joel tomkins is an excellent player..... however fadges decision to move his best 2nd rower into the centres effected his game.... there is no doubt about that.... and he did it to accommodate a player from australia on a 1 year contract..... a blatant disregard for the players development..... who could blame him for moving to union.... he saw a player like hansen retain his place while he was moved out into a position he was sometimes cruelly exposed in.

if i was joel tomkins i would have been very p*ssed off.

Joel had to be moved to centre to cover for the departure of Gleeson. Had Gleeson remained a Wigan player Joel would have stayed in the backrow. As it was Joel was the best option Wigan had to cover the centre position.

Hoffman's arrival at Wigan had no effect on Joel's move to centre what so ever.

so would i especially having a brother like ratboy

2 questions......

1. was he your best second rower before hoffman arrived?

2. do you think his game has suffered as a result of his position switch?

The way Widnes will get @@@@@@ next year, they might as well sign Joanna Lumley, instead of Jonah Lomu

He most certainly was.

He's certainly not as effective at centre as he is in the backrow. Who knows perhaps some of the skills he's picked up this season by playing out of position may help if he returns to the backrow. Joel's handling has certainly improved no end while at centre.

Overall he's a backrower for me. But it's nice to know that he can cover centre more than adequately when required. Of course none of this may matter if he isn't at Wigan next year.

so do you think his game suffered as a result of your head coaches decision to move him into the centre?

AND..... would you have done the same thing?

Well I don't think it will have any long term negative effect on his game. Like I say he wasn't as effective at centre as he is in the backrow, but should he move back to his correct position next year I'm sure he'll be fine, perhaps even better for the reason I previously mentioned.

I would indeed have done the same thing as Madge. Joel was the best option we had to cover for Gleeson. It wasn't ideal but what choice did we have.

I'd have done the same thing. What other option did we have? We had plenty of cover in the 2nd row, tried Marsh/Goulding at centre and felt Joel was the best option.



So why was he already a regular in the side, and probably already our best back rower before Sam even made his debut?

FIOS

i don't know what your other options were.... however, i do think that joel should have been left to flourish in the second row, and shouldn't have been made to step aside for a player on a jolly.

So play an even weaker centre when we've got decent 2nd rowers as backup? Makes no sense imo. And Joel hasn't looked that bad at centre, not as good as 2nd row, granted. But his winger has still scored a lot of tries this year. Hard to look good in defence when you've got Deacon 1 side, and Charnley the other as well.

On this years form (Again in my opinion) he hasn't been good enough for Wigan. Continuing with him in the side is influenced greatly by him being Sams brother. We all have opinions of players. Some of them will be different. It happens. I massively rate Liam Farrell for example but maybe some Wigan fans don't hold him in the same regard. Tom Makinson from Saints is another who I think could develop into a world class player. Some Saints fans may think that I am going overboard and that's fine. We're all different.

i just feel that it was a strange decision to bring a player into the team on a 1 year contract, at the expense of a young player who had been brilliant all season in a GF winning team..... there appeared to be no need to to do it.

i think he has lost a years development, in a position he could well have been key in.

no one is talking about joel as a 2nd rower for england in this years 4 nations international games.... and he could have been one of the first names on the teamsheet after another season playing 2nd row for wigan this season.

madge has cost joel his international place- fact

Because we didn't bring in Hoffman to replace Joel, Joel was lining up alongside Hoffman the first few games. Gleeson was our centre, Joel was a 2nd rower.

We were unfortunate to have to find a centre for practically the entire season, we aren't in a situation where we are likely to go out and buy a centre (maybe cos there really aren't that many about) and so went with a member of the first team who could cover that position (and to a pretty good standard).

As for his international place, I rate Joel. But I rate Ellis, Westwood, Heighington more. Whether he would have got in now that Lockers is injured, I'm not sure.

As for Farrell, I don't think he's had that great a season tbh, at least compared to last year. Runs fantastic lines, but just doesn't make a big enough impact in the tackle either in defence or attack, just seems to small. I also rate Makinson very highly though, long before tonight as well. Twice the player Foster is (who I think, as a winger, is appalling).

TS, Joel is a key player in our side. As a second rower. I think myself and most other Wigan fans would have been concerned were he carrying on in the centres next season, one way or another though, I don't think that will be the case.

has madge cost JT his place in the england side?

be honest now.... none of this politics stuff.

Well you've seen Farrell more than me but I hope that he continues to improve. 1st Class pedigree for sure. As for Makinson, he started to impress me long before tonight too. And for Foster, well the jury's still out for me although his defence has to improve on his showings this season.

Madge hasn't, Gleeson and circumstance has. Genuine answer. I think every coach would have done the same in that position.

Well, the period in the first half of the year where Farrell was dropped for a few games, despite having decent games, was apparently because he just wasn't making a big enough impact in the tackle. He often got driven back in the tackle both in attack and defence, you notice it once it's been pointed out.

It's like when King played 2nd row for a few games for you guys, best winger in the league this season, but because you had decent wingers to cover, but no second rowers, he moved positions reducing his effectiveness. We just had to do that over a much longer period.

you f*cking liar

we both know that joel would be right up there in the second rowers for this 4 nations had he had a full season in the 2nd row.

disappointed in you IM...... just admit madge f*cked him up......everyone knows he did.... its ok... he has left now

its nothing like that.... he is a centre anyway



AND he was the best player on the pitch in the 2nd row....AND on the wing... AND in the centre

apart from when we were booing him obviously.

Very grown up post.

FIOS

nice avatar obsessed boy.