Exactly I actually take a lot more from this tournament than the previous few, including the World Cup. We have done far worse with some of the players that people are crying out for such as Senior, Sinfield, Gleeson, Wellens etc.

What is Tomkins meant to do when he has a quick backrower like Thaiday bearing down on him, pretty much constantly? The only area he could have improved was to play a more natural fullback role attacking the ball in the air to give better field position. Seeing as he isn't a natural fullback, it would be grossly unfair to expect him to do so.

We've suffered from a lack of ball retention in the two games so far. When we've actually had the ball I think we've looked dangerous on occasions, especially when we suddenly decide to chance our arm a bit. I still think Gleeson would've significantly improved us but the coach made his decision and went with it. We are still weaker on defence than the Aussies, too many times we don't get in front of them. and tackle side on.

Spot on

I've been particularly impressed by the speed of our get-out sets, only to end up disappointed by a silly handling error or poor kick. Even the most basic plays seem beyond some of our players when they are up against a top defence.

He needs good service. at Wigan he makes a lot of meters and breaks from the run around move we used all year. Hes not going to run over anyone and just passing him the ball with a line of defenders set in front of him isnt the way to utilise him.

its hardly hype when you're the best player in the league

Size wise he doesn't look much different to Lockyer, who hasn't done too badly in the game. Probably safe to say it's not a limiting factor.

surely Pat Richards is better.

I don't think so. But apparently others do

The best British player in a decade....

He didn't get used right today and the time we tried to bring him into the game they shut him down mabye the best thing we could have done was use him more of a dummy runner but it's done with now

People on about his size if he was bigger his game wouldn't be the same he's so niggly and thats what hurts teams his speed off the mark is second to none he didn't get young player of the year twice and in the top 3 for m.o.s for nothing

Banana is a Banana, thank fook im slaughtered.

That explains it

Oh look, another thread full of comments bashing a very good Wigan player. What a surprise....

Tomkins had an outstanding SL season and based on last season is the best British player in the comp, with only Pat Richards ahead of him (and Pat for my money is the best winger in the world, certainly I have seen no one in the Four Nations tournament who I would pick ahead of him, the guy is just the complete modern winger).

But let the fans of lesser clubs have a pop at our players if it makes them feel better. Its no wonder they are feeling vulnerable and want to lash out at all things Wigan - they know that their teams face a massive task in overcoming what will be an even better Wigan side next season and they are clearly rattled.

Good grief.

He playing behind a pack that was beaten by the referee.

Name me a better winger than Pat then big boy!!

After your sensible post the other day on the England team selection for the Australia game, I see normal service has been resumed!

Nobody except a bias Wigan fan would contend that Pat Richards is the very best winger in the world of RL.

You have got a massive chip on your shoulder now if you aint got anything good to say gtfo and dont say anything at all

Give it a rest the pair of you!

OK, so who would you say is better?

Yeah, funnily enough i'm still waiting for the same reply.

Yes, spotted that. We may be waiting for some time!

The track record of Saints fans in naming players as the best in the world would have caused me to keep a low profile if I'd been FTV.

It's not that long since the Scousers routinely described Wellens as the best FB in the world. Now that's what I call "bias"!

I personally think what happened to him at AAMI Park will add to a steep learning curve.Think the example used was a bit harsh,since he went lateral in the hope of dodging the two kick chasers from the wing,only to be blind sided by Thaiday,(who was greatly assisted by a goal post).Increasing his size will not help if it diminishes his speed & agility.What he needs to improve is his peripheral vision & natural instincts.

Please note : that this was an interesting topic before the two ladies with handbags derailed it

There are loads.

Vatuvei, Uate, Morris, Gordon, Boyd, Inu, Nightingale, Tuqiri, Meritt, Best . . . .