Pretty much spot on Biscuit so far Penny has given 100% .

Don't agree with this 'liability in defence' stuff. Ormsby was caught in a similar position on Saturday, but luckily the 2 on 1 came to an interception try, difference being the attack was so poor they couldn't capitalise on the poor 'read' from the inside men.

Wingers have the worst role in defence, if they stay out they are wrong, everyone shouts 'get the man with the ball' in they come in everyone moans 'stay on your man' if you drop for a kick and they get round you you've 'gone wandering' and if you stay up and they kick behind (Brough) you 'should have dropped back'. Can't win if the numbers aren't right, it isn't possible. Your only hope is that the attack get it wrong.

Every winger we have had from B Bevan onwards and no doubt before have been caught by the same things that Penny is being dropped for. This year Penny has been one of our better players and doesn't deserve to be dropped especially for Ormsby. Penny has been the most exciting player on show, more than willing with ball in hand. He has been dropped in the $hite by alleged more experienced players and novices alike. Now that TS has made his decision I wait to see how the speed freak that is Ormsby fairs in both defence and attack against Wigan.

Penny was ridiculously isolated against Saints. He is a player though that is instinctive and will always go for a potential interception rather than focus on his winger. I think his centre against us was Ben Currie, which maybe explains why he was so alone, but he was dropping the pass he juggled for his try away from a full on breakdown in confidence.

I don't rate Wigan's backs at all though. Despite Saints' injuries on Good Friday, they created absolutely nothing, with their only tries coming from a charge down and a kick close to the line. Wire should be able to keep Wigan below 18 points and with halfbacks we didn't have, I can see you scoring a few as well.

I'd settle for a Wire win, but hopefully we'll see a repeat of the Wakefield scoreline last week.

Hampshire (Rocky) is one to watch, he could seriously be Tomkins mk II. 21 tries in 10 games between the threequarters isn't too shabby either, particularly given Manfredi missed quite a few of those

Nothing against Ormsby, but the bizarre treatment of Kevin Penny by Warrington RLFC continues. And continues to me off.

I think whoever plays outside Toby King in SL will be a fine winger whereas Penny has been unlucky never to get that opportunity.

Why are we yet to see a great left edge in attack since the departure of Matt King? Our right side is always effective and hasn't changed much during that period, just Hicks and Joel.

I think many of us are in agreement that Atkins best attribute is his explosive attacking tackle breaking running style, but his passing judgement isn't.
Would Hicks or Joel try scoring ratios have been so excellent playing left wing outside Atkins?

I like Atkins because he worked exceptionally hard turning around and being honest about his poor form, that says a lot about a person's character.

As exampled by Westwood, a centres shelf life at the top of his game is short compared to that of a forwards. It is time for Atkins to consider such a move, because in Toby, Ryan may find it hard oust him.

Toby looks to me to be the type of player nearest to the classic centre style of Gleeson and Bateman. I think if we are to beat the Pies tomorrow, it'll be Toby that will have a great contribution in doing so.

I feel Patton offers a great deal more potential than GOB. I find it hard to see GOB getting back into the team this season if Patton continues to show against the Pies what he did against Wakefield. I think GOB could be over at London by next month.

Best thing in moving Atkins to the 2nd row is it will get him a bit further away from that touch line he likes to go over so much....

As stated, Atkins works hard moving us away from our line and can be big in the tackle on his day.

Maybe a move to second row wouldn't be such a bad thing??

The next question must then be: is Atkins daft/crazy enough to play in the forwards?

Atkins is not a forward.

You cannot make a comparison to him and Westwood who made the same move. Chalk and cheese.

Atkins has never run his size so not sure how second row would work.

Neither was Benny until he gave it ago.

He always had a different mentality and was a technically a better defender.

Can you seriously believe Atkins is capable of making forty tackles in the middle six?

I don't know Mark but I think he has only three options. Bulk up and move into the back row, bide his time until Toby has poor luck in injuries or move to lower rank club where opportunities at 3/4 are greater.
Ryan looks unlikely to retake his position with Toby in this current and early season superb form.

Benny is a loon and always has been, that's why the transition was easy. Atkins is a pretty boy (so he thinks) and wont like the tough battles. He can't run his weight as has been stated. He should stick running hard and elusively giving the right passes and defending with his winger, get that right and we'll do very well indeed.

Toby King is unlikely to play every week, you forget he is still a young U19s player regardless of his ability.

And Atkins is big enough to play second row but he doesn't play like a forward. All about the psychology of the position. He is a centre or wing and cannot see that changing especially not so late in his career.

So, on the back of a runaway win against a team with injuries multiplying every week & no defence to speak of, Toby is now a great centre? Before the NRL comes knocking for him, let's not get too far ahead of ourselves & see how the team performs in the next few games. Come 10pm tonight we could be seeing posts on here not to different from the ones of the last few weeks.

Toby is still young as has been pointed out and I don't expect him to be a regular from now on. Tony will progress him and use him more than last season but Atkins will still be main centre this season

Not that 9a
On the back of how he was early season and last week.

Yes you have a point but I think it's already clear that Toby is much more than a polished shiny one.

How can you say Toby King is in form when he's played one game? Let's not get carried away, he's a great young prospect but bigging him up too much does nobody any favours.

My post defiantly focused on his early season form and last week's performance joint. Ive not seen any post that says he had form from one SL game ghf..?

So what early season form are you on about. He got injured in the first half of his second game and a very much doubt that you saw the u19s first game (patchy win over Wakefield). So what early season form was your post defiantly(sic) focused on?

So from that game last night what did Ormsby do that puts him ahead of Penny?

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