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I thought it was common knowledge that Wigan are the greatest evil in the universe since the Galactic Empire under the reign of Emperor Leneghan & Darth Wane. The Saints rebels may have destroyed our Death Star today, but rest assured that barring a miraculous transfer from Leeds, there will be no Ewoks to help them defeat us once and for all.
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The thing that annoys me with this is that from the age of 6 these were the exact sentiments expressed by every single coach I have ever played under. Phrases like "smash em", "rip them apart" and "break them" are not unusual and do people really think that in a top game anyone goes out in a rugby game with words of care ringing in their ears from the coach?
I can see the England dressing room or even the St Helens dressing room for the internationals/WCC where the coaches are extolling the virtues of not trying to physically dominate and hurt the other side. Good luck beating the Aussies.
Then there's the thug/coward phrases. To me these are used for intended malicious play, Flower is guilty of seeing red and stupidly lashing out twice after receiving treatment that could have easily broken his jaw. Not a pre-meditated attack or a sneaky dig with others around which for me fall into the thug and coward category. You would think, on these forums, that not a single one of us has lost their temper and done something stupid.
I have seen players gouge, stamp, flying kick and on one occasion smash somebody over the head with their boots having run on from the side line. It doesn't take a great deal of looking on the web to find examples of simple pre-meditated dirty play:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pxW2Q63CQSA
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yj57GvEj2DI
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VWqvmGddkyw
I expect to see Flower get a long ban, Flower will have to live with the sending off which probably cost Wigan the game for the rest of his life. Is he a thug? No. A coward? No. If his stats are anything to go by, that's a yellow card this year before last nights red. Sine Die - don't be ridiculous!
www.superleague.co.uk/matchday/player/3237
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The thing that annoys me with this is that from the age of 6 these were the exact sentiments expressed by every single coach I have ever played under. Phrases like "smash em", "rip them apart" and "break them" are not unusual and do people really think that in a top game anyone goes out in a rugby game with words of care ringing in their ears from the coach?
I can see the England dressing room or even the St Helens dressing room for the internationals/WCC where the coaches are extolling the virtues of not trying to physically dominate and hurt the other side. Good luck beating the Aussies.
Then there's the thug/coward phrases. To me these are used for intended malicious play, Flower is guilty of seeing red and stupidly lashing out twice after receiving treatment that could have easily broken his jaw. Not a pre-meditated attack or a sneaky dig with others around which for me fall into the thug and coward category. You would think, on these forums, that not a single one of us has lost their temper and done something stupid.
I have seen players gouge, stamp, flying kick and on one occasion smash somebody over the head with their boots having run on from the side line. It doesn't take a great deal of looking on the web to find examples of simple pre-meditated dirty play:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pxW2Q63CQSA
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yj57GvEj2DI
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VWqvmGddkyw
I expect to see Flower get a long ban, Flower will have to live with the sending off which probably cost Wigan the game for the rest of his life. Is he a thug? No. A coward? No. If his stats are anything to go by, that's a yellow card this year before last nights red. Sine Die - don't be ridiculous!
www.superleague.co.uk/matchday/player/3237
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Fed up of reading Hohaia did this and that. Wane wound them up. Wigan are a disgrace.
Fact is second punch Flower threw when Hohaia was unconcious on the ground was probably the worst incident I have seen in more than 50 years of watching professional Rugby League.
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| Quote ="Brian Briggs Ghost"Fed up of reading Hohaia did this and that. Wane wound them up. Wigan are a disgrace.
Fact is second punch Flower threw when Hohaia was unconcious on the ground was probably the worst incident I have seen in more than 50 years of watching professional Rugby League.'"
Nobody is disagreeing the second punch was horrendous, it was and he will get what's coming. All I've said and seen others say is Hohaia got what he deserved with the first shot. It's not Flowers fault that Hohaia has a glass jaw, guess it's St Helens glass? If he'd taken it and given one back they'd have both been in the bin.
The punch while he was on the floor was unforgivable, I don't ever want to see that again, not by any player let alone a Wigan player. Again nobody is trying to defend punching a guy on the floor, not at all, I condemn it as much as any other person. |
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| Quote ="headhunter"
If Hohaia was a 17 stone prop and not a halfback he would've broken Flower's jaw.'"
What sickens me about this thread is all the condemnation thrown at Flower which is rightly so and deserved sending off .Just look at all the smiling SAINTS fans in the picture taking delight in HoiHoi throwing his elbow into Flowers jaw. |
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| Quote ="jaws1"What sickens me about this thread is all the condemnation thrown at Flower which is rightly so and deserved sending off .Just look at all the smiling SAINTS fans in the picture taking delight in HoiHoi throwing his elbow into Flowers jaw.'"
 how do you know they are watching that particular player? It was off the ball so they could have been following play. Looks like a desperate attempt to try to put a 'context' to Flowers sickening thuggery. |
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| Quote ="CM Punk"I thought it was common knowledge that Wigan are the greatest evil in the universe since the Galactic Empire under the reign of Emperor Leneghan & Darth Wane. The Saints rebels may have destroyed our Death Star today, but rest assured that barring a miraculous transfer from Leeds, there will be no Ewoks to help them defeat us once and for all.'"
  Nice sense of humour in defeat, good show. |
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| Quote ="ChrisA"Nobody is disagreeing the second punch was horrendous, it was and he will get what's coming. All I've said and seen others say is Hohaia got what he deserved with the first shot.'"
The first shot was fair game. Man to man plus a coming together just before, I don't think anyone is too irate about that. It's just obviously the second one where flower has taken it to another level. |
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| Quote ="FlexWheeler"The first shot was fair game. Man to man plus a coming together just before, I don't think anyone is too irate about that. It's just obviously the second one where flower has taken it to another level.'"
Definitely, he's lost Wigan the game, he could have potentially caused serious or permanent damage to Hohaia, it's been viewed all around the world by now and doesn't look good for Flower, Wigan and RL in general.
It's a shame as it taken the attention away from a great effort by saints with all their injuries, it's taken away from Wigan effort for 78 minutes with 12 men. The other guys who were on the field don't deserve to be labelled with flower as thugs, there weren't any other incidents in the game. |
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| Quote ="FlexWheeler"The first shot was fair game. '" so you are now an authority on thuggery? Please explain the rules..when does it turn from fair game to thuggery, who ACTUALLY got the ADVANTAGE from cheating? .. |
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| Quote ="Mash Butty"so you are now an authority on thuggery? Please explain the rules..when does it turn from fair game to thuggery, who ACTUALLY got the ADVANTAGE from cheating? ..'"
Really, you can't tell the difference between being stood up face to face, and someone being uncocncious on the floor?
Sainst got the advantage from wigan's cheating. |
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What Ben did was stupidity and cowardly and he deserves a long ban, but how did lance get away with a fore arm smash to Bens chin, super league should look at that incident as well. there were some cheap shots by saints at start of game which did not help.
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| Quote ="FlexWheeler"Really, you can't tell the difference between being stood up face to face, and someone being uncocncious on the floor?
Sainst got the advantage from wigan's cheating.'"
So let me get this right Saints didnt cheat in that passage of play? please explain |
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| Quote ="asmadasa"d040.gif how do you know they are watching that particular player? It was off the ball so they could have been following play. Looks like a desperate attempt to try to put a 'context' to Flowers sickening thuggery.'"
If you think that mate you should go to Specsavers the direction of their eyes gives that away. |
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| Quote ="Mash Butty"So let me get this right Saints didnt cheat in that passage of play? please explain'"
flower had a dig at lance off the ball, lance pushed back. What flower did next could have killed hohaia. |
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| Quote ="FlexWheeler"flower had a dig at lance off the ball, lance pushed back. What flower did next could have killed hohaia.'" so causal the first offence, its as though it never happened, play on |
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First up, Flower should get a lengthy ban and the red card was correct (a really easy decision for the ref).
My question is, would he have got a straight red for the first punch if he hadn't followed through with the second (totally unacceptable) one? I suspect that he would have. It would have been a more difficult decision though. I wouldn't have argued if he had.
The incident shows how split seconds can change games. If Flower picks up the knock on cleanly it's difficult to see how he wouldn't have scored (pretty close to the posts as well). As it stands, he didn't and seconds later the game has gone for Wigan and he will carry the incident around with him for the rest of his career.
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I think I have read all the posts on this now its getting boring thread. What do we think will be Flowers punishment? Taking everything into account and what happened with Ben Westwood at last years GF I think it will be 4 match ban, which will include pre season matches. Will Lance "goodnight" Hohaia get a ban?
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If calling someone a fag gets you 5 matches, then Flower should get at least 10.He'd be looking at 4 for the first punch alone given the RFL's clamping down on attacks to the head this season
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| Quote ="ISpeaksProperEnglish"I think I have read all the posts on this now its getting boring thread. What do we think will be Flowers punishment? Taking everything into account and what happened with Ben Westwood at last years GF I think it will be 4 match ban, which will include pre season matches. Will Lance "goodnight" Hohaia get a ban?'"
That is the big question.
Will the RFL protect Bentham and not charge Hohaia. He made direct contact to the head of an opponent and that is a red card and should get 1-2 games for it. Both should have got sent off and Flower should be looking at a 8 game ban minimum for the 2 punches. |
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Will prob get man of steel next year for that cause he a pie.
Sky sports bias commentators last night a disgrace , we are only used to that nob Clarke but they were all at it.
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| Quote ="AJC"If calling someone a fag gets you 5 matches, then Flower should get at least 10.He'd be looking at 4 for the first punch alone given the RFL's clamping down on attacks to the head this season'"
Quote ="ISpeaksProperEnglish"I think I have read all the posts on this now its getting boring thread. What do we think will be Flowers punishment? Taking everything into account and what happened with Ben Westwood at last years GF I think it will be 4 match ban, which will include pre season matches. Will Lance "goodnight" Hohaia get a ban?'"
Both trying to be impartial - what happens to hohohoho? does his elbow to head connection get over looked? concussion suffiicient? |
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| Quote ="joshua102"Will prob get man of steel next year for that cause he a pie.
Sky sports bias commentators last night a disgrace , we are only used to that nob Clarke but they were all at it.'"
thats rich, I'm sure this isn't a trolling thread |
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| Quote ="jaws1"What sickens me about this thread is all the condemnation thrown at Flower which is rightly so and deserved sending off .Just look at all the smiling SAINTS fans in the picture taking delight in HoiHoi throwing his elbow into Flowers jaw.'"
to be fair to the saints fans their smiling and laughing at the fact flower just knocked on and bombed a try. |
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| Quote ="Mash Butty"Both trying to be impartial - what happens to hohohoho? does his elbow to head connection get over looked? concussion suffiicient?'"
Unfortunately (for Flower) retaliation seems to be punished harder than the initial offence, just ask JP against Leigh. Hohaia should at the very least get called up to give his version of events but given the events that superseded the initial foul I doubt he will. |
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how do you know they are watching that particular player? It was off the ball so they could have been following play. Looks like a desperate attempt to try to put a 'context' to Flowers sickening thuggery.
Nice sense of humour in defeat, good show.
