There's little or no hope of a Top 4 finish for the teams 6th - 8th this season. We're where we deserve to be in the league end of story.

There will be lots of games exactly like last night's game, when it's mathematically impossible for 6th - 8th can't qualify and a team battling for a Top 4 place meet.

Could easily be a situation where 6-8 are out of contention after 2 games and then there will be 5 games where nothing rides on it for that team, and playing for pride games never end well

Looking at that way these super 8s might superduds ,fortunately we've got Sandow to keep us interested and I would love us to turn over the other teams ,losing saints or huddersfield games would be awful ,as would Cas if we don't win on Sunday

All depends on Sundays game really. Lose that and it's gone already I think as Hudds aren't going to lose to Wakey. Win at Cas and it's simple, we have to win 3 more games than Hudds do and 2 more than Cas and we're in. Not impossible, we've been much better over the last few games - but I think it's a case of too much too late unfortunately for the Wire. We live in hope

As a wire you have to have hope and Sandow signing has given us that hope ,maybe the extra we've needed to turn close defeats into victories

Wire must win at Cas to give this concept any hope of saving this format from being a complete joke. Lose and it's effectively a 5 team competition.

Wire arn't in reality winning v Cas for our sake, because our chance to qualify is almost zero, but winning to save face of the RFL and for the sake of not embarrassing our sport with a useless formality play off system.

So the Play Off system is a farce if and only if Warrington don't qualify for it?

You are where you are in the table because of the squad you put together and the performances they put in. If you don't get in the top 4 (Which I still think you will) you've only got yourselves to blame, not the system.

I like the system personally. It stops teams coasting for most of the season, which was always the criticism when Leeds would languish in 6th or 7th all season then win a couple of games and the GF. It is easily the best system we've had yet, there is something to play for for almost all sides. The bottom teams have to continue fighting to get more home games in the middle tier, the top sides can't let up or someone will nick their top 4 space. The only teams without anything to play for might be those who are comfortably clear of 4th bottom, but unable to reach 4th.

A lot of Wire fans are writing it off for this season, but there is no need for that. If you beat Cas, you'll be level with them if you beat them in the 8s. If you beat Huddersfield in the 8s you've then only got to make up 2 points. The likes of Cas and Huddersfield may well collapse in the 8s as they tend to towards the end of most seasons. They don't often beat the big sides.

The big criticism of the Grand Final format (And Wire fans have been amongst the most critical of this) is that you don't have to play well across the season. You do now to a far greater extent.

The only counterweight to this positivity is youth development. No time for that now unless they are up to it immediately.

We are where we are coz we've been poor most of season

Exactly my point earlier. Once 6-8 are out of contention which could be 2 games into Super 8's mathematically, and in reality a loss at Cas makes it that already, can see some cricket scores looming, especially if we make Wembley, everybody will be rested.

Most games involving 6-8 v Top 5 will be a carbon copy of last night

'Every minute matters'





My theory to reward Top 4 is as follows

All points reset as per middle 8's but

Top gets 4pts
2nd 3pts
3rd 2pts
4th 1pt
5th-8th 0pts

You get some reward for a Top 4 finish, but 5th - 8th still has a chance

Why should 5th to 8th be give a chance?

You seem to mock a 'every minute matters' tag line then propose a system where every minute doesn't matter?

Every minute matters because we've not been good enough in the 22 games so far to be in a favourable position to make the top four, we've lost games that mattered. That's out fault not the system. It's done it's job.

Its nowt to do with Wire's position, It's just circumstance. The top and bottom of it is every game doesn't count because effectively the are dead rubbers for another 7 rounds for Hull Cats and Wire. Only Cas have a fair hope if they win v us tomorrow to make a 5 team comp.

If we Wire win, it becomes a 6 team comp but realistically both Wire and Cas have an almost impossible task. They could both be mathematically out of it after 3 game with four remaining.

Saddened is right and the other comments are typical of UK rugby league fans. Moan about anything new.

Anyone who refuses to see the obvious is an idiot. Saddened is not right, he's talking from a team of comfort, with a point of view that you failed in the 23 so you have no right to compete in the split 7! I may also have done the same had Wire been in the top 4 but that spent make it right.

What is the feckin point of having a split if you cannot compete?! You have to make the concept so any team has a chance to make the final 4. This is effectively impossible for all 8 teams.

There is no perfect format, they all have disadvantages.

If you allow the top 8 to play off then someone (leeds) will finish 5/6th and win SL followed by an outcry (quite rightly) that they don't deserve it. If you restrict it to a top 4 play off then there will be dead games for the 4-8th placed teams.

The current situation where the top 3 (probably top 4) are virtually through to the play offs is the RFL's worst nightmare. They were probably hoping for a very tightly packed top 6 - 7 who would need to fight for those last 4 places, but hey ho, they aint got it.

next season could be completely different, next season its possible that you could have 6 points covering 1st to 8th,, or you could have twenty points, its just how the seasons pan out. Just cos this year hasn't fell into a perfectly convenient fashion for the fairweather moaning types, doesn't mean that it's a write off.

So you'd have the top 12 playing home and away and then drawing straws to see who reaches the final then? That's the only way to ensure every team has a chance.

5th-8th aren't cut adrift by the format, they are cut adrift because they don't win sufficient games to threaten the top 4.

You suggest there is no point of a split if you can't compete. If there was no split, there would be even less chance to make up the ground as the top 4 would be facing Wakefield and Salford in those final games.

In a horse racing hcp weights are applied to make the contest even so every horse has a chance if winning.

In a dog hcp, the slowest dog is given yards starts to give every dog a chance to complete.

The RFL have divised a concept that makes it completely impossible by going against every rule of competition, giving the fastest dog the lead! Giving the best horse less weight!

How is it completely impossible? If you finish fourth you can win the title. If we can't finish fourth we don't deserve to win it. Remember the outcry when Leeds won it from fifth? It's amazing how short some people's memories are.

Correct, and so is Saddened. RD is going slowly bananas if he seriously thinks we should introduce a handicap system into pro RL. Wire haven't been good enough this season, so tough for us. Will there be some dead rubbers? Very likely but the old Top Eight system produced lots of them, too. Plenty of matches after the cup final if we're lucky to be there, gives us chance to build the side for 2016.

Put it this way, if Huddersfield win on Sunday, all we have to do is win ourselves against cas and win our super8 game versus Huddersfield and we are suddenly two points behind them. And I can guarantee they will drop more points. We are not as far off as people make out, although this weekend will have a big effect.

It was a suggestion that's all Jesus H Christ

I posted we're in the position we deserve to be, I would say the same thing if we were in Leeds position

If you think 'Every Minute Matters' then so be it, but there will be some cricket scores in the last few games, especially with our squad 'possibly' preserving energy for a 'possible' Wembley trip

Some games will be a carbon copy of last night, and that is no advert for the 'Every Minute Matters' concept, when it quite clearly doesn't

What we have a problem with now is the number of superleague teams ,first past the post would see the season end this week. What has happened is the RFL & sky are padding the season out to give fans 3 or 4 more sl games on their season tickets which must be better value than having to pay for every play off round. With the new format there will only be 2 extra games to pay for ,the semi & the final. Unfortunately,other rival teams have been able cope with the new system better than us & have been able to hit the ground running from day 1 ,just like Leeds. As Saddened has pointed out, it is a difficult competition to play in when so many young players are having to be brought in. Keeping players fit & managing injuries is important & i'm sure with a bit more luck on that front we would have been better placed.

There can be absolutely no complaints about this, we are where we are because haven't played well enough. If we had played better none of us would even be questioning it.

If the Wire were to pull it off and win the big one this year after the season we've had so far, no one could even question it, it would mean a monumental effort from the team and that we've beaten the teams at the top - champion form - and a much bigger feat than winning from 5th in the previous format.

Others have answered the second point, with Catp's being the best in that this is year one and the situation could be totally different next year.

To avoid the dreaded Middle 8s is one answer to the first point.

Of course it's flawed and next season it with be flawed further still unless it's addressed...,

You will get 3/4/5 teams buying a marquee player. So from game one those rich teams that will always be in the top 6 mix will have an even bigger advantage and an even bigger gap come the super8s.

Plus the magic weekend. We beat Cas tomorrow great but we are still 2 points behind them because they get a gimme v Wakefield, we had to play The Gypies, how is that fare?

I don't care if wire finish top next year and win the friggin lot, it won't change my opinion of it.
A 4v5 play off is the only way to give the upper middle teams a fighting chance and back up every game matters.

Saddened is right.

This format isn't ideal, but no format ever is and it is better than the last one in terms of keeping more teams competing for something. Let's face it, those who want the play off format scrapped altogether and FPTP to decide the champions would now be looking at a three horse race between Saints, Leeds and Wigan if they had their way.

If Wires lose to Cas on Sunday we're out of it, but if we win then we've got a chance. It's a proverbial four pointer these weekend, because six points would be too much to make up on Cas in seven games, but two keeps us right in it with them and Huddersfield both to play again in the Eights. Yes it's unlikely, but who knows?

The best thing about the format though, is it means season ticket holders of all clubs continue to get into all home games until the semi final which should always be in high demand anyway. The biggest criticism of the play offs and RL fans in general has been low attendances. The reasons for that have been well documented - cost and short notice of fixtures being the main concerns. In this format we'll know all fixtures up until the semi as of next week and all season ticket holders can continue attending, so in theory even if a team is perceived as having nothing to play for, plenty of fans should still be inclined to turn up - especially for fixtures which are big in their own right such as derbies.

I don't think it's too bad at all.

I agree with you saddened it's all been in our hands and our position is our fault no one else's