In years to come these players will look back and say "what on earth was I doing standing at a bar with Gareth Hock a week before the world cup? what was I thinking?" and thats after playing a shocker against Italy.....

Brian Noble said something very similar on television prior to the England - Australia match earlier - he said that had the matter been nipped in the bud earlier in the week then this would of prevented the media focus on the issue throughout the whole week which resulted in Steve McNamara having to face question after question during the conference.

I actually don't blame McNamara for walking out of the conference - he did warn them more than once and again he is not the first coach to do this - however as head coach could he have influenced the RFL to make a statement earlier in the week or is that down to the RFL themselves? Either way I agree that the issue could of been handled more smartly.

I always thought his appointment as head coach was questionable given his record at Bradford but he has actually gone up in my estimation after the last few days and his England Team impressed against Australia despite coming up short and despite the drama of the disciplinary issues this week.

As for Hock I actually find the whole thing really sad - I say this partly because since he burst onto the scene with Wigan he has always been my favourite player - outstanding natural ability and one of the few who could genuinely cause any team problems. Now his career looks in tatters and what is worse is that he does not seem to realise it.

A sad waste because he could of been one of the very best yet he has been reduced to trading insults with people on twitter.

Because lads like Gareth don't have it in their DNA to accept they are ever at fault.

Unfortunately, he is part of a culture for whom there is no longer any place in professional sport. It demands sacrifice, discipline, responsibility and the intellect to recognise that you will be required to give everything you've got, body and soul, for the duration of your short career - none of which Gareth possesses.

It doesn't help that he is apparently surrounded by people who constantly tell him what a great talent he is. Once, maybe, he could have been a great talent. In reality, he blew that a long time ago. All he'll be remembered as now, and rightly so, is a player who was occasionally better-than-average, and though he had it in him to be a bit more than that, never fulfilled even half of his early potential.

You must be one of the few people in world RL to think this.

The guy is a joke and I doubt the England performance, or should I say the Burgess performance, yesterday had anything to do with that proven failure of a coach. At the end of the day the Burgess boys are world class players and were always going to perform. They are big athletic lads who will always attract defenders and make yards in the tackle. Lets not mistake those guys doing their job as something positive that Mcbanana has done.

The fact that their top level NRL experience shone out makes the decision to drop Graham, who himself is in that elite forward class, even more of a joke. There are certainly other ways to discipline players i.e hitting their wallets instead of making the team weaker.

Despite the many talented players in the England team (including the Burgess boys) I saw many supporters and the media writing that they expected England to implode against Australia and this did not happen.

Now, if Australia had won the game easily I can give a good guess where many people would be pointing the finger (McNamara) but the players stuck at it where in the past their heads had dropped (despite having some very talented players in the team).

With regard to Graham I agree that he is an elite forward but despite this I don't agree that he should be treated any differently from any other player and despite rumours of drinking we still do not know exactly what happened - Is Steve McNamara a poor coach for dropping a world class player for breaking the rules before an important game? I think thats unfair IMO especially when you consider that many other coaches (inc the greats) have made the same decision.

If rumours are to be believed and Graham did break a drinking ban than I know who I blame for that one.

Agree with Sgt Pepper.
Hock missed training he had to go.
The others turned up for training, in what state we don't know. They had to be disciplined and were. Trouble is the wrong kind of discipline damaged the team.
Those stood down should have played and been fined their match fees, perhaps for more than one game.
McNamara got what was coming at the press conf. Give journos half a story and they will want to know the full story and persue by repeated questioning. The RFL media men should have anticipated this and dealt with it competantly from the start. He walked out because he couldn't control the journos and that's his fault too. He should be well trained to handle the media by now. If he isn't then he isn't up to that part of the job as well.
As for his coaching ability, or lack of it, well no need to go on really.

Despite being kicked out of the squad it was his interview on BBC Sport that really surprised me - it got me thinking who is advising Hock to do this? and perhaps the problem is that nobody is or nobody who cares for him anyway - it was just cringe worthy to watch from the moment the interview started.

surely players share rooms why didnt the other player say "c"mon time to go" (unless it was another second row!!!)

Martin Offiah tweeted exactly the same thing asking who was Hocks room mate?

It made me think that there could be more to this (unless it was Ferres)

I get the impression it's been a career-long problem for Gareth that he's been taking advice from people whom no-one should ever listen to under any circumstances.

Well it was Sam in South Africa!

I agree.
Look, he is a good Rugby player but seems to be easily led by his "mates" and will listen to them before anyone else.

Has he actually won anything in a Wigan shirt? He was doing drugs so missed out in 2010 when we won the league and 2011 when we won the Challenge Cup and after his greedy demands at the end of 2012 he's now missed out on them both again in our double winning year. We do just fine without him and I'm sure England's form will not suffer either.

From his own personal point of view though losing out on 4 winners medals/rings through being a twit has got to smart.

The thing is though, it's like being an alcoholic ... you can only start to resolve the problem when you finally admit that you've got one.

Gareth's interview on the BBC the other day - during which he looked mystified as to why he was being punished - indicates that he still thinks he's being picked on, and is a long way from accepting that he is the main one at fault.

You are right though, he's paid a terrible price for this attitude and for the idiots he has around him. He's now 30 and is effectively a veteran - that more or less means he's botched his entire career.

as far as I know, they weren't in camp on Saturday night - so he would have been staying at home. The camp re-started in Loughborough on Monday.

Correct

Finally Conclusive proof that members of the England squad are furious with McBanana for sending poor Gareth home! Nice to see that certain people on here have been proved right in their proclamation team spirit had been demolished by this mismanagement www.yorkshirepost.co.uk/sport/ru ... -1-6190256 Oh, hang on...........

Finally Conclusive proof that members of the England squad are furious with McBanana for sending poor Gareth home! Nice to see that certain people on here have been proved right in their proclamation team spirit had been demolished by this mismanagement www.yorkshirepost.co.uk/sport/ru ... -1-6190256 Oh, hang on...........

Quote ="tugglesf78"Finally Conclusive proof that members of the England squad are furious with McBanana for sending poor Gareth home! Nice to see that certain people on here have been proved right in their proclamation team spirit had been demolished by this mismanagement www.yorkshirepost.co.uk/sport/ru ... -1-6190256 Oh, hang on...........'" it was the same last season, some people on here tried having people believe all the players didn't like Shaun Wane and hock was in the right.

Quote ="tugglesf78"Finally Conclusive proof that members of the England squad are furious with McBanana for sending poor Gareth home! Nice to see that certain people on here have been proved right in their proclamation team spirit had been demolished by this mismanagement www.yorkshirepost.co.uk/sport/ru ... -1-6190256 Oh, hang on...........'" it was the same last season, some people on here tried having people believe all the players didn't like Shaun Wane and hock was in the right.

People who were noticeable by their silence as the season progressed to a rather successful climax.

I don't rate McNamara one bit after his tenure at Bradford and England's performances since his appointment. Problem for me is I think was right in sending Hock home. He missed training after a drinking session and there's no place for that.

That article quoting Hall is dreadful. Hall, whatever he may think, should not say anything like that for publication. It looks like the RFL are getting their mates at the YP to try and repair the damage they inflicted on the game by their PR mishandling of the drinking incident.

McNamara should not have stood down Graham, Hardaker or McIlorum, he weakened the team by doing so. He should have made them play and their disciplinary punishment should have been massive fines all round. Perhaps a match fee, make them play a game and their pay confiscated.

The whole matter was handled dreadfully by the RFL and McNamara. What was Ledger doing whilst all this was going on and what was his part in it?

Thank goodness the Rugby is that good and the crowds superb those same players who let the side down can reflect how the whole of Rugby League is getting behind the World Cup apart from them!

A fine is a bit like closing the door after the horse has bolted though isn't it? What are players thinking getting drunk during a World Cup?

It's especially baffling considering Harris basically said the other day that the lax attitude of the Welsh squad in 1995 cost what was an excellent team a chance at the trophy.

So you have a Wigan coach saying that drink cost him a once in a lifetime opportunity, yet players still go out and get drunk.

That's a bigger problem than anything McNamara has done. Utterly baffling.

I agree.

Lets be honest, what message does a fine send out to the players that broke the rules?

What message would it send out to the rest of the squad who abide by the rules?

Representing your country is supposed to be the highest honour a player can do yet ignoring the rules and going out drinking is totally dis-respectful to not only the rest of the squad and coaching team but also to the supporters who pay to watch the games.

The players have only themselves to blame.

Hock tweeted something before about "McNamara being a coward", seems he's deleted it now.

The lad really needs to grow up. I can't believe he's 30, he acts and talks like he's 16 or 17.

Shock horror
RL players drinking , what ever next, singing songs and getting their kit off in public.
Tabloid exclusive , RL team get drunk after match and player exhibits equipment in public.
One unnamed elderly female fan declares it wouldn't have happened in my day, players just didn't do that sort of thing.
Veteran Kit lady from St Mary's by the canal ARLFC suggested that her and the rest of the young women from the soap factory took great pleasure in caring for the players equipment so it wasn't seen in public like that.
Another source close to the player quoted,"obviously we knew he had one but didn't mention it as having a one and a pair could seriously impede his career in the RFL "

Think about this, ever had a bad week at work then went for a pint when you should'nt have cos you had to be up next morning.
No me neither !
What a load of Bo##@cks, this has had more publicity than two great games Of RL.

I disagree. Missing a World Cup opening game against Australia was the best punishment and it sets a precedent that this behaviour will not be tolerated by the England coach. McBanana has gone up in my estimation with his handling of the situation.