Which one of your Australian's was it that said to Thaler, "You're bent" after he went to the video ref after Wellens' strop at not being given the try when Roby or Laffranchi were ruled to have knocked on. 50 minutes 50 seconds or thereabouts on the clock at the time.

Of course he's past it, but the sad thing is, a past it Morley is still better than most of what British RL has to offer.

I can't remember where I said it, or if I even said it on here, but I've been saying all season that for the first twenty minutes of the game, we should play five drives and a kick rugby, simply to gain a foothold and work the opposition forwards down. When you do things like we did, like Blythe's offload, Wood's offload and Carvell's lunacy, you invite the opposition onto yourself and gift them extra momentum, something this Saints side didn't need.

If I were Smith (I know, just imagine...), I'd tell every single one of those forwards that if they offload it in our half, they're dropped for the next game. I can't remember a decent offload tonight, Saints were clearly onto it but we persisted with trying to get it away in the tackle, if the forwards just knuckled down and decided to make an extra four metres instead of looking for the extra pass, we might have got somewhere in the 'comeback'. I can't believe I'm saying it, but a few of the experienced heads should really take a look at Hill and Cooper and learn a little, flash rugby is all very well and good when you're thirty points clear against beaten opposition, but when you're getting thumped and momentum is entirely against you, it is, as the title suggests, suicidal.

Probably Michael Monaghan, he's usually in disbelief at the referees over here and usually answers back a bit.

It was funny listening back to it. Thaler takes it likes he's just asking a reasonable question and replied calmly about the reasons for his decision.

I hear you. But most of our allure, potency and flair comes from offloading in our own half - when it's on. It's getting big daft forwards to realise when and when not to. I really think some of them have decision making difficulties when put under pressure. Carvell's magic on 39:59 was simply incredible. He must have the brain the size of an atom.

complete . when you did start to offload it gave us a chance it gave us some possession back. We on the other hand were absolutlely disgusting we completed one set of six in a half of rugby league FFS...!!!!

you take as much comfort as you want and think you've turned a corner .... all you have done is come up against the most half witted team in superleague and beat them by 8 points.

possibly the stupidest thing ive ever seen on a rugby pitch.

I appreciate it hurts, but show some degree of class. You were very poor but being 22-0 down after as many minutes with hardly any ball at that point you have to admit the opposition have done alright.

Of course, but I think those chances to offload come when we catch the opposition forwards unsettled. It's no secret that Tony's spoken about the slower pace at the PTB this season, Saints slowed us down to great effect tonight, it meant that when Carvell ran at them and turned, they had three/four men in the tackle, waiting for the precious to be handed to them. Last year, when we were at our best, our forwards were running at the opposition on the back foot, we were isolating them in the collision and getting support for the offload. I said in the thread about Waterhouse the other day, once we pick up the speed of our play and get him running at one or two players, he'll be offloading at will, but for now, the opposition are wrapping him up, even if he has still got away a lot of offloads. It's the same for all of them.

Agreed. Worse then Lyon missing touch against Wigan when we were poised to score and on the up whenever that was. You have to guess what's going on in his tiny cranium (if anything). Fecking shocking. Needs dropping on that and his general performance. I want the Carvell v2011 back.

Very good point. Do we have a game plan when the ref instills a slow PTB?



Having said that no excuse for passes above heads, knock ons from bread baskets, ed up crazy offloads and passes into touch. We were nuts tonight. Simple.

dont understand what showing class has to do with anything i'm being realistic its you who is living with ones head in the clouds

we gifted you possession like no other team has done in the league all season it was amateurish.we did the same to Wakefield and got suitably bummed for that. you did a ten point better job than Wakey simple as that

If you think you can win a grand final playing like you did then fair do's but unfortunately for you you wont play a team like us in a grand final.... as we will be out after the first round.

you have beaten a team with red hair who were expecting an easy game and a side that chucks the ball around like under 7's that are plaing with a ball rolled in dog pooh.

class my ar$e your Saint Helens for fecks sake

This does, with respect, smack of sour grapes. Best team won. And in the first 20 they were Warrinton'esque.

The ref didn't necessarily instill a slow PTB. It seemed that when Saints were running it up against us, every time the Saints player hit the deck he'd shout "Move!" to the Wire player to let him get up and play it. It seemed they done a good job of holding us up them bringing us down eventually, slowing play up and making our play look flat. I actually think the 'flop' seems a thing of the past in Super League, just like the sin bin (I didn't think the ref was particularly bad, but Wellens and Hohaia (sp) were particularly late with their 'support'). Our plan when there's a slow PTB seems to be to play the same way, which is incredibly frustrating as we saw tonight. As I said before, for me we should just resort to the basics to grind teams down, once we get them worn down a little, the freedom in the collision should come naturally, instead of forcing the issue and conversely turning the momentum against us.

The game against Widnes shouldn't be taken lightly, but, in the same sense, it could be a game used to get a few players back up to full confidence before a grim one against Catalans. The game against Widnes could also be a good game to drop a few of the under-performers, assuming we have some reasonably sized forwards in the U20s asking for games.

The mindset of the Wolves was all wrong from the start. It's a job for Tony Smith, now is the moment he earns his corn.
Worst game sine Bronchos a couple of years ago..

correct best team won I havent doubted that, but the Saints fan thinks they were back to the entertainers of old offloading at will and scoring tries from those offloads which is complete rubbish.

They scored from OUR offloads and when they started to offload it gave us possession and a window back into the game.(which we couldnt capitalise on)

what did they create from their own territory?
what had you thinking jesus we cant live with these halfbacks they are ripping us to bits?

due to our own mistakes we were bum banged nothing sour in that. If you think that was the complete rugby performance from Saints then I worry for you............

You mean the Broncos nadir 2009 2nd game for Tony? You are right he has his 2nd challenge withe the wire. I trust him though he will know we were bobbins. I just wish we hadn't lost against them at home.

Saddened gives a very fair assessment. I actually thought our pack was better than the saints pack in terms of winning the contact, it was just the repeated brain farts that constantly gave them possession (for the fourth game in a row, which is worrying). Without James Roby, that saints pack would be truly spineless, he was superb again tonight. Though the less said about our backs, the better...

If I were Tony Smith, I would be tempted to lobotomise the whole squad instead of normal training this week. Maybe they'll learn how to catch the ball!!

Biscuit as far as I am concerned we gave the game away on a silver platter for the reasons you rightly outline. And no we have faced far better Saints sides and given a better account of ourselves in the past. They struggled when we played but made the most of it when we didn't (50 mins)

If saints fans think they can easily beat wire on our own midden then in current parlance they can. If we think we are a better side than Saints we need to make a GF simple as, and do it for the next 5 years,

As a neutral watching the game I thought saints were outstanding in defence and very good in attack , warrington in first 20 minutes lost the game through ball retention , but after that there wasn't much in the teams , you wires fans are very much like the leythers its always we were e and the opposition werent much better, warrington are a gud side but so are saints admit it they will be there or there about at the end of the season they are starting to look like st Helens of old.

I am a very realistic person. I'll always honestly say how good a team has played. Saints were only quite good last night; they didn't need to be any better. The Wire were appalling, all 15 teams in SL would have beaten us last night as everything we conceded came from our own mistakes. If it was down to a really good performance that we couldn't live with like Wigan in the cup last season, I'd say so, but last night wasn't that.

Of course Saints are a good team, it was just lack of organisation, lack of leadership and poor form early this season. But Saints will never be the Saints of old, it's a new Saint Helens now...still very good mind.

That was just like the saints of old, it was as if Cunningham and long were out there. Having said that, we were playing into their hands with the number of mistakes we made. We were lucky to b eat Wakey playing like that recently.

The most worying part for me is that the players and Smith know what the problems are but can't seem to remedy them.

What was Carvell doing? Not fair to just pick on him though, plenty more had stinkers.

I like to watch both Warrington and Saints on the box and was really looking forward to a good close game.
What a disappointment!
I found myself shouting at the TV every time Warrington messed up. And worse than that then never learned a thing in the first half in terms of not committing the same stupid offloads as Carvell so beautifully demonstrated.
They were rank!

Warrington were much better in the second half but had too much to do.

Myler is OK when he latches onto a pass and goes clear, but I don't see what else use he is.

Roll on Saints vs Wigan.

Back to normality against saints - hurts doesn't it?



"It's always your year, it's always your year, just like the last one, it's always your year"

The arrogance of some Warrington fans is quite frankly hilarious: why can't you just accept the fact that we outplayed you?

You talk about the fact that you gifted us the game, but what you are failing to grasp is the fact that we punished your mistakes - which it takes a good side to do. You can only play the game in front of you and we didn't really have to make thousands of yards etc as you gifted us that territory instead. You made the same errors last week against Wigan, yet they didn't punish you and you managed to get the two points.

To me it seemed that Warrington were in a state of panic last night which led to silly errors. You've not been great for a few weeks but it'll come: Tony Smith is a good coach.