It matters because it shows there are well over 80,000 people willing to attend live rugby in the London area

Don't forget PT Barnums famous saying about people.

It is also open to debate whether or not they were watching the game or each other as an ego boost

Yet only around 10% of that amount turn up each week to watch Saracens.

So far in the Aviva Premiership there have been just 20 games (out of 93 non Twickenham/Wembley event games Rounds 1-16) with an attendance higher than the Leeds v London crowd. And 8 of those are Leicester's home games.

The RFU are very good at marketing and getting good crowds to event games in London. For regular games, the Union clubs struggle with attendances similar to those of League.

League can get high crowds too, we struggle being based in the north (ie well away from London) and with having less central funds to play with than in Union.
But we also don't put enough effort into it, both at club and governing body level.

Except there wasnt

Shane mate. You're flogging a dead horse here.
The same company that the RFL used to "fill" Wembley for the Double Header Semi-Final Big Hit Event last year were used by Saracens to promote this Event.
The key thing is the use of the word EVENT, as it points to how these games are promoted. Not as a something for the Rugby enthusiast of either code, but as something to grab as many mates as you can and head to the big stadium for. Given the pricing, which I expect included freebies through cheapies to fully blown fat cat corporate pricing, it becomes an opportunity for "ordinary" folk, who can't afford £100+ for a ticket to a Wembley game of Soccer to visit the National Stadium....something that I am sure many of us would like to do at least once.
Then you have the corporates. Harlequins RU do not pull their crowds from Twickenham post codes, but are themselves known as the "City Club", drawing support from all over the stock broker belts of South West and West London. Offices will have been offered bulk tickets at cheap rates and for every stuffed shirted Jeremy who went, he'd probably have dragged a stuffed shirted Jemima!

As for the aesthetics and financials, Saracens have no apparently now played at Wembley 11 times in 4 years, so I very much doubt they do so at a "loss". It boosts their seasons average (18,002 last year.....not bad given their home grounds only holds 10,000) and also helps them further promote their "brand". Now, this is where the chipped shoulder brigade sharpen their keyboards.....BRAND.

Saracens invested some £20,000,000 in the building of the stadium......no small amount of cash. One of the ways they needed to re-coup some of this money was through sponsorship opportunities and the German Insurance Giant Allianz opted to pay them £1,330,000 a year for 6 years to rename the arena, as well as for the front of their shirts.
I'm not sure about the NRL, but £1,330,000 a year is £130,000 more than Bradford got for FOUR YEARS in a deal heralded as the biggest in SL history......patently the shiny new stadium at Copthall is worth slightly more than the Iconic Odsal?

Now, to my favourite subject.....London Broncos.

If ever a club had been more ineptly managed than London Broncos, then it's not one I have ever heard of. David Hughes has "invested" close to £14,000,000 over the last 7 years and has only allocated 7% of that for marketing and promotion. The rest he has ed away on inadequate coaches and pension seeking ANZACS combined with kids that needed a few more years at the Skolars/Academy grade before stepping up. As a result, in the same 7 season period and that includes the 6 games this year BTW, the team have managed to win 47 of the 167 SL games they have played. Not sure about you buddy, but a 28% win ratio isn't going to make attending games a habit I'd want to form.
So, no marketing and no excuse to come back if you happen to be a new fan, which leaves the existing base. 2008 saw close to 1,200 ST holders.......to gauge the level of disconnection achieved by Hughes and his CEO in recent times, less than 200 this year. I know of fans who will not go to the hive until Mackay (CEO) leaves, which is rumoured to be at the end of this month








This means that whilst there may be 80,000 people who will attend games in London, I'd be stunned if .5% of that number bother on Thursday at the Hive.....London Broncos had something to advertise a few years back, but now they are simply an embarrassment to the top tier of the game in general....it really is frustrating, but it is too late to help them now.

Can't remember where but I was reading an article a couple of days ago saying the very early hires did cost money but they kept going, built momentum and now make a profit on their Wembley hire events.

The lad who sits next to me at work went together with five others from his family. None of them have ever been to a rugby game before, the tickets cost a fiver each. Nice PR work. As a rapidly being alienated London Broncos fan I wish that the RL game down here had been able to build something like this. If only we'd got our hands on Mark Evans when we were part of the Quins set up, things may have been very different down here now. Instead we are left looking on at Sarries pulling in a crowd that will, realistically, outnumber the all the gates at Broncos, Skolars, Hemel, Oxford, Gloucestershire and South Wales this season combined. I doubt Mark would have tolerated the mess the junior development system is in down here either.

The RFL not letting IL keep his interest in London combined with David Hughes not having the slightest ing clue and being incapable of taking advice from anyone have landed the club in exactly the kind of situation that many fans predicted.

IL and Mark Evans put together the move to the Stoop...the minute IL stepped back, Hughes, who has very little in the way of business acumen other than flogging oil, quickly soured the relationship with Evans, who was our only champion at TW2.When Evans left TW2, the Quins Board of Directors and new CEO were chillier than cool towards us as they saw us no longer as an opportunity, but as a rent-paying hindrance.

People underestimate the stupidity of David Hughes sometimes.........In the 7 years since IL was made to walk away, Hughes has lost 70% of our crowds, 70% of our games and £14,000,000.

I predicted at the start of this year, before the fixtures were announced, that London Broncos points conceded total for the year would be bigger than their lowest attendance in SL XIX........I suspect that I may be proven correct in this prediction by the end of April.

It truly is a frustrating end to a situation that could and should have been so different.

Tony Copsey was very pro the joint enterprise too. His departure from Quins RU left us on a weaker position at The Stoop.

Mark out his neck on the block when he moved Quins RU games to Twickers but built it into something special which Sarries learnt from. Broncos gave away travel card holders and sponsored a handful of cabs instead.

...don't forget the viral videos that were also played on a loop at ANZAC bars in the capital



In fact, I was wrong earlier when I said Hughes had lost 70% of out fans, 70% of our games and £14,000,000.......I forgot to count the RFL/SKY grant money as well as the Ticketing, sponsorship and corporate revenues raised in that period too.......he's actually wasted closer to £28,000,000

You weren't sat in any of these seats then? Great crowd but announcing 83,900 (in a 90k stadium) was a lie.

We had managed to get this thread away from the inane mumblings regarding a Union club game crowd......well done you for getting it back on topic

Here speaketh the ultimate thread hijacker. Read the opening post to this thread. I was just pointing out that it was a lie and should not be claiming any records.

Not read the whole thread, but they were giving tickets away if you bought/ renewed your insurance in the last month at least. Perception is everything though and people are talking about this huge crowd not how many actually paid anything. Exactly the same as the RFL did to fill stadia at the RLWC.

Who won the kickandmaulathon ?

Replies not necessary RU is boring to watch and folk go for nothing more than a good p*ss up.

I would suggest that if they go to watch that rubbish then they're already p*ssed up.

Official attendance of 67,575 at Wembley for the RLWC semi final double header.



No, really.

Yep, looks about 67k there to me. Or do we just stick with misleading pictures to try and prove a point?

You and your misleading pictures to try and prove a point





Why can't you just admit that both League and Union massage attendance figures with freebies, cheapies and no-shows?

Are you really that insecure about the sport you clearly care about?

How the hell is this picture (with packed stands during the Aussie-Fiji game misleading)? Australia and Fiji are playing and the stands are full. Look at it again?

I like many thousands left at half-time with it being around 36-0 and I was freezing my nuts off. I suppose I didn't attend the game then nor did the other tens of thousands in the image below? Or is there a new clock in, clock out rule I haven't heard about?

Deary me you misleading Shoe Shine Johnny, you!



Packed stands, my booty!

The stands weren't even packed for England V New Zealand.







I'll ask you again.

Why can't you just admit that both League and Union massage their attendance figures with freebies, cheapies, empty red seats and no-shows?

You tried to make out no-one was there for Fiji-Australia, I just showed you a photo that showed there were full stands for that game in the first half (of the sections that were opened). That is the only point I have made on this entire thread.

Apparently lost of tennis competitions make losses for the first few yrs, they build crowds and sponsors and after a few yrs, and then they start making money, I was watching the Cincinatti Masters a couple of years ago and they were going on about this. I used to watch a lot of the WTA, until all the women started to be bigger than me, bring back my favourite sportsperson ever, M Hingis; and J Henin too. I know D Cibulkova is shorter than me, but that's about it.

lol

Sounds like Sale Sharks attendance announcements.