Can either of those sides win a game missing 10 players?

I feel we have gone for depth as opposed to quality but with constant injury issues we spend most of the season missing our quality.

Correct. What was said was people need to understand that the youn players wages have to go up to keep them. Rads used kpp as an example. For Wigan to get kpp on a new deal it will be 4 times his current salary. Imagine Wigan saying no where not giving younthat, then he leaves. And the Lenegan gets in in the neck for being tight which is a complete fallacy unless your stupid or blind.

So we can only presume that havard,byrne,partington ect.. have had similar deals and hallsall,mcdonnell,hanley,oneill ect.. will be upcoming. We could just let all these go and buy journey men, then complain about that.

Lets all be happy as from now the person holding us back has gone.

New season soon be here with a new coach eager to impress.

Ok so i'm reading between the lines and joining a few dots. But what was said at the forum was that the young lads all want 100k deals or will leave....we've given said young lads upgrades recently. Doesn't take a rocket scientist to work out what said lads are likely to be on.

As for another poster's comment on Byrne, that he'll be a great player....hes about the worst front rower ive seen at wigan since ricky bibey...Ball retention is as poor as Paul Prescott's was....but at least prekie was probably the hardest runner in the team and had a reason for it....Bryne sometimes starts off going backwards...he's wakefield standard at best!

Depends on your opinion. Personally i think its clear the issues are a lot deeper routed than lam. i actually feel sorry for Lam. He's been made to coach with his hand behind his back, had signings forced on him, ended up with no pack, no choice over signings, no investment to bring in new blood when we've been decimated by injury, then been held accountable because he hasn't been able to work wonders with it!!

What Edwards said was timely when you apply it to Lam's situation. Wigan don't really want a head coach......they want a lad to take charge of training whilst they make all the decisions, then someone to blame when it all goes pete tong!

no it wasn't.


KR: This is probably a little bit of education – we offer a traditional contract when a player comes to the end of his Academy contract; it’s a two-year contract with a one-year option. Most players get that kind of deal. After that third year, we then have a choice to make. Do we let them go or do we pay them what they what they should be paid on an open market. These players have all got managers now and the managers are trying to get the best for them. We’ve opted to pay them what they’re worth. So, if you look at the likes of Ethan Havard, Liam Byrne, Morgan Smithies, Oliver Partington. We’ve chosen to keep them on and develop them more so in two to three to four years’ time, they’ll be the corner stones of our pack.

Now, I’d like to ask you the question, is that the right thing to do? To retain these lads? Or should or should we be letting them go knowing that we we can’t afford to pay them? What would you do there? Do we do we retain them or let them go? We’ve got conversations that we will need to have with Kai Pearce-Paul soon, you know, Kai’s obviously set the Super League on fire this year, but his manager will come knocking very, very soon. And you will still get the same Kai Pearce-Paul, but his salary might be four times more. So, if I’m sat where you are from a Wiganer’s point of view, you don’t see the fact that we might have to pay him three or four times more. You just see the one player and that’s the challenges that we’ve got to overcome.

We believe we’ve got the history of developing and promoting our young players. That’s what we build our cornerstones on. It’s something I’m extremely proud of that other professional sports look at the development of our players and the fact that two thirds of our squad are homegrown, it’s unique in sport, and it’s a business model that we’ll stick to and that’ll always drive us forward. But it’s very important that you understand that when a player signs a long-term extension is great news, it also means we’re going to always start having to pay them properly. And that’s something that has worked for us in the past, but you need to understand.

Except those that he asked to sign and then never played.

He did mention that agents will come knocking asking for 100k but I think it was more a figure than confirmation than Byrne, Smithies etc being on 100k.

I’d be shocked if players like Havard, Byrne, Smithies are on more than £50k a year at present.

Most deals for young players tend to go up year on year.

If it's 3 or 4 times their existing salary I can see a base salary for a first teamer fresh out of the academy being around the 20k mark, so maybe Bryne , Havard, Smithies, Partington are on around 50k to 70k? Not exactly breaking the bank is it?

whilst i think the majority will agree that we have suffered in the backs all season, losing French, Manfredi, Field etc for good parts if not all of the season, i have to disagree regarding the pack

he has had 4 1st team props sat on the bench virtually all season. that isnt through injury for the most part, but just not picking them. he has flogged the young forwards this season, to the point that they are probably close to burn out. Even if they are out of form, playing 2 or 3 of the recognised starting props will have taken so much pressure off the younger players. How can a pack with an average age of 20-21, compete against the Saints pack with predominantly seasoned professionals (and big ones at that). We played Catalan last week with 3 of the 4 props, and look at the result

Baffling decisions about who has played full back, hooker etc, all point to a coach making decisions cos he doesnt know what to do

so i can say i dont feel sorry for Lam, yes there are certainly far bigger issues than just Lam as coach, but some of the decisions he has made this year are just baffling

No but their salaries will go up year on year.

Shorrocks, KPP will be next.

It’s just too many forwards, all at a similar level getting upgraded / inflated contracts at the same time.

For me we should only really have two young props, two young second towers at the same time. We actually have 3 props and 3 second rowers all first team regulars

Aye. Something stinks rotten and the stench is coming from the skeletons in the boardroom closet.

My personal feeling is that it's number 1 as in the fans forum they pleaded poverty starting that they're £450 grand worse off a season, while also stating that we offered Williams our largest ever contract. You can't have both.

If Byrne, Shorrocks, Smithies and Partington are on £100k each that’s shocking and no wonder our side looks weak on paper. I’m sure that’s not the case.
Havard I can understand because there was interest from plenty of other clubs including the NRL and I’m sure he’s a potential star in the making.

It’s easy to jump on this and get angry but honestly I can’t see it being the case, even with Havard. £50k each tops.

What are the cap rules? First 25 only count on the cap or does everyone count if they've played first team rugby?

Why not?

I agree, we need to start being ruthless like Saints are

Made to coach with his hands tied behind his back? Really ha ha ha hes not coached anything to anyone. Hes made us gradually worse.

He wanted to sign Sammutt and Lenegan backed him. Then Lam didnt pick him

End of the day, lam is gone and we are a better team already by the fact he isnt here.

Its not breaking the bank no, but it all has to be fitted into the cap doesn’t it? 3 or 4 players getting 20k extra is another average players value. French and hastings both got pay rises last year which basically meant we ran with a player less this year.

Maybe we should just let the young lads go elsewhere then complain when it happens?

It’s a fine balancing act for sure. Damned if you let young lads go and damned if you keep them and don’t sign more experienced players. Lam played a huge part in it looking so unbalanced IMO by putting out full packs of kids when he could’ve got guys like Bullock and Clark in there. Having 2 or 3 kids in is great but having 6 young forwards in your 17 for a play off tie is overkill.

Ultimately it’s about firstly keeping your best kids and then choosing the best ones to be in your first 17. I look at them all and Havard, Smithies and Pearce-Paul are the stand outs for me and are ones I’d see as first 17 players next season. The likes of Partington, Byrne and Shorrocks are good lads and decent players and all have places in a squad but realistically they should be around your squad positions 18-23 IMO and should be pushing for starting places. All will improve and get better over the years but only in the right environment. Having them all in at once is hurting us and hurting them. Byrne should be fighting Havard for a spot, KPP should be fighting Shorrocks and Partington should be fighting Smithies and all driving each other on. They should not be all playing side by side in a superleague pack, not yet. That should be the aim for 3 or 4 years time but it’s far too early. The club takes some blame for that being the case but Lam had a weird fetish for putting them all in. I trust Peet and Wanes knowledge of developing youngsters to not over burden them all as part of the same pack next season, unless it’s an absolute emergency. It has to be the first priority going in to 2022.

As I said, I don’t believe that to be true.

The gospel according to IL and KR maybe...but I hope we get to hear lams story just like we’ve heard the more accurate one from Edwards!
The ‘fans forum’ that was nothing but a damage limitation exercise where they attempted to spin the truth, absolve themselves and scapegoat lam for their own failures. anyone can see the problems go a lot deeper than lam!

How do you hold a coach accountable who gets no choice of players or investment in the team? Given IL & KR pick all the players I find the sammut ‘story’ unlikely! More likely is IL thought he was getting a superstar and lam didn’t rate him. Would love to hear from lam on it!

After listening to Lam's after match comments I wouldn't put any value on his view of Wigan Rugby League.

Remind me why we should be more like Warrington?

You can always trust them to cheer you up a little. I thought we were bad last night but wow, this is different level.