Following on from the Bulls debacle and mismanagement, Rugby Leaguer suggests Warrington are running substantial losses which are being ''covered'' by Simon Moran.
I don't understand - I thought we were in good financial health.

We have a large turnover so the £1.65M salary cap is far less than 50%.

I know Moran has pumped cash in at various times through his companies ( in the early years) but I can't believe that - being a very astute businessman - he'd let that situation continue for long.

Can anyone clarify?

I should imagine the vast majority of professional sporting clubs in this country are running at a loss. Some are lucky to have a sugar-daddy, God knows how others keep going, especially in lower leagues on the crowds they get.

Maybe it is time that a big name club went to the wall..Glasgow Rangers, Bradford Bulls ( Hope not), just to show other clubs how not to be financially run.

Wigan fans will smell this thread like a juicy steak and kidney pie.

With the truth being available to anybody willing to spend £1.50 on each year's accounts you'd hope that journalists would be willing to do a little bit of research to discover the truth.

However having to spend £6 or so would probably wipe our Rugby Leaguer's research budget for the year.

Peter Hood shouldn't be allowed to spread malicious false gossip about how other clubs run their businesses. Just because he's made (and is continuing to make) and a mess at Bradford, doesn't mean everyone is. As you say the accounts clearly state any director's cash inputs and the idea that we need constant propping up with millions of pounds is ridiculous. We've even made a profit some years recently!

Published accounts never give an accurate view of a businesses financial status.
Only the board will know the true picture, no point speculating.

Yup. Apparently Bradfords accounts showed them in the black due to fixed assets etc, the problem is they haven't actually got any cash to pay players or creditors. Only the Bradford board knew how far up creek they were, and they conveniently waited until they had the licence renewal before they shed any light on this.

Hopefully the rugby league community will rally round us after reading this and fans from all clubs will contribute funds to help us out.

After all no matter what club you support RL is a great family and nobody wants to see another club go to the wall.

Sue the s.

If he took the time to visit www.duedil.com (free companies house information) and searched for Warrington Sports Holdings Limited he would see that we made a profit of £211,108 for 2010 and a profit of £27,783 for 2009. No accounts data for 2011 available for free at the moment, but if he has some spare cash from the supporters he's fleecing he could pay for them. Bradford turnover for 2010 £3,956,715 Warrington turnover for 2010 £6,016,839 We might actually have a loss showing for 2011 but if we have it's down to building 2 new corners while the going is good. Quote Wigan fans will smell this thread like a juicy steak and kidney pie.'" Not if they take a look at Wigan Rugby League Club Limited.

If he took the time to visit www.duedil.com (free companies house information) and searched for Warrington Sports Holdings Limited he would see that we made a profit of £211,108 for 2010 and a profit of £27,783 for 2009. No accounts data for 2011 available for free at the moment, but if he has some spare cash from the supporters he's fleecing he could pay for them. Bradford turnover for 2010 £3,956,715 Warrington turnover for 2010 £6,016,839 We might actually have a loss showing for 2011 but if we have it's down to building 2 new corners while the going is good. Quote Wigan fans will smell this thread like a juicy steak and kidney pie.'" Not if they take a look at Wigan Rugby League Club Limited.

So basically we can't trust published accounts anymore? I appreciate theyll always be dodgy punters but to suggest theyre often lies? FCUK me. I've heard some crap on these boards.

As for Hood, like SEB said. He's the last person to get on his high horse. I'd sooner take financial advice from Brewster.

It's not that published accounts are lies but it's easy for a company's accounts to disguise its underlying financial problems.

Portsmouth FC, Glasgow Rangers and all the major banks that went bust were publishing their accounts every year but still it took everyone by surprise when they got into trouble, but that trouble had been brewing for a long time.

Didn't we self-fund the extension? We truly mustn't have a pot to in.

Published accounts are never lies, merely one interpretation of the truth.

People aren't actually taking this seriously are they? There is absolutely no correlation between Warrington and the state that Bradford are in. As I mentioned its not a case of 'lies', just that Bradford have assets which made their books balance, the problem is they have no actual cash. ie if you own a 100k house bought and paid for that doesn't mean you can go and buy 100k worth of Greggs meat and potato, you would have to sell the assets before you had the actual cash for the sweet sweet pies.

The only time Warrington would ever have to worry is if Moran walked away, ala Ambramovich at Chelsea.

Well if that is the situation then it is not sustainable.

I would hope that the club has taken advantage of Simon Moran's investment to set itself up so that it doesn't rely on subsidy from the owner and that further investments by him are a bonus not necessary to stay afloat.

Seriously though, as long as Simon is doing well for himself can anyone ever see him walking away from the club?

If i had his money and was doing really well for myself i would never walk away, why would i ?

He might get bored of all the Grand Finals we keep winning.

Precisely. Nail on head. We are nothing like Chelsea.

Maybe the Chelsea comparison was a bit extreme, but I think the basic point is sound. Without Moran we probably wouldn't implode like Bradford, but we wouldn't be able to compete at the highest level - ie consistently hit the salary cap and finish in the top 4-6.

As Mr Yed said though why would Moran ever walk away? Warrington fans have absolutely nowt to worry about, its time to relax and enjoy the ride.

If Abramovich owned Warrington then serious questions would be being asked of Tony Smith right now after the shocking way we have started the season.

Nah, its all circumstantial. Haven't we technically had a better start points-wise this season over last?

I do get your point though, Moran isn't the megalomaniac tyrant that Abramovich is, I just used that as its the only sporting comparison that came close to fitting. The bottom line is though without Moran I think we would be an outfit who struggled to make the playoffs. Regardless of how self sufficient we're trying to be, a sugar daddy like Moran in the background goes a long way.

Well you sir, don't know Warrington's set up. Profit is measured after capital introduced, not before. So therefore with Warrington making a profit in both 2009 & 2010 (2011 figures not yet released) I'd safely say we are sustainable without a cash angel that Moran can be. Not that I'd deny he has cause and effect on some things that happen. But he still takes out exactly what he puts in the club.

Expect a reverse in 2011, those corners were self-funded by the club covered by capital already invested and extra sponsorship generated.

If Warrington were close to going bust in our current state, the best business run club in SL, you might as well pack in RL as a professional sport! Hood is just a bob end trying to deflect criticism from his own shortcomings. Tosspot.

As I made the original post, I'll add my 'two penneth'.

Firstly let me say that Moran has been fantastic for the Wolves and Warrington as a town.
I think the growth of the club and significant increase in turnover has been due to moving to HJ (doubling of the average gate) plus use of the stadium and facilities for such things as football training / NHS health trust.

With a turnover of £6m+ (as posted earlier) then the £1.65m cap is only ~25%, as opposed to the Bulls case of nearer 50%.

I've not looked at the Wire accounts from the last couple of years but seem to remember seeing in the accounts a few years ago under 'income' a (5 figure?) sum from SJM Holdings (as in maybe paying for the use of facilities or maybe sponsorship of some sort).
That's the sort of 'item' that could be viewed as 'soft'. Maybe that's what the rag was trying to pick up on.

I suppose they don't make specific claims because they don't have any real evidence and it's easy to target clubs who are now successful.

Come on the Wire

Nothing to do with prize money??