It's only pre-season and we will be up there come September but here are my thoughts and concerns.

Tierney isn't an ideal fullback. Poor under the high ball and unable to organise a defensive line. Little if any link up in the attacking line as well. I suspect we will now see Sarginson playing fullback until S.Tomkins is fit again.

Tautai isn't Wigan quality. Slow around the play the ball. Far too many unforced errors and makes irrational decisions without thinking. This will be his last season with us.

Don't expect much from Willie Isa. Looked like an average Joe so far. Nothing awful but nothing special either. Signed purely as cover for when O'Loughlin is injured.

Our pack is (once again) still too small. Our biggest Achilles heel these past few seasons will hurt us again this year. We lack any quality go-forward props with a nasty edge who can stand up and be counted when things are going against us. That said, I have been very impressed with Ben Flower when ive seen him in the past two games.

We still struggle away from home. Will we still have the mental problem of struggling away from home this coming season? Our terrible away form has been something Wane has repeatedly failed to resolve.

Sam Powell isn't Wigan quality in my opinion. He has future Widnes player written all over him. If he wasn't from Wigan Wane wouldnt think twice about releasing him.

Let's not panic and it is tough to judge when you have the spine of your team sat in the stands.

Things I am pleased about, Manfredi, outstanding player more excited about him than I ever was about Burgess, no disrespect to Burgess, I just think this kid is very special. Gildart looks handy and capable of making a centre spot his own Flower has been fantastic.

Slightly random one but Mossop looks good to me. He looks interested and like he has a point to prove it has maybe not come across in the right way yet but I think it will as the season plays out.

Negatives.....almost everything else. Really cannot understand why we have failed to play our spine.

A lack of back up hooker again could be costly. Powell will do a job for us there but nothing special.

We are going into the season off the back of poor form less than ideal but it is now up to the team to perform vs Les Cats.

In relation to Tautai, I have no idea why we signed him to play Prop. He is not a Prop. He is an impact secondrow who can fit in at Prop. Give him free reign he is devastating, especially when running wide.

The bloke has pace to burn and is very powerful but is wasted in the middle. It seems to me we signed him off the back of 1 game without researching him or his style.

I think Flower is looking good already and should have a big impact this season. I also think Manfredi is looking good and will kick-on from last year. Gildart looks very solid just as he did last season and so I think he will kick-on. Tony Clubb still looks the business. George Williams looks like he is building in confidence and will kick-on.

Mossop played better than he did against Leigh but he will have to keep upping his game if he is to seal a starting spot.

Not too worried about the rest as they were mostly second string players. We will not see a team like that again in 2016 unless there is a severe injury crisis.

The most worry factor is that the first choice team will not have had a pre-season game runout together. Although I guess that Wane, on balance, is preferring to rest his key international players. I am sure he would say it is not ideal but equally we don't want our key players knackered even before they have really got going in what will be a long season ahead. If we win the first game against Cats then it will look like the right approach and if we lose then there will be lots of debate. We will just have to get behind the lads from the off and give them lots of encouragement! They certainly don't need the supporters being too critical from the off.

I went to the Leigh match, watched the Scholars and the Salford match on Wigan TV and one thing really stood out and that was how flat Wigan lie up even when supposedly on the attack. How we do not get pulled up for more forward passes from the acting halfback baffles me, some one posted on another thread that Wigan could not cope with Salford's line speed . With Wigan lying up so flat Salford were in the face of Wigan straight away.

When Salford had the ball they stood off at an angle which meant that they were all running at pace and therefore it was easier to go through (or put someone else through) the Wigan line. On the other hand Wigan are either running the ball in off a couple of strides or trying to move the ball across with defenders in there faces.
In the last season and an half the famous Wigan move seems to be more and more stifled by teams getting in there faces and thereby spoiling the move.

Fans will answer this by saying that the way we play has given us success over the last couple of years by reaching Grand Finals, but my view on that is it is in spite of the way we play.

I agree, I feel we play far too flat.

I think the first quarter of the season we will have to ride the storm a bit missing Sam. But as long as we dig in and pick up the points in any way shape or form it will stand us in good stead. I really hope Williams injury yesterday was just a knock we don't need any more disruption to the team. As long as the correct players are being picked for the good of the team this year rather than because they are an experienced player and still get the shirt the following week even when they are not performing well then we should be the team to beat. Im interested to see where Bateman will be playing because for me if he's on the bench it will be a travesty. Front rowers have to step up this year they have a point to prove and this is the department we need to be firing on all cylinders to win the titles.

Not too bothered about the defeat yesterday. I thought Salford played well, but as people have said we were missing over half of the first choice selection, and the most important ones at that.

Disagree slightly about Tierney and Powell. Think Tierney has done well in attack and his tackle on Carney was excellent as a try saver. He wasn't exposed under the high balls of Dobson, who is just about the best in the league. Powell is a good player to have in reserve. He isn't a starter, but he is a reliable substitute in case of injuries to Matty or Micky Mac. He has plenty of experience now and IMO never lets us down.

I agree that Mossop looked better yesterday, and Tautai was better than last week also. With Isa it's too early to tell, neither good nor bad so far.

From what I've seen I don't think Fell, Waterworth, Wells, Gregson or Ganson are ready yet. Bretherton and Marshall look the pick of the youngsters. I think Higginson may get a start when he is fit.

Gelling improved yesterday. Manfredi had a bit of a mare defensively as he missed tackles that led to two tries and dropped a nice offload from Gelling that would have put him in the clear, but that is most unlike him. I thought Joel looked good as did Josh.

All in all we may be undercooked but it's a long season and I expect us to win things after our customary poor start. We may well lose against Cats especially if their pack perform and Carney is up for it. Pat will kick everything and it is written that he will win the game by a 50 yard drop goal!!! - So let's not stress about it.

The real thing is that with Under 19s we've slowly gone backwards from 20 year olds looking to make first team in Pre Season to 18/19 year olds. It's not right.

Completely agree. And it has showed the last two weeks where it has been literally men against boys in both games. Hope fully the new reserve team games will help us, but it may take a few years to get off the ground with only Saints, Wire and Hull participating. Anyone know why Leeds aren't involved?

You may well have answered your own question, at least in part. As things stand, the U-23s look like being infrequent friendlies played out in front of a small audience. Instead, we can give some of our better/older players a run out in competitive, open-age games for Fev and our youngsters game time at Hunslet. The players getting picked will be the ones likely to produce the goods for our DR partners, whereas, I suspect, the standard of an U23s team might well be more mixed (admittedly that seems less likely to apply to you than it does your U23s colleagues). And whereas Wane seems willing to give first team games to youngsters, McDermott at times shows marked reluctance to do so, preferring a more gradual route of progression. It may well just boil down to a preferred method of operating; it'll be interesting to see which, if either, proves superior.

I think the point being made here is that 19 is too young to make a decision about a player. They are just too young to offer a playing contract to and in some cases they have to be let go. Wigan have been successful with the likes of Burgess, Manfredi, Williams, Gildart & Hampshire but less so with the forwards, who take longer to mature.

For example, people point to Chris Hill and wonder why Wigan didn't spot him, but he was a stand off and then a loose forward before becoming a prop. Surely a reserve structure would allow slightly older players to develop without the need to make hasty decisions (as we may have done with Rob Lever for example).

Bit of a contradiction in the same paragraph. You say our pack is too small and then single out Ben Flower as excellent and he is probably the smallest prop.

It isn't all about size, it's vital to have the right aggression. Ben Flower and Tony Clubb both have this in spades and makes a huge difference. John Bateman (although not a prop) is almost impossible to stop no matter who he runs at and i have had bigger turds than him.

Moose just looks too scared to run with the required intensity these days, Tautai is a ball handling disaster, Crosby has the aggression but is very hit and miss and Sutton should be in the 17 every week because he also has the aggression. Lockers is a fading light and too many errors and indiscipline have crept into his game now but there is nobody else in there to take up the mantle to lead the team. Mickey Mac could organize things very well from no.9 and would give him a bit more responsibility and hopefully mature him a little but when you are one of the best hookers in the league and only play 40 mins per match... what's the point?

Lockers statement = !!! Really? Maybe not the player he was 2 years ago but at 31 he's not going to get any better but arguably best player in last Test Series and still best LF in SL by a country mile.

Mickey Mac = Keep seeing this 40mins a match thing being brought up but not many mentioning that he played the last half of last season with the dodgy arm that's now been fixed (Hopefully). Does no-one think that a fully fit Mickey Mac may have played more minutes without this injury?

Over the last couple of seasons some fans have blamed or commented about the substitution of McIlorum on the twenty minute mark for the fall off in performance. However in the last two weeks without him we have been 14 - 0 and 0 - 6 in those games at the same stage and then in both cases conceded three tries before half time.

Coincidence?

Of course it's a coincidence. You think one player is responsible for the score of a game?

I complain about the fall off in performance when MM goes off and is interchanged from the bench. It loses us games all season. Sub him with a man already on the field and we win!
Ganson played longer than 20 mins at Salford, the fall off occurred when Flower and Clubb both went off. Salford were a mile better than us in the first 20 anyway and were always going to score points in the last 15 of the half.
There was only one conclusion I drew from the Salford game and that is Salford had their first team out who were very good indeed. Well drilled, well coached and for 65 mins looked by far the fitter of the two teams. Our younger lads were outmuscled and out classed.
We shall see what happens after this pre season v Catalans.

I think the most frustrating thing for me is that every man and his dog can see how much Ben Flower brings to the side. For me it's not a coincidence that his return to form later last year meant the whole side went up another level as well.

Yet we never recruit anyone serious to help him out. How hard can it be to recruit another top level prop that would negate the time when Flower goes off?

I think clubb could do that, i think he is very underrated by a lot of people

In many ways he is, but for me he's a leader and rock in defence.

Whilst his go forward is Ok I don't think it's great either. We need another big meter maker imo.

That's not me belittling anything on the things that Clubb brings to the table either.

Flower and Clubb are very good superleague props. Both perform different roles and they do them well. I agree that they're our two stand out props and the guys behind them need to offer more. I can't help but feel Dom Crosby hasn't kicked on to find the consistency he needs. He can have games were he's fired up and he can be very good but then he just seems to go back in to his shell. I think Mossop is much the same. After those Tautai simply isn't up to the job and Sutton and Bretherton are very young and at this stage you can't rely on either to be first 17 players.

To sum up I think we're one prop short. I said it after the game yesterday and to me it's a glaring issue with the side. Leeds went out and signed Garbutt last season and got Galloway in for this year. They also got Cuthbertson last year who was decent in the NRL but has been a sensation here. He's proof IMO that there are plenty of options out there if we're prepared to go in to the NRL market (which I doubt). If we had room for an international in Ferres then there has to be space for a solid prop.

Spot on.

Hull KR seem to find a decent new prop every year (Clinton, Vella, Paea, Wayman) Guys at London can find a Vea, Salford Tasi and the excellent additions Leeds made.

Sometimes there's no substitute for recruiting a mid level/solid NRL prop who has a bit of hunger and natural size.

Whilst I do agree with your point about Hull KR, we did sign Lima and Pettybourne, which kind of argues the other way. Spending big (fee and wages) on a superstar like Stuart Fielden didn't work too well either (though his effort couldn't be faulted). So it's a tricky one.

I felt at the time that Pettybourne was getting a shirt just because he was an NRL player, when in fact he was poor and not worth his place. He seems to have won another contract at Gold Coast so I'm not sure about NRL journeymen/mid-level props.

We'll see how the likes of Tasi and Dodds go this year at Saints and Wire but they were both burned by Masoe and Asotasi whereas we have maintained some consistency in our squad.

I keep thinking about those young props at the Warriors, like Charlie Gubb and Sam Lisone...

...I'd take Jacob Lillyman though.