Its funny how much stick Mcguire gets for a 10 point loss against the Aussies. Yet how much praise Eastmond and Tomkins get for a 30 point loss in a final.

a slight bit of envy and revisionism me thinks

Cant agree with this comment at all. Saints pay Eastmonds wages therefore Saints are entitled to play him whenever they like. What if they had rested him on Englands say so and then Saints had lost?? You can just imagine the problems that would have caused! Lets not kid ourselves either, the reason we lose against Australia & NZ is not because we don't rest players but solely because we dont have the resources Australia do when it comes to RL and cant consistantly produce the calibre of players they do.

Im glad Joel Tomkins and Nick Scruton have been picked in the sqaud they have been brilliant this season.

Which try was that? not saying it didnt happen but i certainly cant remember it, i can remember his side being by far our best defensivley (until he came off, then it fell apart) and him stopping a couple of tries pretty much on his own.

Your not one of the leeds fan that was booing in the final are you? (before kick off i might add).

French squad, ill just stick it in here so it can be easily compared to the England squad.

Andrew Bentley : Saint Estève - XIII Catalan
Thomas Bosc : Dragons Catalans
Remy Casty : Dragons Catalans
Vincent Duport : Toulouse Olympique
Olivier Elima : Dragons Catalans (capitaine)
Jamal Fakir : Dagons Catalans
Mathieu Griffi : Toulouse Olympique
David Ferriol : Dragons Catalans
Tony Gigot : Dragons Catalans
Cyril Gossard : Dragons Catalans
Grégory Mounis : Dragons Catalans
Dimitri Pelo : Dragons Catalans
Florian Quintilla : Lézignan-Corbières
Sébastien Raguin : Dragons Catalans
Mickael Simon : Saint Estève - XIII Catalan
Cyril Stacul : Dragons Catalans
Julien Touxagas : Dragons Catalans
Mickael Tribillac : Lézignan Corbières
Frédéric Vaccari : Dragons Catalans
Constant Villegas : Toulouse Olympique

I remember which one it was, dunno if Shenton was at fault.
The second bit's a bit of a myth, we had in reality lost the game before he went off after conceeding a few in the minutes leading up to it

it was the try that we conceded to let the aussies in front for the second time
the game was gone from there, you could see the confidence drain from our side and build in theirs as it was the second time the team had worked so hard to get in front and conceded a soft try straight away

i didnt boo the team before the final, Ive seen enough pathetic england performances to know that this team needed support, not fans who go to cheer their own clubs players and score points off other clubs players and fans, I guess you are one of them

Chris Bridge- Not Good Enough
Tom Briscoe- Not Good Enough
Sam Burgess- Good player
Kyle Eastmond- Good player
Gareth Ellis- Average int. player
James Graham- Average int. player
Ryan Hall- Not Good Enough but best we have, depressing.
Sean O’Loughlin- Average not international standard
Danny McGuire- Inconsistent
Adrian Morley- Too old
Jamie Peacock- Past it
James Roby- Good player
Nick Scruton- Unproven
Michael Shenton- Not Good Enough
Kevin Sinfield- Not Good Enough internationally
Joel Tomkins- Unproven
Sam Tomkins- Overrated
Ben Westwood- Poor player
Gareth Widdop- Unproven

=#8000FFI hope you're trolling

the best second rower in the world is only average? Shenton & Hall aren't good enough, yet they both kept the Aussies down the left quiet (along with Ellis).

=#8040BFIf inglis wanted to run through shenton, bridge, ellis etc he could do and with ease. We aren't good enough we have 1/2 players who could make it onto australia's bench and that's all

Other than one who seems on a different planet to everyone else, and bar a little bit of fine-tuning round the edges from a few others, that looks like a pretty universal thumbs-up for the team from the jury on here.

That must be the first time I have seen that in many a year.

Not a bad start for a coach who was almost universally panned when he was appointed?

Flash forward to next week England 6-74 France



It'll be tough for the French no doubt, as usual, Widdop certainly seems keen but they must be careful as the French will definitley want to forget their club woes. They should also be fired up by a few comments from some league 'journalists' in Australia.

o it isn't tough to pick a squad, i could do that but i'm not slating his squad selection just how distinctly average we, as a nation, have become with us thinking realistically we could compete with Australia with that squad. Look at the backs:

Widdop - U20s player =#BF80FF Slater- World Class
Hall- Average =#BF80FFMorris- Top scorer iin best rl comp in the world
Shenton- Not good enough =#BF80FFInglis- Best Player in the world
Bridge- Not Good Enough =#BF80FF Lyon- Best centre ever seen in SL
Briscoe- Not Good Enough =#BF80FF Hayne- World Class

The more detailed analysis will come when he announces his next squad, 3 tougher opponents to come

This is an opportunity for him to take a look at Widdop. Unless he has a blinder of a season I don't think he'll be there come 4 nations time. I also think Tom Briscoe has a LOT of potential.

I think most people are a little more accepting because it is a game against france, a chance to try a few different things.

I think people will be a little more picky with the next squad.

All of the English fullbacks mentioned would get the odd game in the NRL as reserves but no more - as already proved by Tansey and Mathers. Widdop has enormous potential, as anyone who's seen him play will confirm. Getting his card marked as an England player now is exactly the right thing to do.

Centre is our weakest position by far looking at that squad, and the sad thing is that the only other real options are an ancient Senior and a past-it Gleeson.

I believe Flanagan will be in the squad at the end of the season as well. He's a very solid player for Wests, and having four forwards with NRL experience in the defensive line would make us a lot stronger IMO - Ellis helped out well on one side of the field last year, Burgess/Flanagan could do the same on the other.

Er, I just checked the French squad, and you'll be relieved to know that neither Slater, Morris, Inglis, Lyon or Hayne have been picked.

Did you not see the Melbourne v Canterbury game last weekend? Widdop was a standout with an alround game of a standard no other English threequarter comes near to. Unless he seriously falls of the face of the earth from now to he international series in Oct he will be our fullback for that series. It isnt as if we have a army of quality fullbacks knocking the door down for a international jumper is it? Let alone one that has the potential of Widdop. Agree with what someone said about Flanagan too. He has looked solid in the back row for Wests.

But we don't have anyone who is as good as those Aussies you mention, the players we have picked are the best we have.

And lets not forget the avarage age of that back line is 21, I hardly think it's fair to be labelling them as "not good enough" at this stage.

I didn't see the game actually however he's still only played 2 first team games.
Like I said, lets see how he goes for the rest of the season before we start putting him in front of blokes who've vastly more experience. Personally I think Richard Owen has the potential to make it as fb for Eng.

Why on earth would we put Flanagan in front of someone like O'Loughlin?? The NRL is not a comp full of supermen and i'm chuffed for the lad but there is no way on earth he'll be better than O'L.

Mr ZH, extremely good point at the end there, very very good point

Pleased Widdop is in there, let's see how good he is, the French opposition I doubt will be as good as what he faces in the NRL when he plays.

Slightly worrying comment from someone who seems to have the world at his feet.




Surely we need to find out why. I know training with Billy Slater will make a massive difference, however he still needs to perform, if Billy Slater trained me it wouldn't make me an England player. I understand he wouldn't have got these opportunities at a part time club like Fax but if he'd have gone to Leeds/Bradford etc. wouldn't he be as good? The answer is sadly no I would assume, which is why we're still miles behind them.

just cos flanagan is starting in the NRL does'nt make him a banker for international honours....he's still at the bottom of a list of 9 or 10 players

if you open both eyes you'll be able to see better

Whatever the result I'm just happy the squad is a totally French team i.e. no Aussies. I personally dont think Fakir should be chosen given that he is going to the dark side next year.