Not a chance O'Carroll makes more metres then Coley.

I like O'Carroll but he was too easily dealt wit last night and the other 4 looked far more of a threat.

Bloody ell Mathers!

Exactly.

Whenever Phelps makes an error this season people should always think 'it could be worse'.

Is Mossop looking like he's going to make the 1st choice 17 this year then?

I'd imagine so.

His challenge will come when Bialey comes back but if he keeps going like last night his place won't be under threat. He could hold down a second row or props shirt this season which helps him.

People don't seem to be considering Phil Bailey at all - apparently pretty much fully fit now.

The backline picks itself at the moment. Going off my belief that Riddell is our best starting 9 and that we need Leuluai on the field for 80 minutes considering he's a big attacking threat - its a straight choice between Deacon and Mcilorum for the bench. Mcilorum isn't fit right now anyway so Deacon would get the nod there. If Deacon excels we may have to look at adapting the line-up somehow so he can start but not yet for me.

At prop, its a simple selection in my opinion; the four have to be Fielden, Coley, Feka and Prescott. I'd probably start with Coley and Prescott again like last year but I doubt Maguire will go that way. Thinking of the squad as a whole you can't help even at this stage to think how complete the team could be in 2011 if we were to replace Coley and the other worst performing prop with a world class forward and Gareth Hock. Eamonn O'Carroll's long term future does not lie at Wigan in my opinion but he'll do a fine job for another Super League club.

For the backrow, I'd stick with Hansen and Tomkins with Mossop on the bench. Give Bailey a little more time to make sure he's completely right. When and if the time's right bring him back in but the English lads deserve a chance to cement their places at the start of the year.

Finally, just to mention Karl Pryce his chance will come a few games in I'm sure. Whether it be an injury or a change in tactic I'm sure he'll get a run but he has to take his chance now - he's running out of time. Darrell Goulding is another one whose future in all likelihood lies away from Wigan. Once again the opposition fans and pundits will sneer at Wigan releasing their own academy products conveniently ignoring the fact that if Wigan weren't around to provide the other clubs with the surplus players that we spend so much time and effort in developing, Super League would essentially be on life support.

Spot on assessment IMO.

Cameron Phelps
Amos Roberts
Martin Gleeson
George Carmont
Pat Richards
Sam Tomkins
Paul Deacon
Stuart Fielden
Thomas Leuluai
Andy Coley
Harrison Hansen
Joel Tomkins
Sean O'loughlin

----------------------------
Paul Prescott
Lee Mossop
Feka Paleaasina
Mark Riddell

Piggy Has to start
Tommy starts at 7 for me with Deacon maybe coming on after 1/2 hour or so.

Cameron Phelps
Amos Roberts
Martin Gleeson
George Carmont
Pat Richards
Sam Tomkins
Tommy Leaulia
Stuart Fielden
Mark Riddell
Andy Coley
Harrison Hansen
Joel Tomkins
Sean O'loughlin

----------------------------
Paul Prescott
Lee Mossop
Feka Paleaasina
Paul Deacon

As for the props, start any 2 of Prescott/Coley/Fielden with Feka on the Bench.

O'Carroll not big enough for me to get in starting 17 over any of those 4.

JS,
Agree with your team with the exception of leaving O'Carroll out. If we're going to pick on performance in the two "trial" games then IMO it would have to be O'Carroll ahead of Coley.

I understand your concerns about his physical size but he has given more to the side in those two games.

Phelps
Roberts; Gleeson; Carmont; Richards
S.Tomkins; Leuluai
O'Caroll; Riddel; Fielden
Hanson; J.Tomkins
O'Loughlin

S:Feka; Prescott; Mossop; Deacon

R: Coley; Bailey; Pryce; Goulding; Ainscough; McIlorum

Seems pretty obvious to me at the moment, we seem to be in a good position imo

I see no reason why Ben Davis should not be picked. IMO it would be the perfect game to give him a run out.

1. Without wanting to disrespect Celtic, they are (based on last year’s form) the poorest team in the league and it would be easier for him as opposed to the Leeds pack. They will also be rusty together as a squad as a fair few of their players have only recently joined.
2. It would give MM a chance to put the frighteners right up some of our forwards. They have all heard the pre-season rhetoric about players being picked on form as opposed to reputation. In fact a few of them have alluded to the new policy in interviews.
But!......... How many of them actually believe it?. They have heard the same talk from Noble over the last few years and it never materialised then...why should it now?
MM could shake them up right from the first game by setting a new precedent and selecting a young lad who could do a good job in front of the established members.
3. It will show Ben that there will be a place for him and give him the hunger to be in the team next week.
It could IMO opinion be a masterstroke of man management.

Don't totally disagree and TBH I don't think it should matter 1 jot which 4 of those 5 play against Celtic.
I just think that moving forward and playing to their potential Coley offers more short term and his mere physical size & Presence will help us out more than O'Carrol's undoubted enthusiasm.

Obviosuly if Coley's error rate/missed tackle count continues to be a problem then fair enough and TBH if O'C did get the nod over him it wouldn't bother me that much.
Saying that, moving forward, theres no way he will be better for Wigan than Prescott each given the same luck with injuries etc.

If it wasn't the 1st game of the New season and my belief that we need to go in full guns blazing then I would agree with you!
Unfortunately it is the 1st game and I think we need to respect them at this stage and go with our best team, in that case Davies doesn't get in.

i think that this would be a good idea because this is our first game of the season. Imagine the horror coley (for example) would feel to see a youngster picked before him for the the opening game of a new campaign. it could shake him right up and that could only be benificial to the team in the long run.

saying that though. i have no idea how Coley has perfomed during pre season training. for all i know he may have been the hardest grafter of the whole team and is just a little ring rusty. However if there are any niggling doubts about any of our props commitment from MM this could stamp it out before it becomes a problem.

This is all hypocetical of course, but it is big desisions like this i would like to see from the new and improved managment

i cant believe that riddell is going around again?
Leuluai would have been a great 9 next season with deacon playing at 7

How did Richards go against Wire, he was shocking against Wakefield in my opinion, if he did not have a strong game against Wire and MM is as good as his word then he may be under some significant pressure, especially with Phepls looking on good form with the boot.

Great post

And if one got injured? We can afford both in the squad and we have depth just incase. Riddell has been brilliant in the pre season friendlys, we have looked better with him at 9 than tommy.

Riddel is our best starting hooker :S

Especially if we learn not to have 3 winger scoots at the start of our first few sets in a match

Seems Riddell will have stick off opposition fans whatever he does.

Yesterday, because he passed the ball from the play the ball instead of scooting with it for abit some Wire fans near me were calling him lazy

guess they are used to one trick Mick by now though.

A lot better than against Wakey, I also thought Carmont in tandom struggled at Wakey and our Left side defence has struggled far more in pre season than our right for me.

I am sure Carmont & Richards will sort it out and both will start the season. If things go anywhere near to plan then there are others who will be under far more pressure than Richards in the Short to Medium term.

I'm sure when we all spoke about players being picked on form last year even the most un-patient fan wasn't calling for guys to be dropped after an iffy preformence or 2 in pre season. They're trial games to get peoples fitness up and even though you want players to look like they're somewhere near the money skills wise it's not the be all and end all. Some players just need competative rugby.

Since the Wakefield game i've read on here that Phelps should be under pressure and then unbelievably read that Sam Tomkins could be under pressure if he didn't up his preformence from Wakey and now mentions of Richards having to up it from Wakefield aswell.

I'm just waiting for the criticisim to come Maguires way after 3 or 4 games if we've struggled at any point and he's not dropped 4 or 5 players.

Or it could be better. I really don't get this "he's the best we have got" or "he had a good season in 2009" justification of his place in the side. He was shaky in defense last season and if he remains shaky in defense it's an issue that needs sorting out as soon as possible. Being better than Mathers is no great recommendation either.

I am sure he will start the season as our full back but if he proves not good enough his "body on the line 100% effort approach" won't save him from being dropped IMO.

As to the rest of the side isn't Prescott still recovering from an injury? If so the props pick themselves. The half back hooker situation looks interesting because if Deacon gets a chance at 7 and does better than Tommy then it's how best to use TL, Riddell and McIlorum. Good competition for places here.

It's good to hear Roberts has seemingly found some pace because I don't think our wingers and centres worried anyone for pace last season (meaning the senior players we expect to play).

Dave

Good points but I don't think MM will do this.

One of the reasons he got the job was IL was as fed up as the rest of us with the poor starts to the season. It's therefore a high priority for MM to ensure we get off to a good start and he won't risk sending out anything but his strongest side for that reason IMO.

Later on in the season if we have got that good start and are well placed I am sure MM will give the younger players a go for the reasons you state. I also don't think we will wait long to see players dropped if he doesn't get a good start. I don't expect him to "do a Noble" and stick with under performing players just as I don't expect him to ignore the need to give younger players game time at some point.

I just don't see the game against the Crusaders as the right time to do this.

Dave