Think/hope the Moon will be open from 9ish(?) as we're getting in Wigan for half 10, Walkabout opens at 12 for Aussie baiting.

I didn't have to, but chose to. Now [ithat[/i is cleared up. If you view that as a moral victory, congratulations.



These are not my words. Kindly do not attribute them to me. However, you are still avoiding the point. What were the reasons or benefits in taking that game to London? I have repeatedly told you why I disagreed. If you are sticking with your contention that the fact that 800 ish more people turned up, so be it.



Fair enough. Everyone's entiltled to an opinion. At least you have now answered!



You are pre-judging here. Plus, if only 22,000 turn up at Wigan, is this justification for playing Aus v Kiwi in London in front of less than 13K, hardly any of whom are actual supporters of British RL? Maybe for you, but not for me.

No need for me to claim a moral victory, I didn't have to resort to name calling because my argument was so weak in the first place.



What was it you said about Donny:



Last time I looked it was just as easy to get to Donny from Leeds as it is to get to Huddersfield. It's also closer to say Hull. Hardly the other side of the world, yet you seem to think it should affect the core support.

I've already pointed out numerous times why I didn't see a problem with the game being in London, the fact you haven't read them or choose to ignore them is your issue not mine. Start at my first post and take it from there.



Isn't the whole point of a 4 Nations tournament for the benefit of international RL supporters as a whole and not just British RL supporters.

Playing Aus v NZ in a place where their supporters are based - shocking isn't it?

Waffle all you want Andy. You have still failed to demonstrate how this decision is good for our game or benefits the people who contribute most, i.e. northern based spectators. If your argument now is that it was correct because Aussies and Kiwis live in London, why didn't you say so in the first place?

I want a couple minutes of my life back after reading the last couple of pages

No need to waffle I've given numerous reasons but you keep ignoring them as you seem to think the point of an international RL tournament is to benefit people based in the north of England who can't be d supporting their own team in the first place.



My first post on this thread:



What wasn't clear enough for you?

Apologies. Of course it was. Just buried under your avalanche bleating about being insulted whilst generally insulting the RL following public at large.

Not long to go now, I finish at 5.

It usually helps a discussion if you actually bother to read what the other person has written rather than make it up yourself. If you'd bothered to read the very first post you could have saved yourself a lot of embarrassment. Although even now you have to try and deflect the fact you had to resort to name calling speaks volumes.

Where have I been "generally insulting the RL following public at large"?





You've flounced off twice already with a goodbye and this discussion is over, hours ago. What makes you think anyone is actually going to believe you a third time?

Do you think France should be playing NZ in northern England too?

Labouring the point, somewhat?

Re the general RL public I view your comments about us/them "can't be d" to be generally disparaging, especially when we have yet to play a game here (here, IMO being RL heartlands).

And I promise to flounce off at 5ish. I'll spend the company's time on here but that's about it.

Why on earth would I think that? For the fixture to do any good for French RL it should be played in France, preferably in their heartland. Actually, it would have been more beneficial to have played Aus v Kiwi there too rather than play in London. The gate would probably have been comparable and it would have at least had a chance of boosting the sport, whereas playing in London does little more than boost the RFL's ego IMO.

No labouring on my part you're the one who brought it up again - maybe to save face as you realise you made a mistake.

If I knew you were so delicate that "can't be d" was going to upset you so much I'd have used "can't be bothered" - would that be insulting to the general RL public too?

I'm not trying to save face Andy. Who hasn't made a mistake?

I just generally feel that the RFL hasn't given the best opportunity to watch the best games to those who IMO deserve it most. I would imagine there are many up here who would have loved to go to see Aus v Kiwi. They may well still get the chance but it isn't a foregone conclusion, esp with them drawing that first fixture. You have a different view in that a gate of around 22000 at DW would be an indication of indifference. I don't view it that way.

If it is 22k I do think it's hugely disappointing that we can't sell this game out. It's likely to be the lowest attendance for a GB/England game over here against Australia since the 80's. There's a host of reasons why people will say they aren't going but for me the chance to see the Aussies in the flesh for the first time in 3 years and see the likes of Lockyer, Thurston, Inglis, Slater and Hayne should have seen this game sold out months ago.

spot on.

I'm not really going for the game itself. If England avoid humiliation they'll be doing well. I hope I'm proved wrong but I can't see it being a good game.

BUT every RL fan should want to be at the game to see the Australian side, particularly the backs, who could well be the strongest backline ever in world rugby.

So I AM really looking forward to Saturday. I can't wait to see Inglis in particular. Meninga is the greatest player I've seen in RL (though in a poll a year or two ago on the Saints forum on this site to find the greatest ever players to play for Saints they rated Lyon and Gidley ahead of big Mal in the ultimate proof that Saints fans know nothing about RL

) and I never thought I'd see another centre with that combination of power, deceptive pace and great skills. And yet having seen a bit of Inglis play he seems to be Meninga Mk II, it will be fantastic to watch him play. And then there's Lockyer - an all time great of the sport, the chance to see him play is worth the admission price alone. Thurston, Slater, Hayne - these are all tremendous players. Obviously for patriotic reasons I hope they all have shockers and are totally outclassed by England's backline.

But if that doesn't happen then I will enjoy watching some truly great RL players. 15-20 years ago Wigan fans used to watch truly great players every game - Offiah, Hanley, Edwards, Paul, Tuigamala, Robinson, Miles, Farrell etc. - but its been pretty dismal fare in recent years. With the exception of Barrett we haven't had any truly world class players for years...

Though having said that there is a certain Sam Tomkins, who has the potential to reach that level of greatness. So the final reason I'm looking forward to Saturday's game is the chance to see Sam Tomkins tested against the very best. Will he be another Wigan great? Saturday alone probably won't answer that question, especially as he will in all likelihood be playing in a beaten side, but it should be very interesting to see how he goes. Come on Sam!

Why cant FANS get behind the side,ok we wasnt too good against the french but saturday is a new game a new venue and who knows with 25000 in the ground cheering on the lads anything can happen and a place in sporting hisrtoy can happen and i chance to say I WAS THERE.

I thought the venue choice was odd, but we'll have to disagree on pricing. And yes, RU fans so seem to be happy with the pricing at their games, in fact average attendances at RU games in their premiership are higher than SL average attendances.

Nothing stopped them. Those that wanted to watch it were perfectly able to do so.

Correct. All they had to do was make a 400 mile round trip.

I believe Billinge_Lump did.

The exception that proves the rule?

People don't complain about that trip when it's Wembley. In fact a lot of fans complain that we don't play international games at Wembley anymore, that the game was at The Stoop shouldn't make a difference. You're there to watch the game, not the stadium.

The fact of the matter is that the two best teams in the world were playing each other, and if people wanted to go they could. There is no argument against that.

What rule? That most RL fans bitch and whine if they have to travel more than an hour to see a game?

ME +4


All together now "Sam, Sam will tear you apart, again"

If you like, yes.