absolute b0llocks

Agreed.

You only need to look at the development over the years of a player like Matty Smith to see that's the case or Darrell Goulding is another.

There isn't a magic number where a backs development suddenly stops and you may as well throw them on the scrap heap.

A suggestion that time is running out for either is pure nonsense. They both have less then 30 first team rugby league games under their belts and I wouldn't mind, both have shown good signs at points but are inconsistant.

Yeah fully agree with that. Thornley reminds me a bit of Liam Colbon - steady, but you don't expect him to do anything out of the ordinary (better player than Colbon though). He needs to work on his hand off IMO.

I think Gelling has the attributes and the potential to be one of the best centres in SL, I suppose time will tell.

No need to be so rude, though, is there? Another keyboard tough guy......

There are younger better prospects currently in SL plus history has shown many examples of backs coming through at a younger age, Sam Tomkins included. Therefore, the clock is ticking for a 22 yr old "prospect". Conversely, 22 year old props have time on their hands. I hope that this is plain enough for you to understand. Given the quality of your effort, I thought a simple explanation was needed. Or would you rather I just said b0llocks to you too?

Gelling is head and shoulders above Thornley as far as centres go. If anything I would say Thornley is the one more likely to make a decent second row in the future.

Gelling just needs a bit more experience and he has what it takes to become a great player for us for many years. He has the size, handling skills and decent footwork.

Thornley is the safe option at the minute as he comes across as a more mature player and a bit more reliable in defence.

To Bill Sonny, this is how our argue your point. To respond, I never mentioned any scrap heap. My opinion is that neither looks likely to be a star, as Goulding isn't. I think I used the phrase "distinctly average". Could I ask how long you give backs to develop as opposed to forwards? That was the point I was making. Look at Crooks and Lineham for younger better backs, never mind Kallum Watkins. If gelling in particular has less than 30 games, isn't there the possibility that this is because he isn't good enough?

Edit: Thornley is 22, Gelling 23 next month.

Rather then age I'd be more inclined to look at first team appearances tbh. There is no way of telling how quickly a players game will develop in terms of age because they may just not have had the first team opportunities to develop their games. I think this applies to the pair if these lads for different reasons. They are both superb athletes but have plenty to work on but there's no better place to learn your trade then in the thick of the action in the first team.

As for a debate on development of backs in comparison to forwards I'd agree that you can be more patient with forwards and I think there's reasons for that. I think a major one is that a forward needs that element of physical presence and that can take a long time to build up. I also think that confidence to be aggressive with older and more experienced players takes time to build. The last reason I can see is pretty simple, squads carry more forwards then backs so you have to be more patient for chances and when you get them your likely to be spelled more then a back.

Back or forward though I'd never write and player off until they've had enough chances. Gelling or Thornley haven't.

Was Carmont a star at 22 or was he a late developer?

Your ridiculous post didn't deserve anything other than what I typed.

Nope in fact he made his professional debut at about 26 years old if I am correct? (Might not be)... Perhaps Jinkin Jimmy thinks he should have quit Rugby League altogether because if you don't develop by 22, go be a plumber or something worthwhile?

Who knows

Sign Blake Ferguson get Gelling in the pack and Thornley fighting it out for a wing spot. Job done.

Why would Thornley need to fight for a wing spot if we signed Ferguson?

Because we have Charnley on one side, Manfredi and Burgess, and that is if we do not recruit. Burgess and Manfredi to me like they have more potential on the wing than Thornley, and another off season I think will be really pushing for a chance in the starting line up.

Would Ferguson get a visa?

Both Carney and Bird failed when they tried to come over and I'm sure Ferguson would fall into the same category.

Love it to happen tho!

Everytime I see Thornley get selected over Gelling I can never understand it in all the times I've watched both players its clear to anyone with eyes Gelling has more potential than Thornley I watch Thornley and I just see nothing more than when we had Aspinwall, Colbon & Sean Gleeson and the same goes for Hughes I just don't ever imagine talking about Thornley and Hughes in the same category of the greats Bell, Iro, Inga, Connolly etc but I believe that can happen with Gelling he just needs a full season uninterrupted and like Josh would cement his place. I can't understand why Wane favours Thornley maybe its from his time as reserves coach, Yet Wane complains about not being able to send Gelling out on loan yet lets him suffer on the sidelines, Surely someone who leaves for Union then returns you'd think a loan move for a season or two would be perfect for him to acclimatise at a less pressure club as opposed to someone who can't physically be sent out on loan.

There have always been players around like Thornley who show a lot of promise, but because of inerrant basic faults in there game will always be viewed with suspicion.
This has nothing to do with his age, being able to catch a ball and secure it should be second nature from an early age. When the ball moves across to his wing, fans at present are hoping the first thing he does is hold on to the ball before expecting him to do something with it.
David Hodgson was always like that when he first came to Wigan, he would do something brilliant one min then commit a right howler the next min. Jamie Anscough was another.
I know Gelling is prone to errors himself, but at least he seems to have a bit of devil about him which Thornley seems to be lacking.

Thornley seemed to drop every other pass against Huddersfield.

I want him to succeed, but though he's an adequate player, I'm starting to suspect that he won't be much more than that. As you say, there is no beast in him, which negates his size and weight, and I've yet to see much evidence of brilliant and instinctive centre play.

That said, Gelling doesn't bowl me over either, and with Goulding showing increased signs of frailty, I'm starting to think we should be looking elsewhere.

I've been more impressed with Gelling in the few games he's played on the right. He seems a lot safer and more comfortable there. He played in that position in the under 20s last year too. Unfortunately he won't get regular time in that position because that's where Goulding plays.

This sort of posting is the reason I very rarely post now. It is abusive, not necessary and offers absolutely nothing to the original posting.

alright soft lad calm down

and no, it wasn't abusive in the slightest

IMO it is abusive, but then I'm not a "soft lad", on the contrary I'm a 86 year woman, as many on this board well know. Perhaps good manners were different in my day from today; a bit sad really.

Honestly you could swap the names Thornley and Gelling around and the above post would not be far from the truth, to a degree.

Where I don't think you could is in the basic skills comment. If I had to pick which of the two lacked basic skills its Gelling IMO.

He makes up for it in effort by the bucket load. If Pryce had as much heart as Gelling he'd have been world class.

I can see positives in both players. Of the two I think Thornley is the cleverer player and has far more of a chance of being a very good centre. I am not sure what the future holds for Gelling. Our stupid rules mean he has nowhere to play except the first team and I don't think you can keep rotating the centres to give each some game time.

I like him as player but I reckon a reason why I do is his all out effort. I am not sure that will be good enough for a long term future here as a centre.

What about his try in the CC final? I thought that was very good.



Goulding has had a tough year injury-wise but he was well beaten man for man v Leeds at the DW. As an experienced centre (compared to Thornley and Gelling) he needs a good 2014 IMO.

The rumours about him having a heart problem are the bigger concern for me.