Chill out and have a beer. Our opinions are probably not a million miles apart.

And to be clear, what I’m saying is the players played for Price, but aren’t playing for Powell. Rightly or wrongly.

I am of the opinion that tactically Price was left wanting and there were too many games when Price was obsessed with ‘the grind’ when often it was completely unnecessary to approach a game with those tactics. Of course, sometimes it was the right plan, and it worked, but for the vast majority of the time, it wasn’t, and if didn’t.

With DP, I’m not 100% sure what his approach, strategy or tactics are to be honest, with Price, at least that element was clear.

What I see at the moment is a group of players that in the main, don’t look engaged with what DP is asking of them, be that though his tactics, or lack of empathy in his day to day approach, I’m not sure.

What you will find is in that in any underperforming organisation you’ll find low sustainable engagement, and from there you will have to look at the leader.

Who's lesser than who in the recent changes?

Tony Smith won a Challenge Cup when he took over mid way through 2009, and took us from 10th to 3rd in one season. Price took over in 2018 taking us from 9th to 4th in one season with a Grand Final and Challenge Cup appearance.

That is what our last two coaches have managed to do in one season. Someone mentioned before about Castleford having a lower budget, well, Daryl Powell inherited a team with a bigger budget and a better squad than Castleford and we are currently 9th.

The last two coaches have made improvements and made us competitive in a single season. No excuse for Daryl Powell if he's such an attacking genius.

Let’s not pretend like some of these players aren’t e and haven’t been e for a few years now. Powell has come in and tried to change the culturen and has demanded more and these players just aren’t d because they’ve got away with so little for so long. He’s made 2 mistakes since coming in I feel, that’s bringing the Cas lads with him and giving Ratchford a new deal. We could have Craig Bellamy as coach and some of these lot still wouldn’t put a tackle in.

I'm perfectly chilled thank you. I suggest you use debate to prove a point, rather than accuse someone of illiteracy.



They've not been performing overall for Powell so far because he has kicked half the side out. They were being paid a king's ransom for getting knocked out at the first round, 3 years in a row, under Price's coaching and Powell has seen the wood for the trees.






There's been huge upheaval with the team changing week upon week (this is the nature of a huge upheaval). Combine this with new tactics and combinations and its bound to be messy. You're right about Price's tactics, that element was clear: there weren't any attacking ones.



Up until Catalans yes. Different v Cats - much better. Today dissapointing first half but better second half. At least that second half has been better than most games prior to Cats. This season has certainly brought disengagement between Powell and the players, but he's been tasked with a fundamental reset because, as our record shows, we still haven't won the GF despite spending more than anyone else for probably c.20 years.



With Price's sustainable engagement over 4 years (the players seemed happy), was the organisation performing to expectations? This organisation has been, arguably, underperforming for nearly 20 years, bar the early Smith years. The owners and many fans have recognised that we need to look at succesful clubs and learn. This means we need to radically change the way things have been done and it's needed a coach to come in and radically re-structure things to match our adversaries more. This isn't a half season project. We have to be patient and understanding if we recognise that this overhaul is needed.

There’s a bit to unpick here.

The players aren’t that bad. They’re not 9th, 10th in the league standard. Otherwise, this wouldn’t be a story. The calibre of the group, both at the start and after significant turnover is better than has been delivered. Anyone with a brain in their head would admit that.

A change of culture is good, it’s a good thing for a squad assembled by the man leading that change. 16 of them have been signed or have had new deals. 14 of todays 17. If you have to change the culture of the people that you’re hiring, why are you hiring them?

Brining the Cas lads, Holmes hasn’t worked out. That is acknowledged by Powell by moving him from his position to the middle. If he was any good, he would have took Currie’s spot. Matautia, I’m not sure on. He’s not great, but he has utility value and we needed a centre. Doubt he’s on big money, so I’m fine with it. He’s Gelling without the baggage.

Finally, Bellamy would get a tune out of this team. That’s obvious. He has turned average pro’s into superstars. Its about how much the players believe you, trust you and prepare for you. I bet everyone has had a manager who has said the right things, and you know they are right, but you still think that they are an idiot so the words don’t land right.

BUT HES HAVING TO DO A TOTAL RESTRUCTURE. IF WE DONT, ITS ANOTHER 20 YEARS OF THE SAME 'IT'LL BE OUR YEAR'.

Smith hardly moved anyone on and neither did Price in comparison to Powell. These underperforming players - many of them are nearing retirement so he may as well start afresh.

Aside from the player overhaul, Powell is tasked with teaching these players how to attack again after 4 years under Price. I cannot believe, given all these circumstances, that people are expecting Powell to have things in a good place halfway through a season, especially as Powell is having to shift on and retrain a load of players stuck in a clique of complacency.

Even Smith didn't win us a GF either, so we need to try something different.

Can he not just inspire, teach, train and develop the playing roster that we have, especially the ones that have delivered for us? Does it have to be baby and bath water?

After all, he was appointed because he could improve players wasn’t he

I agree with you, but all of the (necessary) upheaval is pointless without players who buy in to the coach. Last week's performance (and the 2nd half today to be fair) buys more time for me because we know there is ability in there and they can perform at times, I'm nervous about relegation still though toulouse are on better form than us.

He may have tried, we don't know, but 7/8 odd years of underperformance under 3 different coaches now, tells me he's decided it's best to get rid. Meaning he's having to make these huge changes. How many coaches shall we try to get a tune out of these players?

They haven't bought into any coach over the past 7/8 odd years - get rid - start afresh. If we don't, another 20 odd years could be wasted with this culture engrained at the club.

Obviously I have no idea what’s come before as this is my first season following the club but again he said post match we worked hard in the week. We have periods when we are flying but seem to just take ages to get going.

Does Powell not inspire them ? Who on the field is firing them up? Seems very quiet at times.

Welcome mate. These players have been overpaid and uninspired for too long under 3 different coaches spanning 7/8 odd years. Don't let that put you off though, the rot is being cleared and exciting times are ahead when everything settles - it just needs riding out.

I understand the argument but we are running out of players who have been there for 7-8 years.

Ratchford
Currie
D. Clarke
Cooper - not playing

Who have I missed?

Some of the poorer players have been brought in by Powell.

For the avoidance of doubt Im waiting for next season before getting animated. I will not be remotely surprised if we are gash again next year though.

But that’s his job! His job is to train, prepare and motivate. 16 players have Powell’s signature on the contract. If he can’t get the best out of his own men, is there even a chance?

By in large, apart from perhaps two players today, they are either Powell’s signings or will be at the club next season. How long do you use the ‘culture’ as an excuse and the need to be rid of the old guard before you begin to address any of Powell’s failings?

It's not going to happen in half a season taking into account:-

changes in playing personnel in addition to the ones you mentioned (most of the team)

Long serving players unhappy at cultural changes such as finishing on time and not going home early

Introduction of a number of young inexperienced players

Coaching many attacking structures as we didn't have any before under Price

Just one set of these changes is enough to cause serious disruption, but those 4 in combination is a monstrosity of a challenge and people are expecting us to be challenging after half a season when these changes are still taking place - really quite unbelievable to be honest. Part of me thinks that many of the fans, unhappy at our form, deserve these players. They deserve a new coach to come in now to replace Powell. And deserve another coach to come in every 6 months until they realise that it might not be the coach that is the main problem. After 10 years people may still think the 10th/11th/12th coach may be the problem. Luckily a lot of these players will have retired or gone.

Just get a new f@@king coach in then LOL. I reckon these players will really perform for a new coach because they've done so well over the 8 odd years and havent been far off with the other two coaches. A little tweaking and we may get past the first round of the play offs which would be brill. We could get in another Price type who engages with the players because when they're happy they perform.

Fuzzy Duck has gone awfully quiet after getting giddy with last weeks win against a poor depleted Cats.

Everyone should have a mate like you are to Powell, Gazwire. Loyal and supportive.
I hear your frustration regarding what you consider to be disappointing performances over past years. We support Warrington and we have all felt let down on the big ones.
Unfortunately the messiah to lift us out of being the eternal bridesmaid which you are valiantly supporting is obviously not able to do it I am sad to say. We are getting worse not better, he has a majority of players which are his choice, he needs a simple game plan, back to basics which everyone understands their roles, he is required to build a team spirit where everyone works for their mates, in every game. Simple, easy to work to, a building block foundation to build on for the future.
He has failed at all levels.
Sometimes Gazwire, you just need to let go and move on.

We didn't need a restructure, we needed a coach who could keep getting us into playoffs, and finals, and to challenge the big teams regularly. We can't even challenge Wakefield.

We already had the players capable of doing that.

If we aren't in playoffs next season, he has got to go.

Yes you're right, let's get Steve price back in. He did really well because we made the playoffs in the last 3 years.

I feel sorry for the players now, this season's change must be really hard for them. If we could only have things the way they were the past 3 seasons where we made the playoffs - those great memories are becoming more distant as this season rumbles.

You're right, let's get another coach in. If we could only bring back Price to bring back the past 4 years, he's gone now which is sad.

Who shall we get in them?

I think the frustration is that we were not a project club. We didn’t need a rebuild. We were in the frame but not able to take the next step. We needed someone to unite the group and build an attacking structure to complement a decent defence and ultimately challenge in the big games.

Nobody is suggesting Price was the right man, and your suggestion of that is a petty defence. The question isn’t about Price, it’s about whether the man appointed to take us to the next level is delivering on the objectives and/or is showing indicators that he is able to do so.

So, my question to you is two parts. Is what we have seen so far ‘on-track’ with expectation. And if not, why not.

Agree with everything. Club is in great standing as shown by results over the years. We've had/got great players and and i feel sorry for them not winning the GF.Yes we're dreadful, let's get a new coach.