You started off by saying Salford has a bad image and the club should change its name to Manchester.

Then you say any club whose supporters are from the North won't get sponsorship.

How's changing the name to Manchester going to help then?

Firstly, the conversation started about the possibility of your owner snapping up various sports club all around the Manchester area - I offered the opinion (admittedly in a unsubtle way) that if he was planning some sporting superbrand, then the name Manchester would be easier to sell to possible sponsors, than Salford.

I've then offered the opinion that the main problem our sport has in marketing itself nationally, is that it is almost unique in being a sport based in a very narrow strip of the country.... Asking people outside of the north of England, to take an interest in something that culturally has nothing to do with them is always going to be a big ask - I don't know of any other major sport in this country that has this problem?

Whether we disagree with it, or not, the north of England DOES have a certain image to those outside of the area, and RL is ingrained in that image..... From a positive point of view, the more Marwan Koukash's and Simon Moran's that the sport can attract, the better, in terms of trying to pull out of that shadow, but I really feel its always going to be an uphill struggle on that score.

Has the Salford club been struggling to find sponsors in recent years?


Yes, the problem the sport has in marketing itself nationally is that it is perceived as a northern sport. That's not really relevant to your argument that Salford and those other willing mergees should change their name to Manchester though.


Again, yes, but again not relevant to your Salford to Manchester argument. I'd also argue that it needs more Marwans than it does Morans. Marwan publicises the club and the sport as a whole whenever he can. Simon Moran doesn't. He just inflicts Take That on us. Time to step up to the plate, Simon.

I'm not sure how many sponsors you have had in recent years, but the fact that you wouldn't exist without Koukash's intervention, tells me that your cash inflow wasn't that great?

As for the whole Salford/Manchester thing, well its all hypothetical, but it would be a more accurate description of the relevant parts to call a Salford/Swinton/Oldham/Rochdale merger, Manchester than Salford.... Whatever the reality may be (and it probably depends on where your loyalties lie), nearly everybody outside Salford sees yourselves as the very junior neighbour to Manchester.

As for Marwan's and Simon Moran's influence on the sport, well, while all publicity is welcome, at the moment most people still sense Koukash has the whiff of a Robert Maxwell about him.... Yes, he could indeed be a major player in our sport in the coming years, but to detract from Moran's achievement in turning Warrington RLFC from a shambles of a club, into one of the most admired in the sport, simply because he hasn't got a huge ego, is a bit of nonsense (though I do sense you may have had a bit of tongue-in-cheek when you said it?)

Lack of sponsorship is not our main problem.
Name change to Manchester would not bring any benefit.
Salford, Swinton, Oldham, Rochdale cannot join to form a 'superclub'.

What our club needs is:

1) An improved team, competitive most weeks ( 20014 - 20015)
2) Better engagement between the club and existing fans (see other thread)
3) Improved access to stadium grounds by having a second entry/exit route across the canal ( late 2014)
4) Direct access to M60 from car park (2015)
5) Development of area around stadium to provide more facilities for visitors
6) Landscaping of stadium grounds ( hopefully with some Willow trees) to improve visual appearance of the stadium site.
7) Implement phase 2 and 3 of the stadium plan to give a much better atmosphere in the ground.

These things might take years but they could all happen.
Any links with Swinton, Oldham and Rochdale should be cooperation that benefits all clubs but allows each to maintain its identity.

Disgraceful statement to follow on from your poor efforts firstly to second guess the intentions of the man on the unsubstantiated rumours reported in a newspaper and then seriously slurring Salford and its inhabitants.
Your own club has recently gained Emirates as a sponsor.In soccer they have ventured into the crime free zone that is London,a place down south last time I looked,and north to Manchester.
The reason rich individuals like Dr Koukash don't sponsor rugby league may be because people like your have taken it upon themselves to insult him.Even on the Leeds forum they couldn't resist despite the topic under discussion being the player who the England camp attempted to evoke sympathy for but whom it seems breached discipline,as per Gareth Hock,but there the similarities end.
How many opposition fans at how many different clubs is that,now ?
You must be the only individual who can compare Dr Koukash to Maxwell or Sir John Hall.


Excellent post Red John.I like reading your posts.Keep 'em coming.

Well done 'ave It - Takes a real man to apologise !

The similarity I drew with Maxwell was simply that before the truth came out about him, Maxwell was a huge egotist, who lived on the oxygen of publicity (Surely, even you can acknowledge there is a bit about your new owner there?) - His numerous ventures into football were often accompanied by massive promises, which never materialised.

While I'm not suggesting that Koukash is anything near the crooked levels that Maxwell was, to quite a few observers he appears to be a man who has his fingers in many pies, with his undeniable charisma being able to carry it all along.... For the good of Salford RLFC and Rugby League in general, we have to hope he is the real deal and not the fraud that Maxwell was, because if you promise so much and fail to deliver, then it can leave a bad smell.

Maybe, and I'm as guilty as anybody, it is a RL fan's paranoia to question anything that seems too good to be true, with regard to their sport.... Many neutral observers, and even a few of your own fans, must privately think why a man who admits to have had no interest in the sport and even less in your club, should be willing to invest so much into it - Though, has I have said before, I hope it goes well, because if Koukash succeeds then it could spark interest in other similarly ego-driven businessmen to dip their toe into our sport.

Blimey, that's pessimistic - 18,000 years before we're competitive again.

That's allowing for the traffic

Sorry for the delay in replying.I was waiting to see published a comment by Ryan Hall in the Yorkshire press regarding the removal of Hardaker from the England squad,in a similar vein to his comment concerning Gareth Hock.I don't think it's going to happen.
Team togetherness ! On a par with the rugby league family.

I think the expression is 'revisionist history' where you remark on Robert Maxwell.Don't,whatever you do,take into consideration the thoughts and feelings of members of the Koukash family when,without any foundation,you vilify his character on this forum.Forget,also,that he is almost certainly one of the frequent flyers on Emirates to his business interests in Dubai.( He,and his family,must be one of your club sponsors best customers )

Like many people he was turned on to rugby league when he first observed the sport.Is that wrong ?
I don't think one needs to be a businessman to be ego-driven.
I am still at a loss to understand why Dr Koukash has been singled out,amongst all the owners of rugby league clubs,to be subjected to such vitriol.
All of this thread has been conjecture based on something which may never happen.
Quite remarkable - as the late David Coleman may have said.

Fans witter on all day long that RL is too parochial yet immediately berate a man who has come from outside and fallen in love with the game. Is it not strange that everyone has this great vision for the future of our sport involving change at the top, restructure, injection of money etc yet when someone comes in and says he'll do that, he is told he has to do it the 'Traditional' way? That he's dreaming. That he'll never succeed?

He has his character questioned by those who know nothing of it. He has his finances questioned by those same people. Even our RL Media poke fun.

It's no wonder new money are hesitant to dip their toes into RL...

Great Dita' s slot meter
Guessing you were one of the many who used to ask the question what do Salford bring to Super League well we now have a guy who only last week was talking Rugby League to the world's sporting media at the biggest sporting event in Australia (Melbourne Cup) and he is now accused of being on an ego trip.
Now wonder we are regarded as a little Northern sport.

Ps. I've often heard people who sell concert tickets described as ticket touts but I wouldn't link
everybody who sells music events as a ticket tout.

Well said but for the love of Allah please put a space after each , or . so it's a bit easier to read.

Thank you please.

Coleman still with us PAW - a mere 87 yo. Lives in Alderley Edge I think.

Thank you,for that.I am so sorry and must apologise.Don't know what I was thinking.
Been a bad couple of weeks with the passing of Lou Reed,who wrote a song covered by Mott The Hoople and the ineffable Ian Hunter,and of course,Steve Prescott.
I must have been on autopilot.Apologies to anyone I may have offended.

You know what - I hope Marwan keeps ruffling feathers and sticks two fingers up to the all the idiots questioning his intentions. Last time I checked, we as UK citizens had the freedom to purchase what we wanted. To have so much interest about our "little club" from the RFL, pundits and other supporters should be welcomed - this only proves we are now very much a force in SL.

Without wishing to prove your point, your statement is a tad premature IMO.

Interesting times no doubt, you will certainly be better off on the pitch than in recent years with your new set up and a full pre season under Noble, all without the threat of oblivion.

I'm not saying where you'll finish, or what you will/won't win, or what would be considered to be a successful campaign based on recent investments, but, the proof of whether you are "very much a force in SL" or not might be better judged at the end of the season, rather than before a ball is kicked.

It looks like there may be the possibility that after a meeting tonight you can grace the Swinton forum with your views.Or should that be [url=http://www.totalrl.com/forums/index.php/topic/245501-manchester-rlfc/Manchester ?[/url

Re-brand as Manchester as Salford has a bad reputation.

Jason Papilli – mugged in Manchester
Billy Slater – attacked in Manchester

That'll help!

While Spelly is off on his travels watching World Cup games it seems there is a winding-up order on Swinton to be heard in January.Deja vu.
There may be some egg being wiped from faces and an over-indulgence in the eating of a certain pie should Dr Koukash rush to the rescue.

Swinton fans are talking about a merger of sorts with Manchester RLFC. It may well not be true because it was first reported in the Evening Speculator, but it's a bizarre one if it is because it sees a semi-pro club merge with a recently formed amateur one. And does the Swinton borough of Salford even have a border with Manchester? I'm not sure that it does.

If Marwan did buy Swinton, surely it would make sense to move them to the SCS. And I wouldn't be surprised to see them become some kind of unofficial feeder club to Salford. They could refer to themselves as the Pale Pinks then.

Interesting times.

I would hope that if Marwan does indeed buy Swinton, he keeps the Lions tag and preserves their history as he has done with us. Whilst it would seem logical to move them into the Salford City Stadium initially it would make more sense to look at building them a new stadium within the M27 postcode, I know they’ve already identified a piece of land in Agecroft at present to develop. Hopefully the new facility could then accommodate Folly Lane ARLFC and include a couple of community pitches. I like the model which FC United have adopted, I know they’ve secured funding from the likes of Sport England, Manchester Council, Manchester College and the Football Foundation. Therefore, it potentially wouldn’t cost Marwan much personally particularly if he can get Salford City Council and the RFL on board.

All of the above could benefit Salford Red Devils immensely, as it would hopefully encourage more youngsters to play the sport whilst providing them with better facilities to develop, these players would then be signed up to Swinton with the cream of the crop eventually signing for Salford. It could vice versa too, any of our youngsters who aren’t quite ready for Super League could sign 12/24 months contracts with Swinton.

It’s potentially a win-win situation that could benefit both clubs as well as the city enormously.

Good post JGR. Would be great for the game in Salford/Swinton area and would re-ignite interest which is surely still there to be tapped. A strong local scene and a strong Swinton can only help matters both for RL in the area but as a whole too.

Well, one Swinton fan is reporting - from a reliable source, as usual (why are RL clubs so leaky?) - that there's to be a takeover by an unnamed racehorse owning millionaire who already has an interest in another club, and a move to an unnamed stadium in the Barton district of Salford.

The mystery deepens. What could it all mean?


I can't see a move back into Swinton being on the cards any time soon. I suspect the City of Salford feels it had its fingers burnt over the SCS and will be reluctant to cough up more money to build another stadium, while the RFL won't be too keen to be seen to be bailing out a club by building a stadium for it. Once you've done it for one club, the others will want the same treatment. Also I can't see the logic of providing the citizens of Salford with another stadium when we already have one that's only used for rugby once a week in the summer, and for Fat Lads All Pile On once a fortnight during the winter. If Marwan is to buy the SCS, he'll want it to become self-sustaining, and will want to "sweat the asset" (ugh - managerspeak).

I understand what you're saying, but Salford City Council would only be required to provide maybe £1.5million towards an approximate £5million construction cost. I know for a fact they're spending the same and more on other facilities througout the city (because I'm working on them). Various other funding streams could also be tapped into such as Sport England etc whilst obtaining partnerships with Salford City College and Salford University would help.

The logic would be that unlike the AJ Bell Stadium (it's not even called Salford City Stadium anymore) this would be a genuine community facility that could be used by various sports teams in the area including Folly Lane ARLFC. If they're looking at an Agecroft site, why couldnt Salford City FC move in? Moor Lane is falling down around them as we speak. Not only this but you could include something similar to what Hull KR have done with their new North Stand, which has a "first-class training facility" equipped with the latest technology for IT, business and engineering courses and apprenticeships. They deliver apprenticeships in business and administration, IT, graphic arts and customer service qualifications. In addition, a range of community learning courses will be taught in the new centre, from arts and crafts, music, English and maths, leadership and management to teaching assistant training qualification. There are 17 classrooms, with enough space for 150 learners. The AJ Bell Stadium isnt a community facility as much as it isnt Salford RLFC's stadium, therefore I disagree that the citizens of Salford already have a "community stadium".

I agree however that Swinton need to move into the AJ Bell Stadium as a matter of urgency initially, but if they're to succeed and grow there is no future for them there. Since leaving Station Road the club has continued to decline, co-incidence, I think not. By keeping them out of Swinton Marwan will be flogging a dead horse, he has the potential to do something fantastic not only for Swinton Lions but the city as a whole with a new community stadium. Whether he does it or not remains to be seen.