Field and French are a way off yet. Gildart is just off...........to West Tigers.

Field and French may be some way off.
Lam should just be off.

For some reason the Wigan hierarchy seem to see any player who comes trough the ranks as top class when in reality they are absolutely bang average. But by any standards that was a totaly inept performance. The team looked like it had never ben coached - just a bunch of individuals on a field.How Lam is earning his money is beyond me.

Forwars were soft and lazy - some of the efforts in defense were atrocious,. Why does Bateman only play for the last 20 minutes of games? No one out there can take ANY credit in that shambles. Interesting to see who plays full back next game. But I'm afraid that was just the culmination of a lot of very poor disipline throught the whole team.

Sadly I think that will not be the last awful performance because the team is poorly coached and has too many average players. Every last tackle play seemed to be a big hoof down field which suited Catalan perfectly - there seemed to be no change in thought whatsoever, I think this is the dumbest team I have ever seen at Wigan -. We never looked like scoring.

And even though in the past I have critisied George WIlliams I would have him back over Hastings any day of the week .

We are a mid table team that has massively over achieved so far this season, this isn't even a shock.

In years gone by opposition teams used to be wary playing Wigan after a defeat. Now it's an opportunity to pile the misery on us.

Anybody who isn't wearing cherry and white specs would not have been surprised by today's "performance" - it just proves how poor the league is that we were unbeaten in SL so far - as soon as we came up against a decent opponent in the cup we lost.

After the Leeds game I pointed out how poor our line speed was and how easy it was for a depleted Leeds team to roll forward far too easily - only for some people to tell me how great our defence is.................

In fairness to our halves, they're generally playing behind a beaten pack every week. We have far too many forwards who offer absolutely nothing in attack, for all their heart in defence Partington and Smithies offer precisely zero in attack - until that changes and we actually get the size that Radlinski said we needed in 2014 (still waiting) things will not change.

This is Lam's third season in charge and I'm still waiting for this attacking mentality he promised over two years ago. Can anyone remember the last time you were excited watching up play? I can't. This one dimensional one up stuff until we're two or three scores behind is coma inducing.

After the likely tonkings by Stains and Wire, I'd get rid and give it to Lockers until the end of the season.

Assuming hell will freeze over before he plays Halsall or recalls Hankinson which 2nd rower is next inline to play in the three quarters ?
Not that that will fix the bleeding obvious front row deficiency but at least it will be something different

Presume you missed two of our best players - French and Hastings?

You can be critical of Lam all you want but ultimately he didn't miss those tackles and concede really stupid penalties today. The team looked lethargic from the start and played some really dumb stuff against a dangerous side. It exposed one of our biggest weaknesses and it's not something that is easy for the coach to fix. Our pack is just not looking capable of making good yards down the middle and that's not something we can really solve by bringing in someone else from the squad or making positional changes. It's not even purely down to size either. Singleton, Clubb, Bullock, Byrne and Clark are all around 110kg which is what you expect for a prop, but Singleton has never been a big metre maker, Clubb offers nothing at all going forward, Bullock seems hugely unfit so barely capable of more than 20 minutes, Clark might make one or two good carries but is poor overall and Byrne is a hard worker but few young props are really dominant going forward until their mid-20's.

We basically just made errors and gave away penalties, gave Catalans easy field position, then conceded really soft tries and so when it came to trying to turn the game around we had absolutely nothing to give. Our hardest working forward was probably Joe Shorrocks, who was tackling all over the pitch, making plenty of carries but he's about 87kg wet through and not someone who's going to give Catalans trouble down the middle.

Forget the coach for a moment - none of those players should be putting in performances like that regardless of who is coaching. You can't put everything that happened on the field at Lam's feet. They are clearly capable of more and let themselves down.

It's not the end of the world - we've had terrible performances under every coach - but boy there needs to be a lot of improvement from the team and quickly or this season could get derailed within a couple of months. We've had an easier run in than you'd expect in a normal season because of covid delaying the bigger fixtures. We can't keep relying on doing just enough to win but playing poorly and today showed that good teams will punish us.

Ultimately though I think we've had a poor front row for years but had strength in other areas that has helped to make up for that. The problem is if those previously strong areas start to show weakness we're going to be badly exposed. We've always had a strong back row that carried the weight of our metre making and an outstanding group of outside backs that helped a defensively solid but physically weak front row. This year we don't have the strength in the outside backs, Bateman has been a good metre maker but full of errors, Farrell has been in and out of the back row and our middles have been showing a bit more frailty in defence without experienced middles like O'Loughlin, Clubb and Flower.

A good coach can limit the distance between a good and poor performance. Today has been three seasons in the making. A change of coach can breathe some life and much needed positivity into the team/club. What we have now is neither worth paying money to see in person or watch on TV.

Doesn't wash with me that argument. We have had the same issues for 3 years. A coach or managers job is to address them. He hasn't because he can't. Time to go. I allowed him Leeds in the cup last year but for a coach with so much attacking threat at his disposal and getting absolutely nothing out of them is incredibly poor. He has turned a good side into a very bad one. Imagine what he would do to a side with no resources?

I can't back sacking a coach who has ultimately won 7 from 8 despite an injury crisis in the backs. I wouldn't renew his contract though and hope we have begun the search for our 2022 coach. If things get worse then yes sack him, but right now he has been generally getting enough results to keep him in the job.

IL has never sacked a coach yet and won't happen this season regardless of how bad it might get. Lots of tough decisions on contract extensions to be made by the Wigan management. I for one hope we show some ruthlessness.

The very definition of ruthlessness would be getting rid of Lam now. The time of season and how long is left in it makes it a no-brainer for me. Just look at Chelsea tonight.

I did. It wasn't much more fun than watching Wigan!

They are backs though and the problem is the pack. Field looked very exciting before the injury (well for the minutes he was in the pitch) but why did we recruit him? French was also relatively unknown but despite his obvious talent Lam doesn’t seem to know how to get him into the team when fit along with Hardaker.

We lost Burgess, Flower and our biggest back row in Greenwood and signed another back. We are now linked with Thornley and even Gelling. It all seems a bit haphazard to me.

He didn't. He just didn't mention them because it didn't suit his juvenile agenda.

But I'm not going to pretend that all is well. It isn't. We aren't good enough man for man, and the coach is unable to get us up for any games that involve more than average effort.

Sorry to say this, but I hope we are now looking for someone else.

In the Radlinski interview he mentioned that June is usually a tough month for him. That's because June is when decisions around contract extensions are made.

Who to extend (and for how long/how much).
Who to let go.
Who to recruit to replace those let go.

I'm sure I heard that something like 9 players are out of contract this season (may be 8 now Gildart has been made official). If someone could add a link, or list the players below that would be appreciated.

In addition IL's one year rolling contract is also up for renewal. So plenty to get through over the next four weeks.

Makes shocking reading this: https://www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk ... ssion=true Quote We haven't been great admittedly over the recent weeks. To some degree, a loss was coming but to that extent, I just don't understand how we've got to that point '" Quote Whether that's an attitude or we just weren't quite there in the sense of how tough it was, but the preparation in the week was focused, we trained OK, but it's the penalties and errors that have hurt us the past three weeks. A loss was coming but to that extent, I did not see that coming'" If your coach's attitude is simply 'a loss was coming' then no wonder the effort today was zero (much like the scoreline). Out of his depth.

Makes shocking reading this: https://www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk ... ssion=true Quote We haven't been great admittedly over the recent weeks. To some degree, a loss was coming but to that extent, I just don't understand how we've got to that point '" Quote Whether that's an attitude or we just weren't quite there in the sense of how tough it was, but the preparation in the week was focused, we trained OK, but it's the penalties and errors that have hurt us the past three weeks. A loss was coming but to that extent, I did not see that coming'" If your coach's attitude is simply 'a loss was coming' then no wonder the effort today was zero (much like the scoreline). Out of his depth.

If Maurice Lyndsey was still here he Lam would have been sacked after the game today with the Hull defeat and now this miserable show ML would have sacked Lam.

Quote ="MattyB"Makes shocking reading this: https://www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk ... ssion=true If your coach's attitude is simply 'a loss was coming' then no wonder the effort today was zero (much like the scoreline). Out of his depth.'" THEN DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT!!! He frustrates the life out of me. If this doesn’t scream “I’m out of my depth” I don’t know what does. I can’t honestly believe there’s still Adrian Lam happy clappers. IL needs to be ruthless. Get rid, and do it now.

Quote ="MattyB"Makes shocking reading this: https://www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk ... ssion=true If your coach's attitude is simply 'a loss was coming' then no wonder the effort today was zero (much like the scoreline). Out of his depth.'" THEN DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT!!! He frustrates the life out of me. If this doesn’t scream “I’m out of my depth” I don’t know what does. I can’t honestly believe there’s still Adrian Lam happy clappers. IL needs to be ruthless. Get rid, and do it now.

oh,dear,how sad,never mind.

Its time that some stopped blaming the Coach and faced up to the fact that under Lenagan and Radlinski, the club is now in a mess from top to bottom and a lot of it has to do with a lack of finance.

You only have to look at the club website to see how everything is a shambles. No reports of Academy or Schlorship games, no proper player profiles and players listed as being at the club, but actually playing elsewhere and hardly a day goes by without the club announching a new sponser to boost in order to boost finances.

And supporters should be asking themselves the following questions:-

Why did Sean Edwards give back word on becoming Head Coach?

Why did Sam Tomkins suddenly decide after returning from down under, again for a second time, want out of the club?

Why was Mcllorum who was still the club's best hooker allow to leave in order to fit Powell into the position.

Why did Sean Wane who is 100% Wigan Rugby League Club throw in the towel of being Head Coach?

The answer is Lengan and Radlinski who have taken the club back to the level it was under the ownership of Dave Whelan with a average squad and poor signings.

No matter who is the Coach, he will have the same problems of a first team squad which outside a half dozen or so good class players is mostly made up of average, small and young players and has not the right blend of experience, size and quality players.

Perhaps, the time has come for the club to come under a more dynamic ownership like what happened in the late seventies when the club at the time was also was facing financial problems.

Quote ="Ruddy Duck"Its time that some stopped blaming the Coach and faced up to the fact that under Lenagan and Radlinski, the club is now in a mess from top to bottom and a lot of it has to do with a lack of finance. You only have to look at the club website to see how everything is a shambles. No reports of Academy or Schlorship games, no proper player profiles and players listed as being at the club, but actually playing elsewhere and hardly a day goes by without the club announching a new sponser to boost in order to boost finances. '" There are literally player profiles on the website. Academy match reports too. We even brought in a billionaire as a large shareholder... Quote And supporters should be asking themselves the following questions:- Why did Sean Edwards give back word on becoming Head Coach? '" Can’t argue with that. It was handled poorly and on a handshake. Quote Why did Sam Tomkins suddenly decide after returning from down under, again for a second time, want out of the club? '" Why did he go to the NRL? To challenge himself, better lifestyle. https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.wiga ... 5185%3famp All the answers you want. Quote Why was Mcllorum who was still the club's best hooker allow to leave in order to fit Powell into the position.'" The head coach at the time was Shaun Wane. He made the decisions on who he kept and signed, ergo he made the decision to release Micky. A decision I didn’t agree with at the time and still don’t now. Quote Why did Sean Wane who is 100% Wigan Rugby League Club throw in the towel of being Head Coach?'" Just because someone is ‘100% Wigan Rugby League’ doesn’t mean that person should stay tied to the club for life. He’s achieved everything he wanted with Wigan and made no secret of his desire to coach England and in the NRL. He’s said repeatedly he left because he wanted a new challenge and to concentrate on other ventures. Quote The answer is Lengan and Radlinski who have taken the club back to the level it was under the ownership of Dave Whelan with a average squad and poor signings. No matter who is the Coach, he will have the same problems of a first team squad which outside a half dozen or so good class players is mostly made up of average, small and young players and has not the right blend of experience, size and quality players. Perhaps, the time has come for the club to come under a more dynamic ownership like what happened in the late seventies when the club at the time was also was facing financial problems.'" Whilst I don’t agree with every decision KR/IL make, you’re being ridiculous. Look at where we’ve come from since IL came in to where we are. Multiple titles and challenge cups with a club World Cup to boot. Heavy investment in the playing staff but also the facilities at Robin Park. We’ve made huge strides to ensuring success rolls on for years to come. You trying to change blame from Lam to IL/KR is laughable. Actually no, it’s embarrassing.

Quote ="Ruddy Duck"Its time that some stopped blaming the Coach and faced up to the fact that under Lenagan and Radlinski, the club is now in a mess from top to bottom and a lot of it has to do with a lack of finance. You only have to look at the club website to see how everything is a shambles. No reports of Academy or Schlorship games, no proper player profiles and players listed as being at the club, but actually playing elsewhere and hardly a day goes by without the club announching a new sponser to boost in order to boost finances. '" There are literally player profiles on the website. Academy match reports too. We even brought in a billionaire as a large shareholder... Quote And supporters should be asking themselves the following questions:- Why did Sean Edwards give back word on becoming Head Coach? '" Can’t argue with that. It was handled poorly and on a handshake. Quote Why did Sam Tomkins suddenly decide after returning from down under, again for a second time, want out of the club? '" Why did he go to the NRL? To challenge himself, better lifestyle. https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.wiga ... 5185%3famp All the answers you want. Quote Why was Mcllorum who was still the club's best hooker allow to leave in order to fit Powell into the position.'" The head coach at the time was Shaun Wane. He made the decisions on who he kept and signed, ergo he made the decision to release Micky. A decision I didn’t agree with at the time and still don’t now. Quote Why did Sean Wane who is 100% Wigan Rugby League Club throw in the towel of being Head Coach?'" Just because someone is ‘100% Wigan Rugby League’ doesn’t mean that person should stay tied to the club for life. He’s achieved everything he wanted with Wigan and made no secret of his desire to coach England and in the NRL. He’s said repeatedly he left because he wanted a new challenge and to concentrate on other ventures. Quote The answer is Lengan and Radlinski who have taken the club back to the level it was under the ownership of Dave Whelan with a average squad and poor signings. No matter who is the Coach, he will have the same problems of a first team squad which outside a half dozen or so good class players is mostly made up of average, small and young players and has not the right blend of experience, size and quality players. Perhaps, the time has come for the club to come under a more dynamic ownership like what happened in the late seventies when the club at the time was also was facing financial problems.'" Whilst I don’t agree with every decision KR/IL make, you’re being ridiculous. Look at where we’ve come from since IL came in to where we are. Multiple titles and challenge cups with a club World Cup to boot. Heavy investment in the playing staff but also the facilities at Robin Park. We’ve made huge strides to ensuring success rolls on for years to come. You trying to change blame from Lam to IL/KR is laughable. Actually no, it’s embarrassing.

And if William the Conqueror was still king, Prince Harry wouldn't be embarrassing the nation nightly for the entertainment of his new American friends, as someone would have been sent to kill him.

But he isn't. And neither is Maurice, and even if he was, he's now 80 years old.

Revising history serves no purpose here.

Maurice was great in a non-salary cap era. But he was hopeless during his second stint. Even with Whelan in charge, a guy who could have run the club with his small change, they managed to comprehensively botch it.

You’ve missed the point.

He’s not wishing for Mo to be back. He’s saying IL should have some backbone like Mo and pull the trigger like Mo would have done.