This is so boring.

Has been on mine for 4/5 months...

You're right, it is. I am sick of having to repeat myself.

Then don't. Nobody is making you.

There is nothing you have been told that would allow you to draw the conclusion you have. Nothing. Saying that you are privy to information that does is presenting untruths as fact. I did not put words in your mouth. They are your own: "That opinion is based on what I've been told about his symptoms and the initial diagnosis."

I am fully aware that it is just your opinion. Did you somehow miss the numerous times I posted exactly that? If so I'll assume you have trouble reading or, more likely, are choosing to ignore it. That it is 'just your opinion' is exactly the point I have been making throughout this. It is no better or worse than anyone else's made up opinion.

As I said in the original post; if you choose to include your own posts in the "15 pages of bitterness, lies and accusations" then I have no issue with it.

I'm repeating myself again but it's only my opinion. To say I've drawn a conclusion would suggest I'm completely 100% convinced that Flower caused it or that I have been given evidence that suggests it's 100% his fault. I'm not saying that at all. So please stop saying I'm trying to claim any untruth is a fact when I'm not claiming anything is a fact.

Please don't compare that to people making up theories about saints needing to get him off the the books. The two situations are very different as we both know. So no, I don't add myself to the list of people with lies, bitterness and accusations.

I think we have flogged this one now. Other people are bored of it and I don't want this to descend into a slanging match. You seem to want to make me out to be a liar which I'm most certainly not but we aren't getting anywhere now.

Having power can also have its disadvantages.

I'm not making you out to be a liar at all. All I'm saying is your 'opinion' on this incident is just that. An opinion. I cannot for the life of me see how it is somehow immune from the same criticisms as the ones you are complaining about. It's made up and, at the time of writing at least, based on nothing but hearsay and supposition. It isn't elevated just because it's your made up opinion!

Anyway, I have no desire for a slanging match either. As you say, it's run it's course. Just for the record though, you can't repeatedly say that it is Flower's fault and then claim that you never said it was 100% his fault. This is being disingenuous. You would have had to say at some point that you thought he was 'partially at fault' or similar for this to wash.

I can't believe we are going over this again but having an opinion doesn't mean you are 100% certain. I don't understand how you can't understand that. I'm not being disingenuous and I'm not backtracking. It's my opinion that Flower's punch is the most likely cause but I'm not 100% certain; nobody is. Why can't you just accept that?

I can assure you my opinion is not just made up or based on hearsay. As I said earlier, people on here are aware that I regularly have info on the club long before it goes public.

Wigan fans accusing Saints of lying to get Hohaia off the salary cap are doing so for the same petty points scoring agenda that you've accused me of in the past. These aren't credible rumours or suggestions. I suspect you know that but you're pressing with the technicality of "their opinion is as valid as yours" even though we both know that in this instance it isn't.

Surely we can get this to 20 pages....

Can't believe this argument has gone on for three pages when you both agree. You both agree that it is currently an opinion and not a medical fact that Hohaia's retirement is caused by Ben Flower.

YG will want the last word, this will run and run...

YG = Boring

I wonder what reaction a Wigan fan would get if it was him/her that had posted everything I had tonight. In fact I don't wonder, I know.

No it won't..

No it won't..

No change there then.

He would be as boring as you! You need to take up knitting or something.

If you find this thread boring then why do you keep coming back just throw a few insults in? Leave us to it if you don't like it.

I should hold my hands up for this thread going off on one too. It's not just YG. Sorry everyone*














* may not contain an actual apology.

It's not the thread I find boring! I am not insulting or accusing you. It is just my opinion! Surely after 20 pages of repeating yourself you will understand the difference.

why doesn't every stop measuring each others privates and await any actual information from the club, players, or representatives IF anything like that is to occur.

wiganers will obviously want to protect ben, saints fans will obviously want to stand up for their club, their new signing and lance.

RL in general should be wishing lance the best and as fans that's all we should be doing on here now. the rest is up to those in question and no amount of "my mums better than your mum" is going to change that.

The repeating only started on about page 17!

I'm having the last word

Balls you are.