No that's quite wrong. Bankers lending to [uanyone[/u at unsustainable income multipliers or "self certified" income propping up an artificially strong housing market added to the solely bonus related purchases of "sub prime" mortgages in the States was the catalyst for the recession.

Investors bailing out of the worst effected banks (Northern Rock) creating a shortage in the money supply compounded by the banks then virtually putting a freeze on lending brought on the recession. The working classes are just the ones who happened to lose their jobs.

Yes Brother....whatever you say!
GREED and the jealousy of people thinking they could live the DFS 4 year interest free lifestyle caused this dip. As usual, the 1% of the population controlled what went on, but don't for one second say the poor working
class people are the victims here......they all have SKY tv, mobile phones etc.....you cut your cloth accordingly and the majority of the UK didn't....easy to balme Goldmans though isn't it

the poor guy that is encouraged into overpaying for a house he cant afford doesnt get any leniency

but the fat cats that lent him that money get bonuses and taxpayer bail outs

id love to get a bail out every time i make a mistake in business

heck northern rock even bailed out the newcaastle union team, taking over their ground for millions more than it was worth

if only the working man and RL got help like that

True Dally but unlike Australia, we HAD to bail out the banks there was absolutely no alternative, they are too big. You probably wouldn't have the same problem, what with there being no real banks of any note over there


The bonus system, well, go and do some reading. This isn't an economics class.
But yes, this is why Rugby League will continue to limp along at least for the next couple of years. Especially when fathers are leaving their kids at home who are the next generation.

The positive is that they can't afford the soccer either.

As for Wembley.. If you associate me with you screbs that live in council flats in Orford then.. How many windows have you got?

STOP.....STOP believing what the papers tell you......you will only dig a deeped hole for yourself.

Eveyone admits that the fat cats are responsible.....but it was the people who applied for the credit they couldn't afford who drove this recession to where it is now. If you can't afford it, you can't have it.....always a good way to run your life.
Just because an advert says you can afford it doesn't mean you can. Blame where Blame is due.....but remember who asked for the loans in the first place.

Anyone who wants to discuss the banking crisis, sub-prime mortgages or economic policy can do so on the Sin Bin. This is a rugby league thread on a rugby league forum. Stay on topic.

But it is related to this thread, in every way.
Warringtons attendances dropped about 20% throughout the recession and they weren't the only club. The recession has had a massive impact on Rugby League and the 'types' that follow it.

you can't compare Oz to UK in current economic climate

there is NO recession in Oz and there never has been one

Money is tight in the UK and people have had to curb their spending

this isn't the case in OZ

The people most greatly affected are the people that watch Rugby League.
Even soccers been affected but the big sides can all pull fans from everywhere. Ridiculous waiting lists for soccer season tickets at some clubs

we are actually in boom in Western Australia!

Normally i wouldnt agree with dally over you but, have you ever considered that many of thos foolish people applying for credit they couldnt afford, could afford it before the economy went pear shaped and they found themselves unemployed or on reduced hours.

I wonder if anybody else's posts will get deleted?

Not trying to start anything here, but what would the average crowds be like if Quins and Salford were not in SL?

I like Salford, they are a team I would love to see grow into something much bigger and quins, well, they are in the league for obvious reasons.

Would the average go up much?

Both Salford and Quins average attendanced drag the overall average down, but the reason they are in SL is to try to grow the game and I get the impression that the RFL aren't as bothered about their gates as some fans are.
I have made it my lifes work (well, more of a hobby really

) disecting the attendances in London since 2000 and to be honest, I don't think there is a simple answer to our poor gates and why people don't come to games.

The real issue with small gates is revenue and apparently, Quins are covered for any losses they make by David Hughes. Not ideal, but he stated recently that Quins RL had no overdraft and didn't want one either. Not many clubs in professional sports can boast that I would think.

Having not lived in the Salford area I can't comment about the other distractions on offer, but I don't think a new ground is the answer......as in they won't add 5k to ther average overnight.

As the RFL are assisting Celtic and Catalans market themselves, maybe they should look to assist Salford and London as well.

St helens only has a 100k population, theyll need to draw from liverpool and surrounding areas if they have any chance of getting 15k, but if youve ever been to liverpool you would understand that is impossible, alot of them dont even know the shape of a Rugby ball and im being totally serious about that.

Widnes is just a small town, with lots of clubs around it no chance of growth beyond 8k imo.

No it isn't,the metropolitan borough of St.Helens is roughly 180,000,which includes Haydock, Newton,Rainford and so on.

Haydock - Split between Wigan and Saints
Billinge - Split between Wigan and Saints
Newton - Split between Wigan, Saints and Warrington
Rainford - Full of scousers, quite few saints fans, scattering of Wigan fans.

Although there is no reason that Saints shouldn't be getting as many fans as Wigan, both towns are almost exactly the same size with almost exactly the same demographic.

Couple of points re this post.
Salfords new ground may not provide all the right answers but Salfords current ground IS causing a lot of problems. I could solve the Salford problems in about half an hours board meeting with a stadium built but they won't listen to reason.
The London club needs to move out of the M25, simple really. Im not one for bashing the current product though, as far as development goes, they're doing an absolutely tremendous job, definately worth 3 more years.

if man utd can get fans from london im sure st helens can get 1000 or 2000 fans who dont live in st helens

im sure there are people in liverpool who will go and watch saints in a new ground but not at knowsley rd

Has anyone worked out what our average attedance would be if quins and salford wern't in the SL?

I bet it would be pushing on 10k, maybe even slightly over.
However they're in SL, imagine what the average would be with just Wigan..playing themselves

How would the Wigan walk work in that respect?

Warrington and Hull both added 40%+ to their averages simply by moving ground. I see no reason why Saints and Salford can't do the same.

at Hull we've attracted many more females and family's to games, as the facilities are far better. Although you could argue that ourselves and Warrington had a large amount of 'dormant' fans who hadn't been to a game in years also.

I think Saints in particular would attract a bigger crowd in a new ground, as they'd draw in support from a wider area.

it's catch 22. Want to make the league bigger and expand RL but then it means that the season will probaly be longer and thus the international game will suffer which needs drastically improving for us to be seen nationally like union, football even cricket!