I'm sure the Cas fans aren't inpressed with most of their team, they are in the bottom two for gods sake.

Point is doesn't matter is its Longstaff, Dean, Thewliss Wrench, Hayes or ANO - if you are going to pick them, drop them, shunt them round, ship them out on loan, bring them back and not play them and publically criticise them they are unlikely to prosper, are they?

But when he signed they probably thought young kid coming in with much to prove, generally positive. Not sure how he got on today, but so far the reviews on him haven’t been positive, which I can understand. Aside from a nice try against Wigan(?) I haven’t seen anything to suggest he is better than O’Brien or Patton at a similar age. I’m not saying Powell gets it right all the time - far from it and I don’t see the harm in giving Whitehead 15 mins last night for example. But I think he gives the kids a shot more than any Wire manager I can remember for a looong time.

The argument to keep with the incumbent out of fear that the next could be worse is not the most resounding endorsement I have heard. In any case the broad discussion seems to have moved from the generally supportive backing of "give him time" to a polarised "it could be worse" / "who replaces " and "get rid now".

The only certainty in Warrington coaching is that its going to be 69 years and counting at the end of the season.

It's time to roll the dice, last season was only ever going to be acceptable if it meant that this seasons team would be challengers and it just isn't. Powell and his coachjng stagg just aren't capable of turning this mess around.

This explains why we've been in a very challenging rut for some time now.

I suppose an argument to that is that as a youngster, unless you are exceptional in say a Sculthorpe or Shaun Edwards type of way, then you are going to expect to be shunted about and for it to take a while to become a 'regular'?

None of the names you mention have ever put together a consistent run of 5 or 6 good SL level performances - Thewlis, probably the best from your list, still shows signs of being a rookie at times.

Admittedly, the progress of these lads will always be erratic as long as the senior players continue to underperform. It's always a bit of a catch 22, in that young players will develop quicker in a confident, winning side, than in a side on a run like we have been.

Wrench has shown more in 5 games he’s played in than Matautia has in 2 years.

Do you really think so?... I think he looks like he has a lot of potential and in the right environment I think he can kick on to be a good SL player, but I think it's still a big ask to be relying on him - there has to be a balance of not exposing these lads and expecting too much from them too quickly.

Like I say, in a side that's performing better, then I can see an argument for him being in the side regularly, but presently, there is a risk of him being dragged down as the side misfires. Whether we like to admit it or not, a couple of errors and this forum and the terraces would soon be on his back.

That's true, and the piece I quoted from on Dodds said the same thing - Saints fans were on his back demanding he be dropped.

But the Saints coaching team stood firm
They backed him, they put an arm round his shoulder
They protected him

Us? Slag Dean off in a press conference and drop Wrench/Thewliss for Minikin at the first opportunity.

And at the same time describe the "performances" of Dudson and Matautia as class, and deem them updroppable despite damning stats.

It takes some balls from the coach to make brave decisions - and therein lies the problem generally.

Yeah he has pace, good hands, a quick turn of foot and he’s only going to get better. I genuinely cannot recall one game in the time he’s been here where Matautia has stood out. Everytime I watch him his handling is poor, he doesn’t assist or create, he doesn’t score tries, has no pace, he’s lazy in defence. I think he’s genuinely one of the worst players we have signed in the SL era.

Not me, there has to be a realisation, the same with Thewlis and Dean that these players are still young and still learning and they’ll be mistakes and a lack of inexperience along the way. You cannot however use that same arguement for ‘one of the leaders’ Matautia when he charges out the line or goes for the wrong defender like he did on Friday night to gift Wigan a couple of tries.

If I had the choice between wrench matautia it would be wrench all year long..agree the young uns will make mistakes but some of the more experienced members of our team are making more..

Thewlis and Wrench have already made a "couple of errors" and people are still calling for them to be in the team so your sweeping statement is wrong. In my experience our fans love a youngster giving it a go and trying to win a spot. Admittedly the "home grown newness" wears off after a couple of years a la Dec Patton and they end up having their performances discussed and even criticised.

I think you'll be hard pushed to find anyone who would want Minikin and Matautia back should Thewliss and Wrench have a couple of off matches on the bounce. They can't play any worse for Pete's sake (pun intended)

Admittedly they haven't been dropped for Wigan, they are/were injured so mute point for recent match, but sentiment stands for Powell's tenure.

I agree with what you are saying, but its a lot easier being a youngster going into a side at a club with an established record of winning trophies and of blooding and developing young players, than it is at a club where fans are absolutely desperate for success and to have just a couple of young players they can get excited about.

Our problem is that we want every young player who pops up to be the next big thing and that expectation leads to unnecessary pressure, on both the player and for the club in how to handle them.

At clubs like Wigan and Saints, they can simply point to the fans and say look at our record and trust the system - We, sadly, don't have that to fall back on.

Well I think with your last paragraph you've hit your own nail on your own head because our record doesn't stand up to theirs.

So what do we do then learn from it try and emulate or toss it off for players who aren't even journeymen IMO

Matautia or Wrench? There's no need for a debate, as only one of those two should have a future at our club.

Of course you try and emulate them. My point was it's easier to respond to critical fans if you have a proven record that the young players will come good, as is the case with criticism that Dodd was getting from Saints fans - We don't really have that record, do we?

But why do 95% of the fan base see it but the coach doesn’t? Is it ego or stubbornness with Daryl? Genuine question.

Must be for his goalkicking record.

Daryl likes Matautia as in Daryl’s words he can play 1.3,6, 11,13 and what other players can do that? Well, like Peter, I can also play in those positions to a terrible standard. Sky pundits on Friday were highlighting the need for specialist players not one size fits all mediocrity.

There's a reason fans are fans - if they were as knowledgeable as many claim they are, then they'd be coaches too??...

Are you happy with Peter Matautia being a certainty in DP's teams selection?

Not d. When we were winning 8 on the bounce, his place in the team wasn't really an issue, now we aren't doing so well, it seems its all down to him apparently?

Personally, I think our problems right now go a lot further than it simply being about having Matautia in the team or not.

Of course it's easier IF you have the record.

I'm sorry if my point was too subtle but as we don't have that record and neither does this coach here then let's just crack on doing the same old same old and see how that works.out shall we?

Get beat v Wakefield and he'd rightly need his position at this club assessed IMO.

I'm looking for a sign a sign of improvement a sign that we are moving in the right direction and to get this thread back on topic rather than the usual anti Powell cat calling making the most of your resources is one of the first things that the coach needs to address.

They are his resources BTW including the clubs younger players where apparently at Cas that seemed to be one of his suits

Don’t feed the trolls, it will only encourage them.