|
|
Rank | Posts | Team |
International Board Member | 13639 | No Team Selected |
Joined | Service | Reputation |
Nov 2002 | 22 years | |
Online | Last Post | Last Page |
Jan 2025 | Jan 2025 | LINK |
Milestone Posts |
|
Milestone Years |
|
Location |
|
Signature |
TO BE FIXED |
|
| Quote ="Dave T"What absolute nonsense.
Whatever your thoughts are about how bad Bradford were, to claim Wire played 'absolutely shocking standard of Rugby' is just plain dumb.
Very good discipline, good offensive play, few mistakes, some creative tries, okay, some room for improvement in defence, but that often happens in games where you are 30 points up.
How any team, no matter who they are playing, can score 58 away from home, yet still be classed as shocking is beyond me.'"
On the flip side to let a side as poor as Bradford were (and make no mistake that's the worst performance I've seen from a Bradford Bulls side) score 22 points shows that the wire performance wasn't THAT good, I admit they looked good in attack at some points but the Bradford defense was absolutely pathetic, but having said all that you can only play whats in front of you and Warrington did everything they needed to do.
|
|
|
Rank | Posts | Team |
Club Owner | 8627 | No Team Selected |
Joined | Service | Reputation |
Nov 2003 | 21 years | |
Online | Last Post | Last Page |
Feb 2020 | Feb 2020 | LINK |
Milestone Posts |
|
Milestone Years |
|
Location |
|
Signature |
TO BE FIXED |
|
| Quote ="christopher"On the flip side to let a side as poor as Bradford were (and make no mistake that's the worst performance I've seen from a Bradford Bulls side) score 22 points shows that the wire performance wasn't THAT good, I admit they looked good in attack at some points but the Bradford defense was absolutely pathetic, but having said all that you can only play whats in front of you and Warrington did everything they needed to do.'"
as Martin Offiah said on Sky Sports News, Bradford are not as bad as that performance suggests and Warrington are not as good.
|
|
|
|
Rank | Posts | Team |
International Board Member | 5064 | No Team Selected |
Joined | Service | Reputation |
Aug 2002 | 22 years | |
Online | Last Post | Last Page |
Sep 2017 | Feb 2016 | LINK |
Milestone Posts |
|
Milestone Years |
|
Location |
|
Signature |
TO BE FIXED |
|
| Quote ="The Devil's Advocate"Also, the issue of selecting players from the top clubs, it’s like re-revisiting a failed theory. These players may stand out in a club team brimming with talent, but when they put on an England shirt it’s just a cash bonus, an added sweetener for playing for a top club. The majority of the squad who holidayed in Aus. should be binned off, how many chances do they deserve?'"
This comes back to the issue of competitiveness. We should be selecting the stand out players from a host of top teams.
As it is we are selecting the average players from a couple of top teams. Our alternative is to select the stand out players from average teams. Arguing over which of these we should do is pointless as neither approach is going to be successful.
|
|
|
Rank | Posts | Team |
Moderator | 12655 | No Team Selected |
Joined | Service | Reputation |
Jun 2007 | 18 years | |
Online | Last Post | Last Page |
Jan 2025 | Jan 2025 | LINK |
Milestone Posts |
|
Milestone Years |
|
Location |
|
Signature |
TO BE FIXED |
Moderator
|
| The quality of English top-flight club football has never been higher. The lack of a salary cap has allowed teams to put together star-studded teams that are dominating the European game and playing sparkling stuff.
It hasn't helped the International prospects of England much though and 16 teams are there just to make up the numbers and try to avoid relegation, with the top 4 essentially a closed shop. No English manager has ever won the Premier League.
We need a balance between quality and competition - part of the appeal of sport is uncertainty. There is no simple solution, no magic wand we can wave to make everything perfect, whether it be coaching badges, scrapping the cap or whatever. I find RL exciting and entertaining, the quality is high enough for me, and the competition is better for it being spread thinly, rather than more concentrated at the current top clubs. The fall of some clubs means others rise and Huddersfield, Wakefield, Cas, and Rovers have improved - whether by as much as Wigan, Hull and Bradford have deteriorated is debatable and there is no objective way of measuring it. My guess is standards are probably rising, relative to our own past, rather than Australia, admittedly. We tend to remember the best of the past. People always seem to say standards are falling, which would mean quality was at its highest in the late 1800s. What is the peak we are allegedly falling away from? I'm sure there were threads or articles or conversations, bemoaning the state of the game then, too.
|
|
|
Rank | Posts | Team |
International Board Member | 13639 | No Team Selected |
Joined | Service | Reputation |
Nov 2002 | 22 years | |
Online | Last Post | Last Page |
Jan 2025 | Jan 2025 | LINK |
Milestone Posts |
|
Milestone Years |
|
Location |
|
Signature |
TO BE FIXED |
|
| Quote ="Mild Rover"The quality of English top-flight club football has never been higher. The lack of a salary cap has allowed teams to put together star-studded teams that are dominating the European game and playing sparkling stuff.'"
You simply cannot compare the two sports, Soccer and RL and so far apart in terms of, well everything TBH (apart from the actual product where RL wins hands down). It' pointless looking at what the FA do and comparing it with the job the RFL do.
|
|
|
|
Rank | Posts | Team |
Moderator | 12655 | No Team Selected |
Joined | Service | Reputation |
Jun 2007 | 18 years | |
Online | Last Post | Last Page |
Jan 2025 | Jan 2025 | LINK |
Milestone Posts |
|
Milestone Years |
|
Location |
|
Signature |
TO BE FIXED |
Moderator
|
| Quote ="christopher"You simply cannot compare the two sports, Soccer and RL and so far apart in terms of, well everything TBH (apart from the actual product where RL wins hands down). It' pointless looking at what the FA do and comparing it with the job the RFL do.'"
The scale is massively different, but some of the principles are common to both. Speculation about overseas quotas and some sort of salary cap in football pops up fairly regularly in the press now. My point was just that creating high-quality sports product, which sounds like an unequivically good thing, might not give you an enthralling sports competition.
Maybe the NRL is a better comparison and aspiration - but the RFL has already adopted many of the same policies.
|
|
|
Rank | Posts | Team |
Player Coach | 6268 | No Team Selected |
Joined | Service | Reputation |
Oct 2005 | 19 years | |
Online | Last Post | Last Page |
Jul 2015 | Jul 2015 | LINK |
Milestone Posts |
|
Milestone Years |
|
Location |
|
Signature |
TO BE FIXED |
|
| Once all clubs can spend the cap i'd look at raising it, until then i genuinely believe in the product we have
|
|
|
Rank | Posts | Team |
Administrator | 25122 | No Team Selected |
Joined | Service | Reputation |
Dec 2001 | 23 years | |
Online | Last Post | Last Page |
Jul 2017 | May 2017 | LINK |
Milestone Posts |
|
Milestone Years |
|
Location |
|
Signature |
TO BE FIXED |
|
| If you hire crap British coaches and don't invest in youth you will get what you deserve in SL.
I can't say it any plainer than that.
|
|
|
|
Rank | Posts | Team |
Player Coach | 16166 | No Team Selected |
Joined | Service | Reputation |
Mar 2009 | 16 years | |
Online | Last Post | Last Page |
May 2018 | Dec 2017 | LINK |
Milestone Posts |
|
Milestone Years |
|
Location |
|
Signature |
TO BE FIXED |
|
| Quote ="Mugwump"If you hire crap British coaches and don't invest in youth you will get what you deserve in SL.
I can't say it any plainer than that.'"
|
|
|
Rank | Posts | Team |
International Board Member | 13639 | No Team Selected |
Joined | Service | Reputation |
Nov 2002 | 22 years | |
Online | Last Post | Last Page |
Jan 2025 | Jan 2025 | LINK |
Milestone Posts |
|
Milestone Years |
|
Location |
|
Signature |
TO BE FIXED |
|
| Quote ="Mugwump"If you hire crap British coaches and don't invest in youth you will get what you deserve in SL.
I can't say it any plainer than that.'"
Got to agree with that, it' no coincidence that Leeds have had their best few years for a long long time because they invested in the youth system and stuck with it, didn't throw silly money at over the hill Australians, had a sensible wage structure and kept the main nucleus of the side together all of them who had grown up playing Rugby League together.
|
|
|
Rank | Posts | Team |
Club Coach | 13932 | No Team Selected |
Joined | Service | Reputation |
Dec 2004 | 20 years | |
Online | Last Post | Last Page |
Jul 2010 | Jan 1970 | LINK |
Milestone Posts |
|
Milestone Years |
|
Location |
|
Signature |
TO BE FIXED |
|
| I couldn't care less who is challenging at the top as long as my team is one of them. But looking at recent years, Bradford and Wigan have really gone backwards and they havent been replaced by any of the other clubs who despite getting better, aren't anywhere up to that standard. My club Hull seemed to be getting there towards the top but have never been able to take that next step and have also gone backwards. The likes of Huddersfield, Rovers, Cas, Wakey etc might be better than in the past but we now have only 2 teams capable of seriously challenging for title instead of the 4 or 5 in the past. This isn;t down to the salary cap as I Bradford and Wigan have still been able to spend up to the limit and bring in top players if they wanted to. But the way they have been run has been very poor. For SL to be truely exciting we need to go back to having 4 or 5 teams capable of winning the league (as I say, I dont care who the others are as long as Hull are one of them ) and the standard of the other 19-10 been higher. I don't think the RFL can do anything about this tbh
|
|
|
|
Rank | Posts | Team |
Club Coach | 10399 | No Team Selected |
Joined | Service | Reputation |
Jun 2005 | 20 years | |
Online | Last Post | Last Page |
Jul 2016 | Jul 2016 | LINK |
Milestone Posts |
|
Milestone Years |
|
Location |
|
Signature |
TO BE FIXED |
|
| Clubs might be going backwards, but at least they're not going bump, which would be a lot worse for the game.
|
|
|
Rank | Posts | Team |
Club Coach | 31335 | No Team Selected |
Joined | Service | Reputation |
May 2005 | 20 years | |
Online | Last Post | Last Page |
Jan 2015 | Nov 2014 | LINK |
Milestone Posts |
|
Milestone Years |
|
Location |
|
Signature |
TO BE FIXED |
|
| Quote ="Offside Monkey"Clubs might be going backwards, but at least they're not going bump, which would be a lot worse for the game.'"
Indeed. It should now be a case of breaking eggs to make omlettes.
|
|
|
Rank | Posts | Team |
Player Coach | 6268 | No Team Selected |
Joined | Service | Reputation |
Oct 2005 | 19 years | |
Online | Last Post | Last Page |
Jul 2015 | Jul 2015 | LINK |
Milestone Posts |
|
Milestone Years |
|
Location |
|
Signature |
TO BE FIXED |
|
| Everyone talks about the 'big four' days but lets be honest it's always been Saints/Bradford, who have now been replaced by Leeds and Wigan popping up in the early SL era to win the odd trophy.
|
|
|
Rank | Posts | Team |
Administrator | 25122 | No Team Selected |
Joined | Service | Reputation |
Dec 2001 | 23 years | |
Online | Last Post | Last Page |
Jul 2017 | May 2017 | LINK |
Milestone Posts |
|
Milestone Years |
|
Location |
|
Signature |
TO BE FIXED |
|
| And without relegation [uall excuses[/u have been taken away.
SL isn't poor this season because of the salary cap, or the restrictions placed on whatever. It's poor because Wigan couldn't run a up in a brewery, Bradford - because of terminal mismanagement - are hiring clowns like Sherriffe who wouldn't get anywhere near their reserves four years ago, Warrington showed lunatic loyalty to a coach who everybody apart from them (I hope) knew wasn't up to it ... and then gave the reigns to Cullen Mk. II, Hull (who have [isome[/i excuse for tragic luck with injuries) have done their best to emulate Warrington etc. etc.
|
|
|
Rank | Posts | Team |
Club Owner | 10000 | No Team Selected |
Joined | Service | Reputation |
Feb 2004 | 21 years | |
Online | Last Post | Last Page |
Dec 2020 | Nov 2020 | LINK |
Milestone Posts |
|
Milestone Years |
|
Location |
|
Signature |
TO BE FIXED |
|
| Quote ="Mugwump"If you hire crap British coaches and don't invest in youth you will get what you deserve in SL.
I can't say it any plainer than that.'"
What if you hire crap British coaches and DO invest in youth? What do you deserve?
And are their any GOOD British coaches?!
|
|
|
Rank | Posts | Team |
Club Owner | 10000 | No Team Selected |
Joined | Service | Reputation |
Feb 2004 | 21 years | |
Online | Last Post | Last Page |
Dec 2020 | Nov 2020 | LINK |
Milestone Posts |
|
Milestone Years |
|
Location |
|
Signature |
TO BE FIXED |
|
| Quote ="Mugwump"And without relegation [uall excuses[/u have been taken away.
SL isn't poor this season because of the salary cap, or the restrictions placed on whatever. It's poor because Wigan couldn't run a mickey up in a brewery, Bradford - because of terminal mismanagement - are hiring clowns like Sherriffe who wouldn't get anywhere near their reserves four years ago, Warrington showed lunatic loyalty to a coach who everybody apart from them (I hope) knew wasn't up to it ... and then gave the reigns to Cullen Mk. II, Hull (who have [isome[/i excuse for tragic luck with injuries) have done their best to emulate Warrington etc. etc.'"
Which is basically the point I'm getting at.
Some people have tried accusing me of saying that it's due to the salary cap and the big clubs should be allowed to spend more money and buy the best players, which is not what I'm saying at all. There are some quality players at the 4/5 clubs I mentioned that are doing poor now and I think they all spend to the full SC. It's because they are run by muppets. You could sign the best players in the world, but if you coaching set-up is cr*p then they will play crap.
The pool of players at the bottom clubs have gotten better. The pool of quality players has dropped. The first thing is good, the second thing is not, and it's NOT to do with the SC IMO, rather the lack of quality coaching set-ups. We are so far behind the Aussies in this area it is unreal, and I don't think this situation will ever change until this is addressed.
WAY too much is emphasised on physiological aspects of development. We have squads filled with super athletes. We're good in this area.
What about technical aspects? Are we teaching our athletes the skills they need to go with the bodies?
What about tactical aspects? Are they being taught as a team well enough? Some clubs have brilliant tactics. Some don't seem to have any! How do coaches with no tactical sense get a job in the elite of the sport?! Baffles me!
And what about psychological aspects? How little emphasis is put on this in our game? Teams just stop performing some times. Why? Are our players mentally tough enough? Can this be changed? Are they trying to change it?
Salary cap has nothing to do with this. MAJOR money needs to be put into coaching development as well as player development if we are to improve in this country and make a better competition. Coaches make players. Players shouldn't make coaches.
|
|
|
Rank | Posts | Team |
Club Owner | 33944 | No Team Selected |
Joined | Service | Reputation |
Mar 2004 | 21 years | |
Online | Last Post | Last Page |
Mar 2016 | Mar 2016 | LINK |
Milestone Posts |
|
Milestone Years |
|
Location |
|
Signature |
TO BE FIXED |
|
| Bunch of whingeing moaning SL fans
Whats the saying " Be careful what you wish for , you just might get it "
|
|
|
Rank | Posts | Team |
Player Coach | 6268 | No Team Selected |
Joined | Service | Reputation |
Oct 2005 | 19 years | |
Online | Last Post | Last Page |
Jul 2015 | Jul 2015 | LINK |
Milestone Posts |
|
Milestone Years |
|
Location |
|
Signature |
TO BE FIXED |
|
| Quote ="Wellsy13"Which is basically the point I'm getting at.
Some people have tried accusing me of saying that it's due to the salary cap and the big clubs should be allowed to spend more money and buy the best players, which is not what I'm saying at all. There are some quality players at the 4/5 clubs I mentioned that are doing poor now and I think they all spend to the full SC. It's because they are run by muppets. You could sign the best players in the world, but if you coaching set-up is cr*p then they will play crap.
The pool of players at the bottom clubs have gotten better. The pool of quality players has dropped. The first thing is good, the second thing is not, and it's NOT to do with the SC IMO, rather the lack of quality coaching set-ups. We are so far behind the Aussies in this area it is unreal, and I don't think this situation will ever change until this is addressed.
WAY too much is emphasised on physiological aspects of development. We have squads filled with super athletes. We're good in this area.
What about technical aspects? Are we teaching our athletes the skills they need to go with the bodies?
What about tactical aspects? Are they being taught as a team well enough? Some clubs have brilliant tactics. Some don't seem to have any! How do coaches with no tactical sense get a job in the elite of the sport?! Baffles me!
And what about psychological aspects? How little emphasis is put on this in our game? Teams just stop performing some times. Why? Are our players mentally tough enough? Can this be changed? Are they trying to change it?
Salary cap has nothing to do with this. MAJOR money needs to be put into coaching development as well as player development if we are to improve in this country and make a better competition. Coaches make players. Players shouldn't make coaches.'"
That's actually a really fair post even though I disagree with your overall argument.
One other thing I think to describe Englands poor performance may be that Australia are improving at a much faster rate than we are.
|
|
|
Rank | Posts | Team |
Player Coach | 3530 | No Team Selected |
Joined | Service | Reputation |
Feb 2008 | 17 years | |
Online | Last Post | Last Page |
Jul 2009 | Jan 1970 | LINK |
Milestone Posts |
|
Milestone Years |
|
Location |
|
Signature |
TO BE FIXED |
|
| Quote ="Mugwump"And without relegation [uall excuses[/u have been taken away.
SL isn't poor this season because of the salary cap, or the restrictions placed on whatever. It's poor because Wigan couldn't run a mickey up in a brewery, Bradford - because of terminal mismanagement - are hiring clowns like Sherriffe who wouldn't get anywhere near their reserves four years ago, Warrington showed lunatic loyalty to a coach who everybody apart from them (I hope) knew wasn't up to it ... and then gave the reigns to Cullen Mk. II, Hull (who have [isome[/i excuse for tragic luck with injuries) have done their best to emulate Warrington etc. etc.'"
Exactly, If you believed the 2 resident clowns on cherry&whine, BrettKenny and Deano G, Its all the salary caps fault that wigan are so pathetically crap. I mean, wigan have spent more on transfer fees in the last 3 years than the rest of SL combined in the last 10 and they are still awful lol
|
|
|
Rank | Posts | Team |
Club Owner | 14082 | No Team Selected |
Joined | Service | Reputation |
Apr 2004 | 21 years | |
Online | Last Post | Last Page |
Feb 2017 | Feb 2017 | LINK |
Milestone Posts |
|
Milestone Years |
|
Location |
|
Signature |
TO BE FIXED |
|
| the quality coaching needs to begin when players are 12, not 20!
a 1st grade coach shouldn't need to be teaching players how to pass and defend.
|
|
|
Rank | Posts | Team |
Club Owner | 33944 | No Team Selected |
Joined | Service | Reputation |
Mar 2004 | 21 years | |
Online | Last Post | Last Page |
Mar 2016 | Mar 2016 | LINK |
Milestone Posts |
|
Milestone Years |
|
Location |
|
Signature |
TO BE FIXED |
|
| Quote ="JB Down Under"the quality coaching needs to begin when players are 12, not 20!
a 1st grade coach shouldn't need to be teaching players how to pass and defend.'"
Yes but dont forget over here we are more bothered about winning and knocking the oppositions heads off at 12 than actually learning all the players all the skills
|
|
|
Rank | Posts | Team |
Club Owner | 10000 | No Team Selected |
Joined | Service | Reputation |
Feb 2004 | 21 years | |
Online | Last Post | Last Page |
Dec 2020 | Nov 2020 | LINK |
Milestone Posts |
|
Milestone Years |
|
Location |
|
Signature |
TO BE FIXED |
|
| Quote ="Dico"That's actually a really fair post even though I disagree with your overall argument.
One other thing I think to describe Englands poor performance may be that Australia are improving at a much faster rate than we are.'"
I'd be intrigued to know what you disagree with for arguments sake?
As for the WC performance, there are a lot of reasons why we did rubbish. As a national team, I don't think England/GB have improved at all in the time I've been watching them (which is only a decade to be fair). In my experience on my sports course at uni, if there's one thing I've had constantly reiterated to me it's that the Aussies are so far in front of us in pretty much every sports department there is it's scarey. There are things we are doing now that they were doing 5-10 years ago. It's gonna take a hell of a lot of money to be able to set up decent systems to catch them up which is something we don't have at the moment. And not only is it going to take money to impliment these set-ups, it's going to take time and money to actually find out WHERE to impliment it, which is something we just don't look like we know how to do.
|
|
|
Rank | Posts | Team |
Administrator | 25122 | No Team Selected |
Joined | Service | Reputation |
Dec 2001 | 23 years | |
Online | Last Post | Last Page |
Jul 2017 | May 2017 | LINK |
Milestone Posts |
|
Milestone Years |
|
Location |
|
Signature |
TO BE FIXED |
|
| Quote ="Wellsy13"What if you hire crap British coaches and DO invest in youth? What do you deserve?'"
Failure is its own reward.
Quote And are their any GOOD British coaches?!'"
There a lots of poor ones and a handful of average ones.
|
|
|
Rank | Posts | Team |
International Chairman | 9721 | No Team Selected |
Joined | Service | Reputation |
Dec 2001 | 23 years | |
Online | Last Post | Last Page |
Aug 2020 | Apr 2020 | LINK |
Milestone Posts |
|
Milestone Years |
|
Location |
|
Signature |
TO BE FIXED |
|
| Quote ="JB Down Under"the quality coaching needs to begin when players are 12, not 20!
a 1st grade coach shouldn't need to be teaching players how to pass and defend.'"
They don't!
Its that obvious
|
|
|
|
|