maybe he has decided that he has run out of his time with us... people are saying 'keep him'.. maybe he doesn't want to stay... For all we know plans could already be in place to replace him at the end of the season. TS and the club could have already come to an agreement... in which case the club could be holding back on new players until the new coach has been chosen and put in place.

or maybe TS is still very happy at the club and is relishing the chance to rebuild this side... Maybe he will turn this around, stay at the club for another 5 years and win more trophies.

I wouldn't rule out something happening though.... Things do need freshening up sometimes. Brilliant coaches do become stale and move on.

Yes, he won us the challenge cups and i will always be thankful for that. But i like the excitement that comes with change.. its a bit like the excitement that comes with new players



I'm sure that when the time is right to find a new head coach, the brilliant people that run our club will appoint someone that they feel can move us forward as a team.

TS deserves the opportunity to put it right after what he has done for us. After all if we had, say, won 3 more games than we have we would be sitting joint 3rd and this thread would not exist. We gave Cullen years and years and he had no pedigree of success. Tony Smith has give us success we could only have dreamed of in 2009 and deserves similar time. Yes his succession planning is questionable as is the decision about Carvell and Asotasi. There is clearly something "up" in the camp too. But he will sort it in my view.

i dont think there's anything up, we're just missing leadership around the club.

i can understand why they would hand part of the captaincy to westwood,purely from an on field performance pov, however i dont think he's totally like a peacock that you can get behind. i always thought that he was a partner in crime for briers and obviously did his best work in conjunction with Lee getting him going.

Monas on the other hand, love the fella, but he's gone on a season(possibly two) too long, and i think captaincy isn't for him, i really dont like seeing him talking to the ref, in the past any bad performances we've had, you'll see him regularly moaning at the referee about bad decisions, but not in a captain stylee, just like his head and concentration has gone.

We just partly need seniority and leadership, thats what's been lost with moz going and also Bert, i've read over the years about the high standards moz demanded in training, likewise with Hodgo, there were reports of him pushing the other backs and wingers for standards. you have to wonder who in the team should/could be doing that this year.

Never mind winning 3 more games this season, I wonder if this thread would exist if our results this season were exactly as they are but we had not lost in the second half at Old Trafford

*Taken us as far as he can*.... A tired, worn out cliché started in football and sadly, has now spread to our game...Please desist.

Also just to say, i wonder if the club are questioning the benefit of the australia trip this year.

This comment from atkins has stuck in my head since pre season

Its this bit of Atkins personal diary from that very same trip that got me thinking

Humour in adversity, no one does it better than a Wire fan.

Could it be that TS had a shopping list of players he would like to sign and SM told him that there was no money to spend?
There are several players who the media have speculated were coming to Warrington but have subsequently signed for other clubs.

Apart from me, hey, Uncle Rico?

I had begun to think nobody would come up with that speculation.
It seems obvious to me that happened.
Posters on here would have gone straight for the throat if I had have said that.

its more likely to be the other way around.

The money is there to spend, but TS didnt feel it was required.

The money has always been there for TS and PC to spend, if they wanted a player and it cost a fee it was still done. Why would that position change?
TS has put faith in a squad and that faith has backfired.

Just thank our lucky stars Mick Higham has actually improved at a point in his career in which he should be declining.
Thank our lucky stars that a Championship prop defied the odds to become a starting prop internationally.

Without the go forward of those two we'd be abysmal.

hard to really argue with that.... only really Westwood can stand up and be counted with those 2. All the others are a bit 'meh'

I was told that the money was there but the quality was not, he was not prepared to bring in overseas players who are only equal too or less than the quality we aready have, makes sense really. Why buy if what you want is not available. I also believe that the possibility is that the player/s that he wanted may be available this year ??
Who knows.

Here's me thinking we have moved on?

"I thought Bradford were terrific, they out-enthused us. Yeh, we have got some things to work on but we did some good things too; so the squad bus turned up at the stadium on time, and all the guys managed to pull their jerseys on without any help from Bob....."

No I don't think TS has taken Wire as far as he can. He is still a top quality coach, it's his judgement that is in question following the recruitment round, plus (for me) the decision to hang on to an old squad rather than slowly replacing them. But he will be hurting, and his pride will have had a knock. He will wan't to put it right, otherwise there will always be a black mark against his career.

I think where we end up now (at the end of the season), will depend on his ability to restore morale which must be dropping fast. Low morale is the real killer which he has to avoid at all costs; 'that way madness lies'.

There was excitement with change this season. You could argue that Morley, Carvell, Briers and Hodgson had taken us as far as they can, they had reached or were approaching the end of their shelf life. So we replaced them, with Asotasi, England, O'Brien and Russell. That's change. Is it improvement? Is it the edge we needed to take us one more step to be champions....? The evidence so far says no, its a change for the worse, so we have gone backwards.

The same will apply when we change the coach. If we replace TS with an inferior coach, it will be change, change that will take us backwards. I reckon when people start down the path of thinking "its time to replace TS" they are secretly hoping that we will get a master coach from the NRL like Bellamy, Bennett or someone. But the market for coaches is quite barren and has been for a while. Look at the appointments the other leading clubs have made in recent years. Brian McDermott - would you have been happy with him at Wire? Mick Potter? Royce Simmons? Shaun Wane? Paul Anderson? Nathan Brown I admit is a good coach but I would still rate TS above him.

Then there is the market for unknowns in the NRL, you might strike lucky once in a while, Wigan did with Maguire, but its not a guarantee of success, Peter Gentle and Craig Sandercock have hardly been world beaters, neither was that guy that was at Salford for about a month.

And even the biggest hitter Koukash who is throwing money around trying to attract the best to Salford has had to settle for Iestyn Harris as coach.

So don't expect there are a whole list of world beaters waiting for the Wire job. I would say if you aren't prepared to be happy with Noble, McNamara or Millward then be careful what you wish for if you want TS out because that's the type of coach we will get.

Hasler needs a fresh challenge

no argument, they did... its unfortunate we came up short in the 2 big games



i know its football, but people said the same thing about everton for years. You cant hold back on change when the times right.



I think ole gunnar solskaer is taken



you know every well none of those would be considered....

maybe we could change the way people think and appoint a visionary like Phil Clarke.

Everton weren't going to change anything they were quite happy with a coach that had never won anything.

United were the ones that instigated the change. How has that change gone for them?

Everton have done well so far with a coach who at least has a track record of winning something but they look like they're going to have another Everton esque season, get lots of praise, up punching above their weight, miss out on a trophy, not quite Champions League material.



Who do you think realistically would be in the frame for being Warrington coach?

that was an example of a clubs fans that thought their current manager had taken as far as he could.... they were wrong (amazingly)

as good as smith has been, he hasn't delivered the big prize with the biggest backer in the domestic game... lets not pretend everything's rosy. We are on the decline and there is obviously something wrong... lets get one thing straight.. im not saying 'smith out'... im saying if it does happen then im not going to be crying about it... i have more faith in the people running our club than the person picking the team... and that will remain while Moran is in charge.



that doesn't really matter does it? thankfully my opinion has no effect on the decisions made by the brilliant people that run our rugby club.

we're 8th, haven't improved in years, our crowds are on the slide.... were nothing like everton in all fairness.

Exactly, you can't think of anybody better than TS that would realistically be available.

The brilliant people that run our rugby club won't be able to either, and so they will keep backing TS despite annoyance from fans for a season or two. Then hopefully with some good recruitment in the right places, we will be back on an upswing under TS.

TS is going to have to build his second generation Wire team. He inherited a core from Cullen that was ripe for 4-5 years of success, and he milked it better than Cullen would have.

People say now he should have slowly replaced them one by one but what was the point in moving guys like Briers, Hodgson on before they were finished? Should we move Westwood and Higham on now, to start "rebuilding" for the future?

10 years ago United under Fergie were in a similar position and there were questions asked about whether Fergie had started to lose it....he lost some key players from the Treble team and he was signing guys like Kleberson, Djemba Djemba and Bellion that weren't United quality. It took him probably 3/4 seasons to get to grips and build a new generation United team, during which time they were in the shadow of Arsenal and Chelsea. But he did rebuild it and they went on to be dominant again.

If TS wants to stay, I would have confidence that over a 5 year period he can rebuild a trophy-competing Wire team.

i stopped reading after this bit for obvious reasons.

my rugby league knowledge stretches to our home games and sky games..... so to use me as a yardstick against knowledge people that run a professional rugby league club is somewhat foolish.

the 'we we will go downhill after smith' mentality is a bit weak.

how did leeds do after he left?