Allan Bateman, it would have been great if he`d come along during our present era. You couldn`t ask for a more elusive running centre with a side step to admire that hit you like a train, he certainly tackled well above his size.

Its KING all the way theres no competition a player with a massive heart who wants to play for his club. Gleeson well what i want 2 say about him will get me banned from the site!!!!!

Matt King for me,even though his first season which he would admit himself was pretty average he has certainly proved his class now..

Gleeson just went through the motions for Wire IMO.

TKL's defence was poor even though in his first spell for us he was exciting with the ball in hand.

Hear hear. Class player, amazing really knowing we were "skint" at the time.

King played on't wing for a lot of his career. He achieved a lot before even coming over here.

Today's RLFans Made-Up-Fact.

Also apparently we had him locked-up in a cellar to force him to sign his extension to the contract.

Bewfore Wigan offered us a lot of money for him we had agreed to release him from his contract for nothing to go to Australia.


Back on topic difficult to say as King after awful form in his first season has been excellent. Gleeson was very good but did drop in form towards the end of his spell and does not appear to have re-gained his elusive footwork. Toa showed masses of potential but in truth never really delivered on that.

Overall for Warrington I would say Gleeson but if King has a good season again next year he will move ahead of him.

One thing King did in his bad first season was he scored a decent number of tries even though his form wasn't good, like Andy Cole in his early years at United when everybody was mocking him for being not the player he was at Newcastle, he still managed to find the net at a decent rate, so when he did come in to form his career strike rate looked excellent. Kings first season was a disappointment but not a disaster for me, and the fact he kept his hand in with tries and assists means overall his career for Wire looks very good.

I thought Toa did deliver on his potential, for a few years he was one of SL's top players, injuries took their toll on him when he was still in his mid 20s and he was never the same from about 2003 onwards. The other unfortunate thing was that when he was at his peak he wasn't playing in a top side. If he'd been at Saints or Bradford during his peak years he'd have been knocking on 25-30 tries a season and would have got noticed by the NZ Test selectors.

Yeh its suprising that we could afford him with all the money that Wigan, Leeds and Widnes were throwing around at the time, he was one of them rare players thats worth the admission money alone like Jonathon Davies, Phil Blake, Des Drummond and Les Boyd etc ..... X factor players so to speak.

You mean his NSW and Australian career, certainly not Melbourne.

TKL had 2.. maybe 3 seasons where he outperformed both King and Gleeson in their peak seasons for us.... For sheer explosiveness with ball in hand i would go TKL everytime.

King has been solid these last few season.. without really setting the world onfire... i will be honest.. i had expected more of him... dont get me wrong he has been good for us... but i think he will be easy to replace when he has gone.

Gleeson was decent... but like others have said... he played like he wasn't overly interested.

I would choose Bateman over all of them in a heartbeat though.

Good shout, Rob Wire
Five years of 100% commitment from Bateman (as well as being excellent), none of the commitment issues of Gleeson and (v early) King, a better tackler than all three mentioned (I remember him "dealing" with Tuigamala on a couple of occasions), probably faster than all 3, drank a lot less than a certain centre. Don't forget, this is also a guy who came from a (not hugely different, but still...) different sport.

Asides Bateman, I'd have loved to have seen Gleeson in our ranks , under a disciplinarian.
TKL blotted his Wire copybook, when other sides came sniffing, plus his tackling technique at times was woeful.
King just wasted his first season and the first 2 months of the next season. Again, would have been a lot better under a disciplinarian.

Sorry Sal, glaring omission, Bateman for me, too

Bateman also. I remember that game at Cas when we were down to 11 at one point, after Maguire basically decided he was getting sent off. Bateman was brilliant that day. Bandaged head an all.

Toa, King, Gleeson for me.

I think i expected too much from Gleeson, King has gradually got better and is now performing to expectations, but i think Sally hit the nail on the head, IF Toa was in the side we have now, i think he'd be far far better rated by most than King/Gleeson .

king
gleeson
tkl
for me king has been brilliant over the past 2 years and shown the quality we had expected to get plus he can pair with any winger or go on the wing himself ans still be that same quality.

i was always a fan of gleeson as i dont really like off the pitch antics going ahead of his ability when people talk about him, we was a brilliant player for us and him and h. fa fili on the wing was one of the best partnerships in the league without a doubt

tkl was a good player but i just prefer the other 2 tbh

The reason I didn't include Bateman is for these debates I'm trying to choose players in about the same ability range, so that some fans will say one and some will say another - as you can see once somebody on here mentioned Bateman, everybody says he was better than the other three.

I can't think of an equivalent player to Bateman....the closest would be Davies but he was probably a level above. Can anybody think of a 'challenger' to put up against Bateman who would cause some debate as to who was better....?

one missing out on the debate, would be Ronnie Duane, who oused GB class, and his injury on that GB tour wirtually stopped his career stone dead. Great Player

If pressed to make a decision it would have to TKL. He had it all; strength, speed and a geat step. He was comfortable slipping the ball away, it is her where he truly seperates himself. He had great ability in showing the ball and pulling in the opposition winger, giving his man outside plenty of room to work with.

He is often cited as being a bit 'loose' with his arm when defending, but it is my opinion that the stigma has remained with him from the very early part of his career, unfairly.

Phil Blake.

Blake oosed class, but couldn't tackle to save his life (mind you, you didn't play Phil Blake for his defence), so no-where near Bateman

For those too young, YouTube him, and look out for the try in a mudbath......unbelievable.

Yes the high tackling went after 2001. He got sent off in the first game of the season at Wigan and then a few months later he did it against Salford and got banned again and everybody used to say he was a thug....after that I can't remember him being in any more trouble. When he went to Hull he tidied his game up and he wasn't a problem when he came back to us second time round, his defence overall was tighter as well I thought second time around. Unfortunately it was when he was at Hull that he started getting injuries so his attacking threat diminished, instead of becoming the complete centre he became a solid player rather than a great one.

For me it has to be TKL. Quality step and offload to his winger in attack, and brutal in defence. One of my favourite memories was in the semi final at widnes against Wigan. Brett Dallas was returning a deep kick downfield and pulled up with a hamstring pull, he waved his hand and then went down to submit for the tackle. A lot of players would have just laid his hand on him to complete the tackle, but Toa smashed him with elbows knees and everything. A bit uncalled for but I liked it

I also think some fans are too bitter towards Gleeson. Personally, I thought that when we played well, Gleeson was integral to the performance. The collective up's and down's of the team, especially in 07 and 08 sometimes made it appear that he wasn't interested. However, to judge him only in those shathouse performances would be a little unfair, as the team as a whole never looked interested either.

Matt King has proved his worth. He's not always stand out, but when he is, jesus mary and Joseph! The semi final against Wigan last year demonstrated the reasons why I am very pleased to have him in our ranks. He's obviously more of a Senior mould, and equally as devastating in full flow. He's a completely different centre to Gleeson and certainly Toa. But he's as good as they get in terms of power and size.

Onto Toa, and in his prime, he was probably better than both in my opinion. My only wish is that he'd been part of our current team because he had that unreal footwork ability and pace off the mark. I will always remember the try he scored against St Helens in our home defeat of 1996. The way he hit Bennett's pass at 100mph and his sidestep around Prescott is one of the most natural and pleasurable tries I can recall.

To conclude, I'll put Toa and Gleeson first but only marginally. But if King sticks around for a couple more years, I'll possibly have altered my view come that time....

Everyone appears to have forgotten that TKL could not tackle to save his life. He was explosive ball in hand, but defensively shocking. Not a good enough all rounder for me. Certainly not NZ test material.

Gleeson was a very good defender and an outstanding attacker, but always appeared to believe he was too good for us and I never like that about him. I remember his first year with us very favourably however, and he would be at the top of my 3 for overall talent. Application in the latter stages however left much to be desired though.

King.. What an odd turnaround. He was frankly awful in his first year, though Kevin Penny didnt help being his wing-man. The last two years for me however have proved what a player he is. Not blessed with speed or a step like MG or TKL, but through hieght, brute strength, and excellent vision makes him a class act. Would love to see a bit more aggression from him - bit more of an animal.

1. King
2. Gleeson
3. TKL

Matt King, started showing the form which made him a starting centre for Oz. I loved Toa's sidestep and Gleeson formed that incredible centre-wing pairing with Fa'afili, but for me the fact whenever you give Kingy the ball you feel anything can happen- It's Matt King for Me

Toa Kohe Love (in his first period at the club) was comfortably better than the other two. He even finished as SL top try scorer in a team that underperformed.