This, I don't think Wane would be able to have done what he has without Maguire laying the foundations. Wane will have also learnt a huge amount from Maguire. I'm a huge fan and he is without doubt a great (I don't use that word often) coach for us but the best ever? That would be a big call.

Look at the team Maguire won the GF with compared to the one Wane won it with.

2010 team was far stronger

Certainly up there as one of the best motivators & man-managers & he does have the capacity to learn from his mistakes. I think the Madge influence is still there in part, but the current squad has more of SW about it now than when he took over, so the Aussie's influence (however good that was) is in the background now & I'd suspect you might get a few sideways looks from the club if you suggested anything else.

"Best in history"? Not yet. If he's here in 5 years' time & we've got a bunch of extra silverware in the cabinet, then you might well have a case. But if he leaves at the end of this or next year with or without winning anything, we'll still be saying he was damn good, but I think we'll be pondering on what could have been.

It does, however, depend on how he responds to the other teams working out how to beat us - something Nobby didn't do for example. If he can work out plans B, C, D & E and continually adapt, then I'd gladly help fund the new cloning lab being set up in a shed in a field at the unfashionable end of Standish.

As a fan Wane makes you want to run through a brick wall so you can only imagine how he makes the players feel!

The best? Not sure. The best motivator? For sure! Mike Greg wasn't far off but Waney has the players revved up beyond belief!

It's a little bit silly to start to even consider this yet. He's had two full seasons so far - the first where he made a number of mistakes, the second where he learned from them. Becoming a multiple trophy winning team over a sustained period of time will be the best benchmark given our history and coaches.

One thing that Wane has over Maguire for me is that Wane uses the younger players more and squad rotation more, it was one of the only things Maguire didn't do and it was a major reason why we didn't go on and win the double in 2011. Currently, this is why I'm still quitely confident we'll be in one of if not both of the finals this year again. Our strength in depth in my opinion is greater than anyone elses in the league and you have to look at Wane with how he's used the squad over the last 18 months.

He needs to put another star on our shirt before we consider this.

Wane has frustrated us at times with some of the performances but the way he gets his side to peak at the right moments is superb. It's to his credit that he learned from going all out in 2012 and then us burning out when the big games occurred. That's the sign of a class coach for me. In fact I think we look better this year than last, but the proof is when the big games come round in August to October.

Jim Sullivan is our greatest coach though. His post war record with Wigan was phenomenal (12 trophies in 7 seasons) and then after Wigan's refusal to give him a pay rise in 1952, he left for St Helens and turned them instantly from no-mark team that had won only 2 trophies in 57 years to the big rivals we've had ever since. If Wigan had given him a pay rise the Saints derby we all know today would probably not exist. They'd be like Salford are to us now.

There was probably about 6 trophies per season available in Sullivans era though to be fair.

Maguire for me. He revolutionised the club culture and transformed us from a semi finals team into a team of winners. Let's not forget the run of games Maguire had to win for both his trophies as well, (Wane's SL run was hard but the CC run was easier than we could have ever dreamed of) and the fact Maguire never went a season without winning a trophy unlike Wane in 2012. In a couple of years or so I may be more likely to put Wane up there with Maguire if he can keep it up. A lot of people have mentioned Wane had to deal with losing a lot of stars, don't forget the quality of our opposition has dropped off as well. Saints in particular were much more of a threat for Maguire as they had Cunningham and Graham. Leeds were pretty mich the same personnel but younger

Wane won the LLS in 2012

Sorry I meant major trophies, tend to forget who won the LLS

Major trophy or not, most consistent team over 27 rounds is still an accomplishment.

Wouldnt everyone want to win both the LLS and the GF ? That would be the ultimate season. It is only with the expansion of the play-off system and the fact that there is very little advantage to winning that coaches have taken a longer term view of the LLS.

Have to agree, Lowe was way ahead of his time and I often think that we are who we are in the world of RL because of that man.

For me there are two names in Rugby League that I can never imagine being challenged in my own personal reverence for them: Ellery Hanley on the field and Graham Lowe off it. Shaun Wane is an amazing coach and is perfect for the Wigan of today, but it's too early to be laying "best coach ever" accolades on him yet.

He would t have been half the coach, without the maguire influence. Maguire turndd you from a mid table team to campions within a year, and with the same players. Fortunately for Wayne he happened to be under his tutorage

Absolutely correct, but those are reasons why Shaun Wane is a spectacular coach, not reasons why he isn't. Personally I think he has surpassed Madge as far as leadership of the Wigan team goes. Madge was a revolutionary and his impact blew the rest of SL away in his opening season, but opposition teams adapt, imitate, learn, and eventually start to defeat you. Wane has built on the successes of Madge and incorporated his best assets into his own successful style of coaching whilst learning from the mistakes they both made.

I think that the assumption that SW needed 2 years of MM to become successful is pretty dismissive considering the record SW had at junior level.
There is no doubt that having a period as assistant helped, but it also created a level of expectation that MM never had to deal with.
Given this additional pressure and at the same time having to cope with the lure of both the NRL and RFU make SW's achievements even better than MM in my eyes.
SW is already one of the better coaches we have had, and with a continued sustained level of success he can truly be ranked with the best.

People are crediting MM alone with the culture change at the club. While he was undoubtedly a big part of it, I think the change of ownership played a significant part of the philosophy of the club as a whole. Getting rid of Lindsay and Whelan and getting IFL in their place marked a total shift in the way the playing personnel were recruited, retained and paid.

Very much so, and the addition of Mark Bitcon and Rads should not be underestimated either.

Any new thoughts?

Nothing like stirring things a little

Aye, the beggars don't let the grass grow beneath their feet do they before having a swipe?

I was wondering who would chuck this grenade

To be fair it is a daft thread. A good coach, yes, the best coach in our history, or the SL period, no. That's not to say he'll never get to that level, but he's in Maguire's shadow for now IMO. In the time I've been watching I'd rank our coaches thus:

1. Maguire
2. Wane
3. Gregory
4. Raper
5. Noble
6. Endacott
7. Betts
8. Millward

I wish things had turned out better with Mike Gregory. He could have been the best of the lot

Monie , Lowe, West, Maguire all better than SW...in SL then yes Wane has to be up there for the work he has done with the youngsters..but i feel that he has hit the ceiling and it may be time to consider bringing in someone new