But, what's that worth? Any promoted team changes the majority of their 1st 17 in an effort to stay up and still struggle (often because the only free agents they can get have been released by the team they're replacing).

Whilst ability on the ptich in the 2nd tier is a factor to be considered, being realistic, it is not the be all and end all when considering all the factors that determine a clubs ability to contribute to Superleague.

Widnes have a ground that is currently hosting Superleague games. They're also getting a fancy dan iGrass pitch, or something like that.
Don't their youth teams compete favourably with their Superleague equivalents? Its a proven point that the most succesful teams are the ones that can promote from within.
Since their Chairman has taken over, hasn't he given them financial security? Is that through throwing money at them or stabilising them as a business?

I'm looking forward to having them back. Mainly because its an easy away game for me to get to.

Just like you lot Crusaders handed you a sl spot

Widnes should have been up 3 years ago i for one cant wait to play them

Damo and king warrior in the same thread?

Wow!

What sort of crowds are you expecting Widnes to draw? I guess they are going to struggle on the field for first couple of years but is around 8,000 avg realistic?

i reckon they will get 5-6 kbut in a few years that could grow if they are successful on the pitch.

5/6,000 HOME fans probably so with 3 bumper local derbies and hopefully a few others fancying making a fresh trip (ex Saints, lol) would be looking at 7-8,000 average hopefully (home gate will also rise with derbies).

I think we averaged about 6,800 in our last season in Super League. That was with us rooted to second bottom pretty much all season. I'm thinking more 7-8 thousand average to be honest.

And hopefully you will get it. I would say that away support from all clubs has been down in recent years. If you can get 5-6k home support you will be onto a very good start.

You don't have to worry mate they won't come near you in the league. They'll sign Brent Webb and Kylie Leuleuai off you so you can replace them with Ben Jones Bishop and Brad Singleton and you can go about your normal business trying to get as high as you can in the play offs and watch Widnes battle with the likes of Quins, Salford, Wakey ect for the beloved fourth from bottom spot.

They managed to sign Warringtons second team to win the NRC and then sat around knowing that because the RFL's rules which were set out were perfect for them to get into SL without having to be competitive.

Judging by the amount of Widnes fans which have posted on here they'll flood in numbers to slate me. Yes I'm a Barrow fan and our club has been run in an absolute shambles and we are blatant cheats. But as a fan I can't do anything about that I just support my club as I have done for the majority of my life. So you can slate me about that and use that in your argument but it's irrelevant and I couldn't care less.

Don't even know what your point is. You're having a go because we followed the rules?

And they didn't

More of a go at the rules rather than the club, they are a joke.

I wont have a Barrow fan lecture me about how my team has behaved recently. We stuck to the cap! A cap which was lowered to benefit teams like yours and Barrow cheated to gain an advantage over others. You can't for a second lecture any team about how they've performed. It's not irrelevant at all. You accuse us of "signing warrington's second team" (Kevin Penny constitutes a team, and let's not forget your loan signings and dual reg players), going in for rejects like Brent Webb and Leuleuai (neither are on the radar right now although there was talk of Webb a while back) and slating us because we wont be challenging for the super league title in our very first super league season. At least we will be there.

You're not making any sense. Worse than that, your team is likely to be in championship 1 next season as a result of gross misdeeds and bad management which threw the league into disrepute, ours is heading to super league because we got our professional side together. We're your polar opposites, in a good way, and we're being rewarded for that and you're not.

Now I don't want to appear lording it over Barrow fans, but you simply cannot snipe at us like that. I've got sympathy for decent fans who are paying the price for bad management but why are you personally having a go at us?

That's absolute BULL.

You had a go at US.

Of course, it would clearly have been right to award Barrow a Super League place for winning the Grand Final while cheating the salary cap. Call me old fashioned but....

Well I read your first two paragraphs of bilious untruth with great amusement, then to find out you a Barrow fan just topped it off.

What you are spouting is wilfully ignorant of the facts. I pity that tiny narrow
minded view of the world you have..

Just imagine.

Could have been an absolute disaster.

You have been linked with those two players and also Ali Lauititi, your club also has some decent young full backs knocking about but are going to be deprieved of a first team spot.

I re read the post and it did seem like I was sniping at yous but I intended it for to be at the rules. I actually wanted you to win the league this year when you went on a 10 game unbeaten streak because it wouldn't look like such a shambles from people looking from other sports when a club gets promoted from 5th.

One of the reasons for my bitterness towards your fans is because when we scored a try in the second half when we won 38-0 I was stood in the end with all the Widnes supporters because thats where I stand every game and I dont feel the need to move as RL is a family sport,I cheered and I got called an Inbred cumbrian and was told to f off, I was 14 at the time.

Your a good club with a smart businessman running it, I've been told you had one of the greatest sides ever before I was born and your fans are generally alright.

The first paragraph was, the second wasn't.

First paragraph you have been linked with all those players over various sources. You will be in the bottom 4 for the first few seasons of SL, even your own fans admit that. Second paragraph was a go at the rules and the fact that to get promoted you pretty much didn't have to do anything on the pitch after you won the 2009 NRC, shouldn't of said the bit about Warrington that probably made it seem like it was a dig at the club.

I don't have a narrow minded view of the world, your generally making that judgement off one point I have made. Judging someones view of the world is off 3 paragraphs isn't going to be an accurate judgement.

We've been linked with almost every free agent of the game since we've been super league bound and quite a few on contract. If we signed every one of them we'd have a squad larger than Barrows 46!

What happened I can't do anything about. I was at that game and there were a lot of frustrated fans as it was Mark Smith's last game and he didn't get the send off he warranted but its fair to say that every club has people we'd rather take up another hobby, and you shouldn't let it colour your opinion of all of us.

Whatever the issues of "the rules" it's wrong to attack us for it. I dont even buy this "we weren't trying" business. We've had two teams cheat the cap whereas we have been sticking to it. We've been playing youth players and certain other teams haven't. It's difficult to assume we're going to win the league when most of the teams in it are paying the same wages or more than you. I admit things have not been the best on the pitch, but we're not working under P & R are we?

But if we had P & R we'd never have voted for the lower cap rate. Swings and roundabouts.

FFS, this again

.

Ronnie, do yourself a favour, go and have a lie down son.

It would be the same for any club going into SL from a league with a £300k salary cap - even via P&R. So, what is the point you are trying to make?

You're right. All you've done here is bore us all with a massive, pointless whinge.

Those 20 seconds or so of your life must of been costly. Teams with a winning mentallity generally do better when they get promoted as the squad generally has a better morale and they can keep the foundation of the squad in and build around it. Instead you are going to build a completely new team with no chemistry whatsoever which is why you will do worse than you would if you got promoted.

I don't agree with the salary cap but thats a different topic all together

To certain extent, you may be right. But spending up to the salary cap would be a far more important factor, as the squad would have to change dramatically anyway. More often than not, clubs struggled after being promoted via P&R and usually finished around the bottom end. There are very few exceptions. So, this doesn't really back up what you are saying. The main reason why Widnes fans think we will be at the bottom of the league has more to do with the hopeless coach we have in place and not the squad, which has largely been discarded. What chemistry the squad has will come down to good coaching and the quality of the players recruited, and not how a very different bunch of players faired in the Championship.

I actually would bring P&R back tomorrow and raise the salary cap in the Championship to £500,000 (based on club turnover and profits) in order to ease transition.