The big four clubs in English rugby league are obviously Wigan, Leeds, Saints and - despite their recent problems - Bradford. It's therefore no real surprise that those teams have taken up every single Grand Final spot with the exception of Hull's in 2006 since its inception, and have won all of them.

For me we're in the second tier alongside Hull. Plenty of potential - Hull even moreso than us if we're being honest - but it never quite gets realised. Always the bridesmaid, never the bride. We've both been able to win Challenge Cups in the last few years but when it comes to taking the next step up we've failed. It's almost as if the shirt you pull on tells you what you're going to achieve before you've even done it. Saints, Wigan and Leeds all belong in the Grand Final. Warrington don't.

Over the next few years I fully expect us to return to our natural level, which is the middle to lower reaches of the play off positions if its a top eight format, or a struggle to get into the play offs if its a smaller format. It's where we belong.

Go on Wire prove me wrong if you can.

Depressed 'ere.

We beat Leeds in the play-offs once, don't think we'll see the likes of those days again...

Spot on really i'm afraid !

Getting carried away here DM. Win 2 games and we are the bride as you put it. Poor performance, I think it's fair to say everyone's disappointed but back on the horse next week against Hull/Hudds and then hopefully Wigan or Saints the week after.

jeeze anyone got a butter knife???

we lost one game yes all be it in the playoffs but we are still alive and we are still fighting.

i guess you would not go to old trafford if we made it as we dont belong there and would make you a hypocrite

When I started reading, I thought it was sal on a wind-up (on my phone, so it only shows the author at the end). Jeez, DM, throw the baby out with the bath-water, why don't you?

We are one of the big four clubs and we have the trophies to prove it. However last season was our best chance to win the title as we played the best rugby I had seen from our team.

This year we have been unconvincing in comparison.

Still surprised last night happened but it ended up speaking volumes. Seems some teams just know how to get the GF and we are not one of them.

"big club" is just a title. Saints are one of these big clubs and have won absolutely nothing for 4 years. I am happy to go on winning silverware and let other people decide if we're are a big club or not.

That's one depressed guy!

Can anybody please remind how Wigan's victorious 2010 play off campaign actually unfolded from week 1 through to the final at Old Trafford??....

Oh do get a grip. We lost a game against the team that have made the grand final the past 6 consecutive years. We had a terrible night last night but it isn't the end of the world.

I am willing to bet that we will beat Hudds/Hull next week, quote me on that. We will then probably end up at Langtree Park where we will play infinitely better than yesterday. If we travel to Leeds then we face a team that we spanked in the CC final a mere few weeks ago.

We can't play Leeds before OT. It's Hull/Hudds and if we win, Saints/Wigan depending who Wigan pick out of us/Hull/Hudds or Catalans/Leeds.

Good god I thought I was gutted last night but the OP has me looking for the nearest cliff to jump off..!
Around this time last year we'd won the LLS went into the playoff's in great form and smashed Huddersfield in the first round..! We all know what happened after that..

Now we're faced with a different senario Wire were beaten by a better team last night but we have another chance this could be what we needed and we hopefully have the 2 Benny's to come back, our pack is considerably weaker without them...The players now have to respond and i think they will...

Get a grip mate, surrender monkey! your not Italian are you ?

Well enjoy the fairy story that we are on, it's like Sheffield Eagles in 1998 but we have done it three times, has there ever been an underdog club be able to punch above its weight like us in the history of rugby league?

I think in the modern world of sport where it is just dominated by big clubs and money it is such a great inspiration for a small backwater team with nothing other than spirit and courage to take on the best and be in the mix.

Big clubs like Bradford might look down on us but I reckon secretly their fans would love to be where we are.

Underdog club? Comparing yourself to Sheffield? WTF? That's like Man City fans comparing their recent trophies to Wimbledon's FA Cup... Remind me how much money you've spent on signing players compared to the rest of the league over the last few years?

And as for the OP - get a bleedin' grip mate. It's largely because of the likes of you and your wild mood and expectation swings that your team always struggles so much come the playoffs. You will start rightly as favourites to beat us in 2 weeks' time and then you get to stomp all over a limited team who you always beat on a pitch at O/T that suits your style down to the ground to do the double. Maybe if your fans showed a bit more moderation in their support and got behind their team come what may then you could actually lift the trophy that you should be lifting in 3 weeks.

Yes of course how silly of me. All our fans need to do is think we will win and hey presto..the title is ours.

.....and Sally hooks another one nice and clean....

This is getting too easy Sally... like carp to sweetcorn...

What a doom and gloom thread this is,Only for the fact sally hooked another one i would of been slitting my wrists before now!!


Last week we was the only team that could go on and claim the double,you know what nothing has changed this week we still can a few more positives are all thats needed..

is this a wind up

I don't know what's more surprising:-

1 - That of all the people to start a thread like this, it's DM (one of my favourite posters) who, to me, comes across as level headed, composed and with a good grip on the nature of watching sport and the way it "works". That he should post what he has, well, I wonder if someone's hacked his account or whether the entire account is a wind up. If it is, it makes me sad.
2 - There are still people who fall for Sally Cinnamon.
3 - People think that what supporters believe, be it cocky or whatever, has any part to play whatsoever in the outcome of sporting contests.

Probably 1, 3 and 2 in that order.

We got beat by a team who've contested the last 7 Grand Finals. On any definition, they are experts at winning these games. We've won 2 of our last 10. On any definition, we are not. I suspect we'll get another go at Saints in a few weeks. If they beat us, it won't be because of some mythical pre-ordained order, or some hoodoo, or because we're cocky. It'll be because they played better than we did. As for returning to our proper place - this is professional sport. Success or otherwise is dictated, to a large extent, by finances. We have that. As long as that remains (and it isn't dependent on Moran) and we keep the right people running the club (the other primary factor) we'll be there or there abouts.

we are unbeaten at langtree park all be it 1 game

but we have only won once at hj v saints so maybe playing at lp isnt a bad thing

im still confident anyways

Arf. Frustration innit.

Being serious I remember in my teens and early twenties going to watch Wire regularly and if I'm being brutally honest I didn't really care when we lost because in the bigger picture it meant nothing anyway. Yeah, obviously I wanted us to win - especially in derby matches - but we were never likely to either win a trophy or get relegated so come the end of the season it would simply be normal service.

Now the expectation levels have been raised considerably and the standard of rugby I'm watching every week is an awful lot better, I really hate these play off things!