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| Quote ="Catalancs"They won't let Samuels anywhere near a rugby legaue club. Many clubs have had one or more idiots run them into debt as many posters on here well know.'"
The ' real ' story will probably never come out , was he really as bad as he has been portraid , or was he , how shall we say ' misled '
One thing is probably for certain doing something as an act of ' revenge ' against an organisation that upset you isn't a good enough reason to be allowed,to run a RL club , if in the future we ' expand ' again lets hope its done better |
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| Quote ="Catalancs"They won't let Samuels anywhere near a rugby legaue club. Many clubs have had one or more idiots run them into debt as many posters on here well know.'"
Did he not already have previous though? |
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You mean with what he did with the union club? As Crusaders were a lower league club at the time I have a feeling the RFL turned a blind eye. A mistake which shouldn't be repeated.
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| Quote ="Catalancs"You mean with what he did with the union club? As Crusaders were a lower league club at the time I have a feeling the RFL turned a blind eye. A mistake which shouldn't be repeated.'"
Setting them up was one thing and in fairness looked like a great project but as soon as he made noises about leaving if no SL (3 years in) they should of smelt a rat! |
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I'm loath to say to much on the matter as my own club have had financial problems in the past including six figure debts.
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Quote ="Starbug"The ' real ' story will probably never come out , was he really as bad as he has been portraid , or was he , how shall we say ' misled '
One thing is probably for certain doing something as an act of ' revenge ' against an organisation that upset you isn't a good enough reason to be allowed,to run a RL club , if in the future we ' expand ' again lets hope its done better'"
I think it is already being done better. The people at Wrexham have their heads screwed on a lot better than the people who ran things in Bridgend in 2007 and 2008 especially. The 2009 incmubants tried to pick up the pieces but didn't do it in the right way and helped to dig the already large hole even larger. Hopefully, the club will now be able to have some kind of positive re-start. 2010 wasn't a re-start, it was the same club in a different location and I think everyone's aware of that now.
Plus of course there's South Wales Scorpions who are being started in the way Crusaders should have been. There's no rush to get to Super League or even the Championship, we're developing at our own pace and using 95% local players. Scorpions new head coach will be revealed in a couple of hours time and it will be positive news again for the development of Welsh players. The club will also be announcing at least one more Welsh-born youngster being added to the squad too plus there's open trials this Sunday where over 40 (weather permitting) will be taking part. All this is being revealed at www.scorpionsrl.com soon so keep your eyes on it. |
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Quote ="Starbug"The ' real ' story will probably never come out , was he really as bad as he has been portraid , or was he , how shall we say ' misled '
One thing is probably for certain doing something as an act of ' revenge ' against an organisation that upset you isn't a good enough reason to be allowed,to run a RL club , if in the future we ' expand ' again lets hope its done better'"
I think it is already being done better. The people at Wrexham have their heads screwed on a lot better than the people who ran things in Bridgend in 2007 and 2008 especially. The 2009 incmubants tried to pick up the pieces but didn't do it in the right way and helped to dig the already large hole even larger. Hopefully, the club will now be able to have some kind of positive re-start. 2010 wasn't a re-start, it was the same club in a different location and I think everyone's aware of that now.
Plus of course there's South Wales Scorpions who are being started in the way Crusaders should have been. There's no rush to get to Super League or even the Championship, we're developing at our own pace and using 95% local players. Scorpions new head coach will be revealed in a couple of hours time and it will be positive news again for the development of Welsh players. The club will also be announcing at least one more Welsh-born youngster being added to the squad too plus there's open trials this Sunday where over 40 (weather permitting) will be taking part. All this is being revealed at www.scorpionsrl.com soon so keep your eyes on it. | |
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| Quote ="Starbug"The ' real ' story will probably never come out , was he really as bad as he has been portraid , or was he , how shall we say ' misled '
One thing is probably for certain doing something as an act of ' revenge ' against an organisation that upset you isn't a good enough reason to be allowed,to run a RL club , if in the future we ' expand ' again lets hope its done better'"
Don't talk about things you have no idea about, that makes you look like a troll. Leighton Samuel is =#FF0000without doubt a man with access to defamation lawyers. tb . I have had two rugby clubs taken away from me by this asshole. Leighton should not be allowed to run his own business let alone a club. I hate that man with a passion. As do thousends of people in bridgend. Thousends of people that would of turned out to watch the crusaders should good ol leighton not be there. He throws his toys out of the pram at every single chance. He threatened the WRU with pulling out numberous times, threatened the RFL with pulling out if we didn't get SL. |
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Samuel is a lot to blame but not totally you can't look past the ignorance if spending big on coached and squad Inc mid season signings from Union whilst adding to an existing debt! Heads screwed on? Really? 'this will save Wrexham FC' hmmm wonder how finely these debts have been looked at and what the football club debts now look like...?
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Andy Taylor of the Guardian reports that they could come out of Administration today under the same owners but with a different name.
Its like 'we owe tons of money but don't want to pay it, so lets go into adminsitration, and then start up a new company in exactly the same business as we were in before, in the premises we were in before, but if we change the name we should be ok'
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| Quote ="DemonUK"Andy Taylor of the Guardian reports that they could come out of Administration today under the same owners but with a different name.
Its like 'we owe tons of money but don't want to pay it, so lets go into adminsitration, and then start up a new company in exactly the same business as we were in before, in the premises we were in before, but if we change the name we should be ok''"
It is odd as I thought they had put in rules to stop this happening... I'm no expert but seem to recall something. Mainly as you had the likes of Stephen Vaughan putting Chester into administration seemingly every 6 months and then buying them back each time for a pittence of the debt.
Is a switch of 'directors' simply enough as not sure how the same Chairman can do it unless plans to pay 100% of debt off? |
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| Quote ="Spongolium"=#4000FFDon't talk about things you have no idea about, that makes you look like a troll. Leighton Samuel is =#FF0000without doubt a man with access to defamation lawyers. tb . I have had two rugby clubs taken away from me by this asshole. Leighton should not be allowed to run his own business let alone a club. I hate that man with a passion.=#0000FF As do thousends of people in bridgend. Thousends of people that would of turned out to watch the crusaders should good ol leighton not be there. He throws his toys out of the pram at every single chance. He threatened the WRU with pulling out numberous times, threatened the RFL with pulling out if we didn't get SL.'"
I am quite aware of the depth of ' feeling ' towards Mr Samuels in Bridgend , I pointed it out several times on these very boards after my visits down there in 2007/8 as a reason the Celtic Crusaders would fail , only to have others like yourself suggest I was talking bollox
As for thr truth , well there are probably only a small number of people who really know that , mr Samuels is one and the rest would be from the RFL
The bottom line is all are guilty of varying degrees of not doing things properly , lets hope that
1 the Wrexham project does succeed even if it means it being funded properly
2 we dont get another fiasco like it again |
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| I think that point (2) is in the 'in your dreams' category  |
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It takes the pi55 out of Widnes if this happens as they were refused a place last time in favour of these guys and was told because of their administration they werent getting it.
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If what happens?
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They ARE allowed to ditch all their debts ...........changes names again and stay in SL, runnng out of Wrexham, which isnt a million miles away from Widnes.
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If they are allowed to do what every other club that's gone into administration has done, it stinks.
Yep. Of course.
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| Quote ="Dick Jones"They ARE allowed to ditch all their debts ...........changes names again and stay in SL, runnng out of Wrexham, [uwhich isnt a million miles away from Widnes[/u.'"
Just on this little bit at the end because the rest, its hard to argue with.
I keep hearing this lark about just down the road from Widnes and its cobblers really. I went Wrexham the other week from Warrington and it took me 50 minutes, I can get to Huddersfield as fast but no one would dare claim Warrington was next to Huddersfield. If we expanded 45 minutes south we'd be in Stoke and that would definately be expansion territory so, for me, this second point up there doesnt wash.
I didnt like the initial move to Wrexham but looking back.. why didnt they think of that before. Location wise.. its genius |
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| Quote ="tb"If they are allowed to do what every other club that's gone into administration has done, it stinks.
Yep. Of course.'"
I'm not sure that many clubs have gone bust owing six figure sums to their employees' pension funds.
No doubt you'd take a similarly relaxed view if it was an industrial business doing the same and ripping off people's pensions ?  |
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Care to provide evidence to back up that assertion?
I'm aware of of a claim by some former players over alleged unlawful deduction of wages, relating to pensions. Unfortunately that's never likely to make it to court now to be proved one way or another.
I'm not aware of any evidence that Crusaders owes a six figure sum to their employees' pension funds though, so if you've got any, I'd be grateful if you shared it.
Interestingly, what Crusaders haven't done, for example, is announce with no warning that the club is in administration leaving all their employees without jobs - which, coincidentally, is what Widnes did in October 2007. Widnes were allowed to reform, without their previous debts, and compete NL1 in 2008.
Yet Dick Jones thinks that if Crusaders are 'allowed' to do exactly that - not even referring to next year's licence applications, but play in SL in 2011 - it will be taking the "pi55 out of Widnes". Weird.
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| Quote ="tb"Care to provide evidence to back up that assertion?
I'm aware of of a claim by some former players over alleged unlawful deduction of wages, relating to pensions. Unfortunately that's never likely to make it to court now to be proved one way or another.
I'm not aware of any evidence that Crusaders owes a six figure sum to their employees' pension funds though, so if you've got any, I'd be grateful if you shared it.
Interestingly, what Crusaders haven't done, for example, is announce with no warning that the club is in administration leaving all their employees without jobs - which, coincidentally, is what Widnes did in October 2007. Widnes were allowed to reform, without their previous debts, and compete NL1 in 2008.
Yet Dick Jones thinks that if Crusaders are 'allowed' to do exactly that - not even referring to next year's licence applications, but play in SL in 2011 - it will be taking the "pi55 out of Widnes". Weird.'"
It doesn't matter what facts or evidence you bring to the table tb, the RFL hate Widnes and that's that. Simple as. FACT. End of. No really.
The RFL have given Crusaders & Harlequins millions and given "proper" teams nothing.
The RFL are idiots who don't know how to run the game. The increase in participation, attendances and finances are all down to the hard work from clubs like Leigh, Wakefield, Widnes and Barrow and have nothing at all to do with those idiots at Red Hall.
It's obvious really, the answer is to let BARLA take control of the RFL and let them run it. After all they've done such a good job at the magnificent, superb, salt-of-the-earth, fantastic grass-roots level. As evidenced by the hordes of quality English players currently playing the game. |
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| Quote ="tb"Interestingly, what Crusaders haven't done, for example, is announce with no warning that the club is in administration leaving all their employees without jobs - which, coincidentally, is what Widnes did in October 2007. Widnes were allowed to reform, without their previous debts, and compete NL1 in 2008.
'"
Care to provide any evidence to back up that assertion?
Sauce for the goose ...  |
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Here's tb, AKA Buzz Killington, on his favourite topic again.Widnes Vikings, October 2007.
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| Quote ="BigRob"It doesn't matter what facts or evidence you bring to the table tb, the RFL hate Widnes and that's that. Simple as. FACT. End of. No really.
The RFL have given Crusaders & Harlequins millions and given "proper" teams nothing.
The RFL are idiots who don't know how to run the game. The increase in participation, attendances and finances are all down to the hard work from clubs like Leigh, Wakefield, Widnes and Barrow and have nothing at all to do with those idiots at Red Hall.
It's obvious really, the answer is to let BARLA take control of the RFL and let them run it. After all they've done such a good job at the magnificent, superb, salt-of-the-earth, fantastic grass-roots level. As evidenced by the hordes of quality English players currently playing the game.'"
Can you let David Hughes at Quins know where the millions to Quins are ??
if I hear this myth one more time think its time to watch theah rahs  |
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| Quote ="GSF"Here's tb, AKA Buzz Killington, on his favourite topic again.Widnes, October 2007.'"
This! TB's posts make my teeth itch. |
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| Quote ="tb"Care to provide evidence to back up that assertion?
I'm aware of of a claim by some former players over alleged unlawful deduction of wages, relating to pensions. Unfortunately that's never likely to make it to court now to be proved one way or another.
I'm not aware of any evidence that Crusaders owes a six figure sum to their employees' pension funds though, so if you've got any, I'd be grateful if it will be taking the "pi55 out of Widnes". Weird.'"
Guess you have missed the comments by the players union on both BBC & SKY Sports?
Struggling a bit of late aren't ya tb |
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