There's a lot more to this than who is better/has played more. For a start better is all down to opinion, I'm sure people on here can understand Wayne Bennetts opinion is different to there's?

Then take into account that Ward, McMeeken and Holmes all have very different skill sets even though they all play second row. Holmes is a workhorse, McMeeken a hole puncher and Ward more of a ball handler. That comes into play when picking a squad, Holmes IMO would be a replacement in the Liam Farrell mould. This IMO is also the reason Clarke is in over Houghton, because he offers a different dynamic to Hodgson whereas Houghton would offer a simmilar input.

All three have had injury issues this year. In fact all the guys you'd think might have a chance of forcing their way into the World Cup have, including guys like Greenwood, Currie etc.

Bottom line is Ward has a serious international future and with all due respect Holmes doesn't. A good SL player mind.

Ward is also very unlikely to figure in the 17 In the big games barring a few injuries, it's a silly argument.

I'll just be glad when the Four Nations is over and done with.

give over, it's all I've been looking forward to since our confirmation of middle 8s in July

It's unlikely any would play against Australia or NZ anyway. I'd rather have Holmes and McMeekan having a long rest and a good pre-season.
I'm glad Luke Gale is playing as he is likely to be first choice half back and playing the likes of Aus and NZ should improve his game. There would be no benefit to Holmes and McMeekan training for a further six weeks, playing against France and/or Scotland and risking possible injury.
So I'm glad Stevie Ward has been picked, from a purely selfish point of view.

Let's look at it slightly differently, if Holmes was actually any good, hull FC would have signed him already

I'm struggling to think of the last player who moved from Cas to Hull successfully. Westerman was okay, but didn't reach anywhere near the potential he had.
Other than that the likes of Thompson and Arundel have been mediocre.

Classic England

They look ok now, France are hanging on for dear life, trying to stop the flood gates opening

Is Widdop really the best we have in that position?

At least two tries probs 3 from England have all come from dodgy calls in the lead up by Bentham. France in possession and he gives a knock on and it wasnt, the touch that hall claimed is pathetic. Just hasnt given France a sniff. And wonder why the int. Games a joke?? Cooper shouldve been binned after the scuffle too.

Whats an inflated 50 point thrashin full of barge tries gonna teach Bennett?

There was a clear touch from the French player, albeit Bentham missed it.
Watch again and you'll spot it.

That knee to the head penalty was a fookin disgraceful call. Knock on by the England player despite the contact which wasn't horrendous anyway but a penalty. Jesus christ, it has Ganson written all over it, that time he penalised Constantine Mika for 'leading with the head' in a tackle when it was just an accidental clash of head.
.
Thought I heard Bentham let slip saying to the England kicking tee carrier that he's got a new job?
Fackng good riddance if so!

Yes there was a touch. Did he play at the ball? Nah. Facing sidewards and it seemed to come off his hip. Its a ludicrous 'rule' then that rewards a bad pass

yep, absolute clear touch.

His passing is truly awful.

Just wangs it, no spin on the ball and consequently really slow and inaccurate.

Appauling wasnt it. He was runnin at 100mph how he could avoid his head? Its a knock on by Eng.

Should it have been knock on though? He's knocked on because he's just been tw*tted round the head, accidental or not. Should have just been a play the ball on the spot.

Good crowd there tonight btw, great to see.

If defender knocks the ball forward with their hand, whether accidental or not, it's a knock on.
Are you Jean Capdouze ?

Cracking crowd that doesnt want to see pathetic decisions. And Woods has the gaul to say the crowds gone quiet ha! England were always going to win but Christ they get gifted everything.

Widdops poor. The last play options are basic in general. If youre enthused by this then wow.

Double post

Are you John Kear? Sound almost as far away from the game as possible. 'Englands discipline has been excellent'...3 french pens on bounce since that kear gem!!

Did he just give back to one when two Eng players touched the ball? And overiding the linesman for a 40/20. This is comical.

5th tackle plays are middle 8s standard.

40/20 call was ridiculous. You can't see that on a TV replay, the linesman is about thirty five minutes closer than Bentham, but his eyes are better?

Knee to head penalty is rubbish, not a knock on though, just check the injury and other.

Think Scott Taylor has played himself into a shirt, not sure about full back and it's annoyed me them saying about how much Josh has kicked on, he is doing great at Canberra, but he was playing this eighty minute role at Rovers.