Dont start that, your getting me all excited

Thought he spoke very well generally. Seems a very clued up and even handed summarizer. His comments on O'Loughlin were very revealing, I thought, coming from a fellow player (as opposed to the guff we often get from some fans!)

RLFANS going into meltdown or the "possibility" of us winning a trophy?

Both would be a joy to watch

I know all the focus is on the alleged tackling techinque being 'not in the spirit of the game' (M.Potter-post Good Fri game) ... but what has been failed to be mentioned is that we have scored 40 more points than the nearest team Warrington & 61 more than the so called Entertainers Saints ... Team P W D L F A PTS 1 Wigan 10 9 0 1 350 128 18 2 Warrington 10 8 0 2 310 124 16 3 St Helens 10 7 0 3 289 184 14 news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/rugby_l ... efault.stm Should coaches not stop whinging on about us 'strangling' the game & concentrate on how to stop us in attack??

I know all the focus is on the alleged tackling techinque being 'not in the spirit of the game' (M.Potter-post Good Fri game) ... but what has been failed to be mentioned is that we have scored 40 more points than the nearest team Warrington & 61 more than the so called Entertainers Saints ... Team P W D L F A PTS 1 Wigan 10 9 0 1 350 128 18 2 Warrington 10 8 0 2 310 124 16 3 St Helens 10 7 0 3 289 184 14 news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/rugby_l ... efault.stm Should coaches not stop whinging on about us 'strangling' the game & concentrate on how to stop us in attack??

Early days and we have Quins on Saturday . . . .

And we have them 2 weeks later

from the teams we have both played.

Wigan Saints
Castleford 36-22 52-18
Warrington 22-20 28-18
Crusaders 38-6 37-30
Hull KR 32-6 24-28 (saints lost)
Wakefield 54-14 22-16
Catalans 58-0 42-12
Bradford 20-22(wigan lost) 38-6
Hull FC 48-24 12-32 (saints lost)

in the 8 games wigan aggregate score is 308-114
saints score is 243-160

so wigan have scored 65 more points and let in 46 less. so i dont think you can argue that saints have played harder sides thats why we have scored more.

in addition, the two teams wigan have played that saints have been leeds and saints themselves, the two top sides of that last 5 years. saints have played Huddersfield and wigan, two sides that are on the up and looking to break the saints-leeds lead.

i would say that the first 10 games for each side have been very equal, so it is nice to see we are ahead on points, points scored and better off on points against.

My my - you are a touchy lot arn't you - especially considering your league position. I think he raises a fair point about the slowing the PTB down - more a comment on the way the game is going in general than about just Wigan. Wakey, like most other teams this year are adopting this 3 - 5 men in a tackle technique, and I agree that it is making for a poorer spectacle and something that needs addressing.

Maybe his comments about the atmosphere were a bit petulant, but be fair, the man has just watched the fruit of all his recent labours turned into an absolute drubbing for his team and a fair few of you lot have agreed the atmosphere wasn't at its usual standards.

Re the supposed instructions to the subs - I have been told by a few coaches to go out and "give teams hell" or words to that effect - and wise words as well for a prop forward, you want him to go and get physical, that's what he's there for. I doubt he meant "go and take their heads off" - again just a bit of paranoia creeping in here I feel.

Anyway no matter its done now, GL for rest of season - looking forward to having someone other than leeds at the top come the end of the season.

The issue re. the atmosphere was pretty well the cheapest of cheap shots. The polish was taken off the second half for most Wigan fans, as there was widespread concern about the injury to Roberts. In addition, the game was over by half time. It's human nature that you're not going to celebrate wildly under those circumstances. Kear is long enough in the tooth to know that and, given his track record of graciousness and intelligent comment, I'd have expected something a lot less churlish from him.

And I still don't get it about Wigan games being a poorer spectacle. From a Wigan fan's POV, the action was fast, smooth and exciting; we're currently scoring some of the most spectacular tries that we've seen from our team in the last ten years. And even in the games when we're not running away with it - Warrington away for example, Saints away - you can hardly say those were boring affairs.

You've got to forgive us if we sound a bit cynical that these complaints about 'boring rugby' seem mainly to be coming from coaches whose sides we've just thrashed.

The funny thing is is that if some of the idiots accusing us of 'lying on' actually watched our tackling techneque they would see we're actually up and off the tackle a good second earlier than most teams.....thats what makes it frustrating seeing all the penalties given away for 'lying on' as the referees are playing up to the media and coach bashing of wigan.

What we actually do to slow the attack down is dominate the tackle areas and ruck and manouver the man as he is actually GOING down in the tackle, into a position whereby he is either on his back, or facing sideways, and so the ptb actually takes the ATTACKER longer than it usually would as he isnt in a natural position to jump back up and PTB. Thus giving the defensive line more time to get back LEGITIMATELY, because simply we have DOMINATED the ruck!! Its great play and as far from CHEATING as you can get- just excellent defensive RL.

Ironically if every team in SL did this we'd actually have a league we could be proud of like the NRL, where it actually takes skill to score rather than relying on the defensive failings of other teams!!

Youd think that the supposed SL coaches would realise this rather than crying that we lie on!!!





We're actually up off the tackler once the tackle is complete faster than the majority of teams beacause we are also phyically fitter than most, which again is why we are dominating the ruck areas!

Its simple RL played well, as are all of the tries we're putting on. Coaches like John Kear have gone down massively in my estimation. Always rated him as a decent coach but he just sounds like an idiot!

John Kear, Shaun McRae et all are the Alex Murphy's / Maurice Bamford's & John Dorahay's of the 80/90's. Limited coaches with prehistoric tactics and skill sets - only to be found out when new, younger and successful coaches from the NRL come along.

Don't know if it's been mentioned already put Paul Cullen made an interesting comment on Boots'n'All tonight , he said Wigan are only doing what every other coach is trying to do, but better , if they were doing anything illegal then they would be being penalised out of the game and they aren't and you can be sure that Stuart Cummings band of Refs would have been studying the tapes of tackling techniques...Also he mentioned that Wigan were already 6-0 up before they had completed a tackle against Wakefield so it wasn't anything to do with the tackling which put Wakey on the back foot (or words to that effect)

Cullen got it spot on.

The media and other coaches are going to bang this drum, because they are scared to death of Wigan returning to the top.

We scored 54 points against Wakefield, and at least two of those tries will be in the top ten tries this year.

Coaches of other teams are starting to realise that they have failed to capitalise during Wigan's period on the down and now they realise that they have missed out now that Wigan are on the up again. Sour grapes, period.

Are you for real? They are banging the drum because they are questioning whether it is in the spirit of the game (personally I think it does make for a poorer spectacle but if it's within the rules then fine) not through any fear of Wigan rising to the top and creating the sort of stranglehold you used to have on the game - Salary cap has put paid to that sort of thing.

IF we are playing boring rugby why are we top of the points chart and 2nd in defence, its not like we are winning games 12-6

weve scored the most points and have the 2nd best defence so how you can come up with it being a poorer spectacle is beyond me! the only reason i can see for you saying this is because you were on the recieving end of a beating from us.

Are you for real? What matches have you seen with Wigan in this year? You're having a laugh! I can't believe so many people listen to billy bullshiners who come up with absolute tripe about 'poorer spectacle' and adopt it as their own opinion.

That's true. There is something vaguely sheep-like the way they're all lining up to bleat.

Can I just say that it is *ONLY* a "poorer spectacle" to you, the opposition fans, because your team has no idea how to cope with top-class defensive play.

The job of the defense is to STOP THE OPPOSITION FROM SCORING - Simple isn't it?

As previously stated, we actually take LESS time to get off the attacking player, all because we have already wrestled him in to a submissive position whilst he was still on his feet (i.e. tackle not completed).

That means that he lands on his back (or at best, his side) and we either get a dominant tackle (giving more time to get up - if we want it) or he has has to turn around, flip himself over and THEN get to his feet and PTB.

Whilst this is going on, our defensive line is already lined up and waiting to make the NEXT hit.

None of this is "illegal" or even "against the spirit" of any rules.

We are simply playing an extremely good, NRL-style game......
Build pressure with solid, compressed defence until the opposition tires and cracks in their defensive line start to show.

Unfortunately for Wakefield last week, no pressure was required - You crumbled straight from the off.

As for the "spectacle" that Wigan offer - Frankly, we've had to put up with playing a fairly similar game to Wakefield for the past few years (coincidence that it's another so-called "top" British coach that planned/caused it?) and I would far rather watch the "boring", "paint-drying" rubbish that Mike Maguire serves up than *ANY* of the "free-flowing", "attractive" stuff that Mr Noble had us playing. ***

Again, as previously pointed out, defence is not the only aspect to our game - We have the BEST ATTACK in the league at this point.
How can this possibly *NOT* lead to providing a top-class spectacle?

Frankly, coaches (and supporters) of clubs that are incapable of coping with our play-style need to think *FAR* more about how they can improve to catch up and stop worrying about how much damage Wigan's free-flowing attack + solid defence is doing to our game.

*** To clarify any possible confusion, the marked paragraph contained sarcasm.

Spot on


Can any fan, or coach for that matter, show me a PTB that we take or get longer at than any other team? In fact with all the media and moaning pointed our way we probably get less time before we are penalised.
The wrestle is done while still stood up it's about positioning yourself and the tackled player before you take the tackle down into completion. How can you penalise that? If your team completes a dominant hard tackle to me it's just the same as good attack and draws the same appreciation from the crowd . I would say we even target sets this year, were we pick up the defensive intensity and I for one love it.
This is different to Huddersfield last year, they often slowed the play down by lying one defensive player on top of the other, with often three players in the completed tackle then peeling off one by one, it was sorted out as the year went on and in co the form dipped at the year end .
All this shows how we lag behind the NRL and what we are doing this year they have done already. The calls from Kear for two refs are probably correct, not for the reason he thinks though. That wont affect us as we are in control before the tackle is completed, the two refs are being used in the NRL to look for delaying the PTB(after the tackles completed) and keeping the players onside. If you look at the NRL the hookers are not scooting 30 times a game they are an extra half, take a look at the top nines and the style they are moving towards, just the one, often creative or even putting an half back in.
Is the NRL boring? do they produce creative great to watch players? Why? instead of trying to stop progress we should encourage it or it will be forty more years before we challenge at international level.

Fantastically well put.

Saved me a job.

[url=http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/rugby_league/super_league/8607500.stmIN THIS INTERVIEW[/url John Kear admits Wigan dominated every aspect of the game.