It is good to see intelligent debate and conversation, you are keyboard warrior personified, I doubt you'd have the guts to say most of the things you do to people in person. Silly, sad old man.

Wow, talk about Irony

Yes, DB is definitely positioning Leigh as a Club to be ready to take the place of 'any' SL Club that should fail, not just Toronto. In doing so I believe he has been using his smarts to achieve a level of success he wants for Leigh.

I really don't care what the likes of The West End Tinker believe or try to promote, Leigh are *the most ready* for Super League club there is, above Toronto, Toulouse, Fev & London because .....

Leigh has
1. None of the intrinsic issues of Toronto *though Toronto have value long term*.
2. Have been the stand out Championship Club more often & more recently than any other.
3. Performed well in Super League 2017 & did not finish bottom, beating Wigan, St Helens, Warrington & Hull & running Leeds extremely close, in fact Leigh were very close to most, only being beaten by a margin a couple of times.
4. We averaged circa 6,800 attendance across all SL competitions inc Play Offs, the 8th best supported club in Super League ! Given a half decent run in SL & with only a modicum of success *top 8 finishes* Leigh could easily match the average attendances of Cas for example.
4. We have a modern near 12,000 capacity stadium.
5. Leigh have more fans, a better stadium & are more successful than Fev & Toulouse !
*Fev are a strong club & Toulouse have massive value in terms of the Catalan/France development connection & I would love to see them both in SL eventually*
6. Leigh fans travel & in big numbers compared to others, Wigan for example are absolutely dire for the size of club they are, this puts cash through all the clubs they visit.
7. Leigh have an owner who has & is prepared to invest in the playing roster.
8. London appears to have some minor success in the amateur game but 800 home fans is a joke ! Any club that is outnumbered by away fans has issues, serious issues ! When a Club has to change name & location more often than a corner shop you just know that the people of London don't want it !!!!

Of course there is value in other clubs, Fev, Toulouse, York, Newcastle. I wish Halifax were stronger, Widnes seem to be in transition or decline.

I don't discount Toronto long term, but I believe the way they have operated is tantamount to treason ! I would love for Canadian & U.S.A RL to take off in a massive way but it should be in a very structured manner & transparent & fair, I just don't see that at the moment !

If anyone can truly say that Leigh will not offer as much value as Salford, Huddersfield, Wakefield or Cas I will listen *but not necessarily agree* !

That current Leigh squad is not anywhere near SL standard. All the clubs you mention in your last sentence would beat Leigh comfortably.
As for the rest of your post, have you not noticed franchising finished years ago.

I think there was an argument for this a couple of years ago but a number teams have fallen in standards recently. There is more an argument for a 10 team league at present.

I don't think the issue is the player pool I think the issue is having enough financial stable and well run clubs. How many teams outside the top 5 can you honestly say are being run well at the moment?

14 clubs would just drag the standard of the league down further.

Regarding P&R vs licensing (which the OP suggested we should go to straight P&R), I have been saying for a while that we need some sort of hybrid of the two. P&R doesn't provide the stability that clubs need, the impact of relegation is enough to put a team out of business overnight. However, 3 years is too long to guarantee clubs a place in the league with no ramifications for poor on/off field performance.

We require some sort of ongoing review system where clubs are given a minimum and maximum league to compete in while any large change on the clubs operation (Crusaders moving to Wrexham, Bulls going bust) triggers an immediate review.

Another one of your anti Leigh post. I see you keep popping over to the Leigh board showing your constant jealousy. Give it a rest. Leigh WILL have a decent standard of a squad, whether we are in the championship or SL, So trot on little boy.

Very astute as League express feels that Covid and a much smaller 2022 SKY TV deal will see the radical change you predict.

Interested in your comments on that thread?

Leigh proved themselves 2017 but for one bad game. See the TV deal thread, it may be Superleage ends up at 14 and that could be because the number of clubs that survive both Covid AND a vastly reduced SKY TV deal could be as little as 14. Leigh are strong enough to survive..........

Note that Rimmer went cap in hand for government money. and apparently according to League express he's doing an Oliver Twist and intends to ask for more.

It may be more than 14 clubs survive so maybe we could end up 2 x 10. That has already been proposed in the real world.

One thing seems certain given the TV deal news, and that is the reduced SKY deal 2022......

Which is certainly not going to be watered down even more by splitting it 14 ways.....

So, Leigh make a few big signings (allegedly) and you want in ?

I'd be happy for Leigh to earn promotion but, if its for sale then, lets just see who has most money in their pockets.
Leigh did brighten up SL while they were there but, no more so than London, who were very unlucky not to survive, only getting relegated on the last day.
It could make a right mess of fixtures but, if Toronto aren't coming back (I personally thing that they will), SL will have to run with 11 clubs.
Maybe Magic could instead be used for one of the Challenge Cup rounds (when the SL clubs join in) ?

Sorry but, it's a no from me.

I actually agree with this. I think we should call it the "Magic Challenge" Weekend.

And not forgetting the second point to not let Leigh try to buy into SL by having a large squad full of journeymen with no reserve team or junior development.

What is it with you? Why are you so obsessed with Leigh wanting to do well? I have never advocated that Leigh should be in SL on any criteria apart from P&R. What i have said some time ago is,whoever gets into SL, should do so on merit,that's why i said i agree with wrencat1873, that if TWP are not readmitted, then yes run with an 11 team SL for 2021. I suggest you go and sit down,and give your head a wobble.



[url=http://www.tommysaleyouth.co.uk/content/[u=#FF0000Youth Development[/u[/url

=#FF0000No need to be sorry, I respect other views differ even when I might not agree.

=#FF0000I don't suggest that Leigh are gifted a place or the 12th place, I suggest as I have several times before that it goes to a mini Franchise application, set criteria, best Club wins, if that is carried out subjectively & fairly & the winner is Fev, London or Widnes then so be it !

What of it's Ottowa, NY or Dublin?

Cokey take note of a more balanced view point. Del Boys rhetoric isn’t enough. We’ve seen his tantrums to often in the past.

When you're addressing your post to Ste100Centurions, leave my name out of it.

Running with an 11 club Superlague is very problematic. These short term problems can be solved immediately by Leigh stepping up for next season.

At the end of the season the TV deal runs out so Superleague can then decide what shape and content they will have under a new reduced deal.

So the idea Leigh should not be promoted because they don't have a long term player development strategy is an irrelevance.

Yes I get all that,and hope Leigh do get admitted,But just to appease the anti Leigh mob, I am just reiterating that any club should be promoted on merit in my view. I also understand the current dilemma due to the phoney TWP antics which have caused all this mess. Que sera sera.

Any club that was chosen to be "promoted" from the Championship, even on some kind of "franchise type criteria" would be open to all sorts of questions.
Depending who was setting the criteria would give advantage to one club or other.
What criteria would carry most weight ?

Fev were beaten finalists in the last Championship play off final
Leigh have been there before and appear to be assembling a very strong squad.
Toulouse, sit top of the "suspended" Championship comp
Widnes, decent facilities and ground, plus plenty of fans
London, just for the "kudos" of having a club in the Capital
Bradford, sleeping "giant" potential to bring some decent numbers of fans

A case could be made for any of the above and by picking any club, there could be a legal challenge from some of the unlucky ones - for this reason, if Toronto dont come back, SL should run with 11 clubs and use "magic" for one of the rounds of the Challenge Cup.

TBF - I think your post would be more relevant to the one below.

Cheers Cokey, putting me in with Donny is a very low blow - mandatory count 1, 2, 3, ........

However, you know that simply isn't the case.
Any club "promoted" for next season, assuming that they dont have any major problems, would be in the box seat for the following season, unless they were in the relegation spot



With the current situation, it would be a brave person to predict very much about future events and RL is no different.

Tbf, I'm not sure how many clubs will get through the winter without the usual season ticket sales and let's face it, how does anyone sell season tickets, when there is no likelihood of supporters being allowed into games, especially at the start of the season in February ? and even then, had clubs sold S/T's, it may be that not everyone would be allowed in.

It's a right old mess

The problem, in general terms, could be even worse in The Championship and League 1, as S/T's make up a hefty share of their income too and without any TV monies.

If you are advocating that Leigh should step up for next season because it would cause the least problems, and I personally have no problems who steps in least of all Leigh, then your argument is flawed when you say that the Sky deal with super league finishes after next season, that being the case if it's for next season only then providing Toronto give assurances for next season why can't it be them on the basis of your logic.

Quote ="wrencat1873"Cheers Cokey, putting me in with Donny is a very low blow Any club "promoted" for next season, assuming that they don't have any major problems, would be in the box seat for the following season '" Because you say so? Since when did you run the league? Let me know?? Nobody is in the "box seat" 2022 when Superleague faces the end of this long TV deal and goes onto a much reduced deal. All bets are off under a new deal that will see many clubs lose TV funding altogether. For all you know, which isn't much, Leigh may be only given a one year "licence" for next year? If HKR have lost Hudgell how are they going to be "in the box seat"? If we go to 10 and there has been a vote on a 2x10 SL then how would Wakefield fare against York to be in SL1 if they chose that on licensing?? let me know the answers to those questions please if you have a crystal ball and can see who are in the Box seats for SL 2022?. Thanks heavens I aren't "in with" you and your mate For those that could not stop indicating we have a problem......... https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-league/54695638

Quote ="wrencat1873"Cheers Cokey, putting me in with Donny is a very low blow Any club "promoted" for next season, assuming that they don't have any major problems, would be in the box seat for the following season '" Because you say so? Since when did you run the league? Let me know?? Nobody is in the "box seat" 2022 when Superleague faces the end of this long TV deal and goes onto a much reduced deal. All bets are off under a new deal that will see many clubs lose TV funding altogether. For all you know, which isn't much, Leigh may be only given a one year "licence" for next year? If HKR have lost Hudgell how are they going to be "in the box seat"? If we go to 10 and there has been a vote on a 2x10 SL then how would Wakefield fare against York to be in SL1 if they chose that on licensing?? let me know the answers to those questions please if you have a crystal ball and can see who are in the Box seats for SL 2022?. Thanks heavens I aren't "in with" you and your mate For those that could not stop indicating we have a problem......... https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-league/54695638

Quote ="Donnyman"Because you say so? Since when did you run the league? Let me know?? Nobody is in the "box seat" 2022 when Superleague faces the end of this long TV deal and goes onto a much reduced deal. All bets are off under a new deal that will see many clubs lose TV funding altogether. For all you know, which isn't much, Leigh may be only given a one year "licence" for next year? If HKR have lost Hudgell how are they going to be "in the box seat"? If we go to 10 and there has been a vote on a 2x10 SL then how would Wakefield fare against York to be in SL1 if they chose that on licensing?? let me know the answers to those questions please if you have a crystal ball and can see who are in the Box seats for SL 2022?. Thanks heavens I aren't "in with" you and your mate For those that could not stop indicating we have a problem......... https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-league/54695638'" What on earth are you on about.? MY OPINION is that any club (not just Leigh), that was promoted for next season would have a huge advantage towards being selected for the following season, even if there was a return to "franchising". I do hope that it's ok to express an opinion, rather than your own "facts", which blow with the the wind. Are you still certain of the 12 club all English league If the game moves to "franchising" things could be really interesting, especially as NOBODY is certain which clubs will survive the winter. Btw, you do realise that this thread is "Re: 14 team league" and not another one of your own making.?? I really do love your "for all you know" comment. Comedy gold from the resident "town hall clock".

Quote ="Donnyman"Because you say so? Since when did you run the league? Let me know?? Nobody is in the "box seat" 2022 when Superleague faces the end of this long TV deal and goes onto a much reduced deal. All bets are off under a new deal that will see many clubs lose TV funding altogether. For all you know, which isn't much, Leigh may be only given a one year "licence" for next year? If HKR have lost Hudgell how are they going to be "in the box seat"? If we go to 10 and there has been a vote on a 2x10 SL then how would Wakefield fare against York to be in SL1 if they chose that on licensing?? let me know the answers to those questions please if you have a crystal ball and can see who are in the Box seats for SL 2022?. Thanks heavens I aren't "in with" you and your mate For those that could not stop indicating we have a problem......... https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-league/54695638'" What on earth are you on about.? MY OPINION is that any club (not just Leigh), that was promoted for next season would have a huge advantage towards being selected for the following season, even if there was a return to "franchising". I do hope that it's ok to express an opinion, rather than your own "facts", which blow with the the wind. Are you still certain of the 12 club all English league If the game moves to "franchising" things could be really interesting, especially as NOBODY is certain which clubs will survive the winter. Btw, you do realise that this thread is "Re: 14 team league" and not another one of your own making.?? I really do love your "for all you know" comment. Comedy gold from the resident "town hall clock".

Aye but don't forget, at least the town hall clock gets it right twice a day