Wonderful attempts at misinterpreting my point. You talk as if fans have always accepted the national coach's team selections as impeccable! I do not believe that O'Loughlin is the best English No 13. I do believe that Kevin Sinfield is a far superior player. I don't think I'm the only one with this view.

No you aren't the only one with this view. There are plenty other posters who's hatred for all things Wigan, distorts what little understanding of RL they have. Anyone who thinks that O'Loughlin missing the series isn't a bad loss must be nuts.

Your inferiority complex is showing. I have no hatred of Wigan - for instance I have no query with Sam Tomkins being selected for England and even agree that Joel is in with a shout for a spot in the forwards. I don't even 'hate' O'Loughlin - simply consider him a far more ordinary a player than do Wiganers.

Simon Grix has been out of this world for Warrington this year. 8 out of 1o each week. Massively underrated.

They don't, you just bore the ass of people.

You're entitled to your opinion, but it ain't mine.

Asgardian13 wrote:Your inferiority complex is showing. I have no hatred of Wigan - for instance I have no query with Sam Tomkins being selected for England and even agree that Joel is in with a shout for a spot in the forwards. I don't even 'hate' O'Loughlin - simply consider him a far more ordinary a player than do Wiganers.

You forgot to add the coaches from junior through to international level. Please excuse us if we DO find your view a little one-eyed.

Joel Tomkins could do some damage roaming about the place at 13. He runs great lines and if he gets in the clear as shown plenty of times he has the pace to do real damage.

If we want a grafter at 13- Heighington

If we want an attacking threat- J Tomkins

Joel has all the attributes of a good number 13. Strong (ask McGuire) plenty of pace and a decent tackler. It is not a bad call if it was club level. Not sure about doing it for 4 nations though (unless Tomkins has played there before in junior ranks).

Joels best period at Wigan (imo) was when he filled in for Lockers for few months due to injury. It was in 2008 IIRC.

sinfield has always been a much better player than o'thingymabob...... tonight was just another example of this.

people that think sean is a massive loss are deluded.

sinfield is a much better rugby player.... he always has been........ he reads the game so well..... great passer, tackler, kicker, captain,... wigan fans dont like to see it but sinfield is a much beter 13 than 'lockers'.

FACT

Lockers has made over 200 more tackles than Sinfield, scored 5 more tries, made more meters, more marker tackles, has fewer missed tackles and fewer errors.... all of that in one less game. O'loughling has also proved time and time again than he can make that killer pass and he makes the hard yards so well and puts in huge hits in defence hurting the opponent.

Sinfield is the better organiser and kicker. Sinfield is a brilliant player but he should play 9 IMO, not 13.

You are excused. Anyone's entitled to make a mistake.

When was the last time these England coaches won anything? perhaps that suggests their views are not to be taken as an endorsement of OL,s quality?

As has been said before he is one of the dirtiest players in SL - a real head shot merchant who was ideally suited to Maguire's take on how RL should be played.

He also has fewer GF rings!! - stats can be made to say anything, fact is OL's record pales into insignificance when compared to Sinfields - end of.

Are you having a laugh? Not even playing loose forward for his club. Should not make the mistake of playing people out of position.

I wish people would stop saying it is a ‘fact’ that Sinfied is better than O’Loughlin or vice versa... they offer their teams differing but valuable elements to their game. Sinfield is the hub of the team, he bosses them around the park and he has all the skills. O’Loughlin on the other hand is more of a workrate forward but he can also step up and throw a try scoring cut out pass or set up a try with a quality short kick. He is also more hurtful and consistent in defence

If I was pressed on who was the better player I would say that Sinfield has been the better at Super league level as he has been so consistent in some very good Leeds teams. But internationally, I would go for O’Loughlin over Sinfield as I think his game is more suited to the tighter and more physical matches

Baileys got more than Ginger whinger, Morley,Carvell put together! Glad I know which prop should be picked for England this year

Ok lets pick the team of English players who are most decorated and see how we go....

That would put Wellens back in the team. Fielden in the team, do you want that? Get Senior back in there.... Sean Long can play his last games for England.

Around this time every year, we get a clamour for Sinfield to be picked for the international team, every time he is picked the results are disastorous as was his performance in the exiles game. Some good club players just can't cut it at the next level, and as Kevin has been around the England team since the 2000 World Cup without making his mark, perhaps it's time to close the book on this one. Great player for Leeds, though.

O'Loughlin has proven he can step up, hence his award of man of the series (the only British player currently playing to win such an award) against the Kiwis a few years ago.

Apart from Burrow who was man of the series, Kevin Sinfield who was nominated for a golden boot 2 years ago?

Quote ="Charlie Sheen"Apart from Burrow who was man of the series'" You've got me there, but O'Loughlin was rather impressive in that series www.guardian.co.uk/sport/2007/no ... ague.sport

Quote ="Charlie Sheen"Apart from Burrow who was man of the series'" You've got me there, but O'Loughlin was rather impressive in that series www.guardian.co.uk/sport/2007/no ... ague.sport

Leeds fans opinions on players because they have won medals (in a team competition) are so annoying it is beyond unreal. 5 grand final rings mean everyone of them players are quality and not one is average.

The fact is in a Salary cap enviroment. Everyteam as there average players and the Leeds team is filled with Kirke, Ablett and Bailey.

Can you point me at the thread where the Leeds fans, or anyone else for that matter, are suggesting that Kirke, Ablett and Bailey be selected for England?

5 Grand Final wins with average players in their ranks therefore suggests logically that they must have some very very good players in there somewhere