the team at Wigan but to lose him would be an awful blow.
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| Quote ="MadDogg"This is a huge problem for Wigan - some may say it is a nice problem but a problem it is.
I have constantly championed Phelps on these forums - in my opinion he will be the top fullback in Super League in 1-2 years. I believe it would be a disasterous decision to release him.
That being said, the talent of Ainscough is clear to everyone and who from Super League would you swap for Richards or Roberts at the moment?
Quite frankly I don't want any of the four to go anywhere and I want all of them in the side. But this would seem impossible. The suggestion of Phelps at centre is a poor one - he is wasted there. Maybe a small possibility could be a move to halfback for Phelps but like many now I prefer Leuluai at 7, not 9.
I haven't a clue what the club will do about the situation over the next few years.'"
It's a tough situation isn't it but I suppose it's better to have these problems then having no options in the first place.
I'm like you a huge fan of Phelps in the fullback position and he could go on to be an absolute gem in the position but I actually think we may have to pull him out of that spot and put him at left centre if we're to keep Ainscough. We simply can't afford to lose him and if that means Phelps playing a season at centre I think we'd have to roll with that. He could then be moved back to fullback when one of Roberts or Richards moves on.
It isn't ideal moving Phelps out of that fullback position though.
Another option would be to put Roberts at centre. He's played there in the past and would obviously bring a huge attacking threat from there but the question would have to be asked if his defence would be upto it.
Theres some thinking for Maguire to do over the next few months but one thing is for sure we have an embarrasment of riches in the outside back positions at the moment.
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| Natural finisher, and who knows how many he might have scored on Friday for us?
But in all seriousness, let him stay at Cas til the end of season barring any major injuries to our backline of Phelps, Richards and Amos and then bring him back for next season and let him fight for a place in the back 3.
Afterall, you cannot leave a player out with a try record like that for too long before he wants to leave the club and joins one of our rivals on a permanent deal.
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| Quote ="NickyKiss"
I'm in total agreement with the people that say at the minute there isn't a way into our side when everybody is fit but what a player to have waiting in the wings! '"
There are several ways in IMO. One is by squad rotation. Even in the backs I think if we carry on playing this really hard physical game we have started the season off with then if we stick with the first 17 barring injury or suspension (as Noble would have done) they will run out of steam by the end of the competition.
On Mike's board there is one well connected poster who insists Feka was not dropped but rotated and he will be back in v Bradford (so that will be interesting to see). I also think under a different coach HH's minor shoulder problem may have seen him selected with a pain killing injection.
I think we will see players come in for uninjured players r [layers with minor knocks like HH over the course of the season in a way we have not been used to seeing.
There is also another possibility and this is Roberts form on the wing drops off or Aincough "does an O'Carroll" and rips it up in training so he simply deserves a run out in the first team. The way some people seem to be posting Roberts place in the team is sacrosanct. I thought we were pleased we had ditched a coach who took that sort of view for one that ran a meritocracy?
I also don't like the idea of a season long lone for Ainscough for two reasons. First he will score a bag full of ties for one our rival teams and even if it is against our other rivals it will help Cas up the table. More importantly it sends the wrong message to Ainscough who might start to believe mischievous journalists that he doesn't have a future at the club.
Dave
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