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TBH, I thought we'd left behind these on-a-wing-and-a-prayer inclusions (Mansfileld, Fulham, PSG etc. etc.) when Richard Lewis took over. Is it a co-incidence that CC arrive just when he's winding down at Red Hall? To me the prospect of Nigel Wood running the show is truly **terrifying**. The guy is a loon and I can only assume his rise to the top is based on his ability as a politician and peerless glad handing.
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| Quote ="Hillsborough Lad"How about the fact that teams were told they could only apply for a franchise from NL1 (as it was then). These players were illegal right from the start, and at least 3 of them were used in their promotion season of 2007.'" Have you got any proof of this? As far as I'm aware, they continue to be perfectly compliant with competition rules. Have you got any evidence to support your allegation that Celtic have been fielding ineligible players? |
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| Quote ="Steve Fox"Does it matter?
If the players and/or the club have been bending the rules they deserve to have sanctions against them. How the authorities found out is surely an irrelevance.'"
I agree , as I posted it was a reply to totally unfounded insinuations by a Quins fan that a disgruntled lower tier club ' near W1g4n  ' might have been involved  |
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| Quote ="Starbug"No evidence apart from the quote by Mr Samuels that players were working for his company and playing for free on holiday visa's
Dont ask for a ' link '
I dont do ' links '
'" There are no laws against players on holiday visas, at least there weren't when these players came over. Many Super League players such as Luke Dorn were originally on working holiday visas. If you are alleging that Celtic cheated the salary cap, then that's a different thing entirely and equally there's no way you could ever prove that or have any basis for the allegation. |
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Another gentle reminder:
The UK's laws on defamation apply to incorporated bodies as well individuals. Beware of actionable accusations.
I've removed some posts. I don't want to end up having to remove posters.
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| Quote ="tb"Another gentle reminder:
The UK's laws on defamation apply to incorporated bodies as well individuals. Beware of actionable accusations.
I've removed some posts. I don't want to end up having to remove posters.'" What I can't believe is that there are people who are supposedly fans of our sport that want to make allegations against a much-needed expansion club in its first year that are so severe that admin have to step in. To be honest that's unbelievable. What a pathetic bunch of morons. |
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| Quote ="Wes Hooligan"There are no laws against players on holiday visas, at least there weren't when these players came over. Many Super League players such as Luke Dorn were originally on working holiday visas. If you are alleging that Celtic cheated the salary cap, then that's a different thing entirely and equally there's no way you could ever prove that or have any basis for the allegation.'"
Never said there was , just what was reported
Apparently that loophole has now been shut |
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| Will Saints make complaints if Leeds totally annulated Crusaders on Saturday. Just think they could of done the same given the same circumstances when they beat them 4 - 0 a few months ago.
Should be some very interesting moaning from the Saints camp |
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| Quote ="Starbug"Never said there was , just what was reported
Apparently that loophole has now been shut'" Yeah, that's probably why they have had problems with these players. |
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| Quote ="Wes Hooligan"What I can't believe is that there are people who are supposedly fans of our sport that want to make allegations against a much-needed expansion club in its first year that are so severe that admin have to step in. To be honest that's unbelievable. What a pathetic bunch of morons.'"
Problem is that the current problems that the much needed expansion club have are possibly partly as a result of what they have done in the previous seasons , and quite possibly what the governing body have encouraged them to do to be competitive
So dont blame me
I'd rather it all be out in the open , no arguments then |
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| Quote ="Starbug"Problem is that the current problems that the much needed expansion club have are possibly partly as a result of what they have done in the previous seasons , and quite possibly what the governing body have encouraged them to do to be competitive
So dont blame me
I'd rather it all be out in the open , no arguments then'" I guess it's quite natural for someone to hate a club that achieves more in three years than their club has done in 100. It's just a bit pathetic. I never blamed you Starbug
Widnes would not be promoted anyway. Barrow are the best team in the Championship and therefore should be next in line for a Super League place. Just like if automatic promotion and relegation still existed. Because that's fair, right? |
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| Quote ="Wes Hooligan":2ln6l8gcI guess it's quite natural for someone :2ln6l8gcto hate a club :2ln6l8gcthat achieves more in three years than their club has done in 100. It's just a bit pathetic. I never blamed you Starbug
Widnes would not be promoted anyway. Barrow are the best team in the Championship and therefore should be next in line for a Super League place. Just like if automatic promotion and relegation still existed. Because that's fair, right?'"
A return to annual P and R , well whoever wins the GF , and with 6 clubs all within 3 points it could be anybody who puts a couple of wins together
It certainley wont be Leigh though |
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Quote ="Wes Hooligan"Have you got any proof of this? As far as I'm aware, they continue to be perfectly compliant with competition rules. Have you got any evidence to support your allegation that Celtic have been fielding ineligible players?'"
news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/rugby_l ... 207827.stm
"The investigation found discrepancies in the visa applications of the six players in seasons prior to 2009."
Therefore - they wouldn't have received Visas without whatever the descrepancies were, meaning that they wouldn't have been here prior to this season. Three of them were here from day one, when they presumably first applied for the visas with the descrepancies. |
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Quote ="Wes Hooligan"Have you got any proof of this? As far as I'm aware, they continue to be perfectly compliant with competition rules. Have you got any evidence to support your allegation that Celtic have been fielding ineligible players?'"
news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/rugby_l ... 207827.stm
"The investigation found discrepancies in the visa applications of the six players in seasons prior to 2009."
Therefore - they wouldn't have received Visas without whatever the descrepancies were, meaning that they wouldn't have been here prior to this season. Three of them were here from day one, when they presumably first applied for the visas with the descrepancies. | |
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| Quote ="Hillsborough Lad"news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/rugby_league/super_league/celtic_crusaders/8207827.stm
"The investigation found discrepancies in the visa applications of the six players in seasons prior to 2009."
Therefore - they wouldn't have received Visas without whatever the descrepancies were, meaning that they wouldn't have been here prior to this season. Three of them were here from day one, when they presumably first applied for the visas with the descrepancies.'" That still doesn't mean they were illegal players. They were registered and Celtic had every right to field them. Visas are a means of getting into the country, and are nothing to do with any sporting organisation.
Starbug, I was not referring to you in my post. |
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| Quote ="Wes Hooligan"I guess it's quite natural for someone to hate a club that achieves more in three years than their club has done in 100. It's just a bit pathetic. I never blamed you Starbug
Widnes would not be promoted anyway. Barrow are the best team in the Championship and therefore should be next in line for a Super League place. Just like if automatic promotion and relegation still existed. Because that's fair, right?'"
How the heck you're a moderator I'll never know. |
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| Quote ="Wes Hooligan"That still doesn't mean they were illegal players. They were registered and Celtic had every right to field them. Visas are a means of getting into the country, and are nothing to do with any sporting organisation.
Starbug, I was not referring to you in my post.'"
No, you're right, having a dodgy visa and the club not making adequate checks, as they are required to do by law, is fine. |
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| Quote ="Wes Hooligan"I guess it's quite natural for someone to hate a club that achieves more in three years than their club has done in 100.'"
No, I guess it's natural for people to gloat when you put a club on a pedestal and sneer at clubs which have been around for decades. Of which you and others have done plenty since Celtic were awarded a franchise.
Quote ="Wes Hooligan"It's just a bit pathetic. '"
Yep, it certainly is. |
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| Quote ="Barnacle Bill"No, I guess it's natural for people to gloat when you put a club on a pedestal and sneer at clubs which have been around for decades. Of which you and others have done plenty since Celtic were awarded a franchise.
Yep, it certainly is.'"
Short and to the point as ever Bill |
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| Quote ="Hillsborough Lad"No, you're right, having a dodgy visa and the club not making adequate checks, as they are required to do by law, is fine.'" It's not fine and they got their punishment by being deported and banned for ten years. They weren't ineligible players though, as you initially suggested, and to be honest it's completely the government's fault that they were allowed to live here for almost four years and were repeatedly let in and out of the country without ever being stopped at the border. They clearly had the relevant work permits, which is the club's responsibility, or they wouldn't have been able to be paid or to pay tax. |
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| Quote ="Barnacle Bill"No, I guess it's natural for people to gloat when you put a club on a pedestal and sneer at clubs which have been around for decades. Of which you and others have done plenty since Celtic were awarded a franchise.
Yep, it certainly is.'" Who has put them on a pedestal? I have repeatedly defended them in the face of a barrage of attacks and mindless allegations from people who seem to be constantly poised ready to pounce on even the slightest mistake, and who wish the worst on a newly formed expansion club for no other reason than that they are successful. Are you trying to say that we should all condemn them, and that everyone should always agree with you? Do you realise that in your reply you have actually called the people you are trying to defend pathetic? |
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The whole game looks a bit silly because of this, people complain about press coverage, BBC bias etc - but they don't need to do anything while we keep shooting ourselves in the foot.
We weren't ready to have a 14 club Super League, and Celtic were not ready for a SL license - unfortunately the RFL knew that Samuels wouldn't hang around in the lower leagues building the club up properly and desperately shoe-horned them in .
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| Quote ="Wes Hooligan"Who has put them on a pedestal? I have repeatedly defended them in the face of a barrage of attacks and mindless allegations from people who seem to be constantly poised ready to pounce on even the slightest mistake, and who wish the worst on a newly formed expansion club for no other reason than that they are successful. Are you trying to say that we should all condemn them, and that everyone should always agree with you? Do you realise that in your reply you have actually called the people you are trying to defend pathetic?'"
The slightest mistake? Half the teams been deported for Christ's sake! |
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anybody who thinks rugby league will ever take off in wales is an absolute idiot
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Quote ="Wes Hooligan"That still doesn't mean they were illegal players. They were registered and Celtic had every right to field them. Visas are a means of getting into the country, and are nothing to do with any sporting organisation.
Starbug, I was not referring to you in my post.'"
This report seems to suggest otherwise: www.guardian.co.uk/sport/2009/au ... ians-visas
Celtic themselves are under investigation and the UKBA has already concluded that "deception was used in bringing the players into the country" - Do you still maintain they we not illegal players? You seem to want to take the line just because they were issued vias, no-one should take any blame - what about the question of how those visa were awarded in the 1st place?
If I was to apply for a credit card or loan in someone elses name but later get caught, people won't turn round and say "well it was the banks fault" or "once the money has been issued, you can spend it how you want without any comeback." The Guardian report is quite damning to the point of bascially saying the club are to blame and blatently lied in order for the visas to be granted - No lies = No visa - but because they did lie and the visa were granted, you seem to think this made it legally ok for them to play? |
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Quote ="Wes Hooligan"That still doesn't mean they were illegal players. They were registered and Celtic had every right to field them. Visas are a means of getting into the country, and are nothing to do with any sporting organisation.
Starbug, I was not referring to you in my post.'"
This report seems to suggest otherwise: www.guardian.co.uk/sport/2009/au ... ians-visas
Celtic themselves are under investigation and the UKBA has already concluded that "deception was used in bringing the players into the country" - Do you still maintain they we not illegal players? You seem to want to take the line just because they were issued vias, no-one should take any blame - what about the question of how those visa were awarded in the 1st place?
If I was to apply for a credit card or loan in someone elses name but later get caught, people won't turn round and say "well it was the banks fault" or "once the money has been issued, you can spend it how you want without any comeback." The Guardian report is quite damning to the point of bascially saying the club are to blame and blatently lied in order for the visas to be granted - No lies = No visa - but because they did lie and the visa were granted, you seem to think this made it legally ok for them to play? | |
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Quote ="vikings 4 ever"This report seems to suggest otherwise: www.guardian.co.uk/sport/2009/au ... ians-visas
Celtic themselves are under investigation and the UKBA has already concluded that "deception was used in bringing the players into the country" - Do you still maintain they we not illegal players? You seem to want to take the line just because they were issued vias, no-one should take any blame - what about the question of how those visa were awarded in the 1st place?
If I was to apply for a credit card or loan in someone elses name but later get caught, people won't turn round and say "well it was the banks fault" or "once the money has been issued, you can spend it how you want without any comeback." The Guardian report is quite damning to the point of bascially saying the club are to blame and blatently lied in order for the visas to be granted - No lies = No visa - but because they did lie and the visa were granted, you seem to think this made it legally ok for them to play?'" I am not trying to say that nobody is to blame. However, there is a difference between being illegally in the country and being an illegal player. Under RFL rules there was nothing untoward, and I was responding to someone who suggested that the Crusaders had been fielding ineligible players since their inception. I'm also not sure how a body could so badly deceive immigration officials for four years, particularly as the article suggests that the players were initially here on working holiday visas which have presumably since expired, so you'll forgive me for assuming a bit of sensationalism on the part of The Guardian. If the club are found guilty of anything untowards then I will admit I was wrong, but I do not think this will be the case. |
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Quote ="vikings 4 ever"This report seems to suggest otherwise: www.guardian.co.uk/sport/2009/au ... ians-visas
Celtic themselves are under investigation and the UKBA has already concluded that "deception was used in bringing the players into the country" - Do you still maintain they we not illegal players? You seem to want to take the line just because they were issued vias, no-one should take any blame - what about the question of how those visa were awarded in the 1st place?
If I was to apply for a credit card or loan in someone elses name but later get caught, people won't turn round and say "well it was the banks fault" or "once the money has been issued, you can spend it how you want without any comeback." The Guardian report is quite damning to the point of bascially saying the club are to blame and blatently lied in order for the visas to be granted - No lies = No visa - but because they did lie and the visa were granted, you seem to think this made it legally ok for them to play?'" I am not trying to say that nobody is to blame. However, there is a difference between being illegally in the country and being an illegal player. Under RFL rules there was nothing untoward, and I was responding to someone who suggested that the Crusaders had been fielding ineligible players since their inception. I'm also not sure how a body could so badly deceive immigration officials for four years, particularly as the article suggests that the players were initially here on working holiday visas which have presumably since expired, so you'll forgive me for assuming a bit of sensationalism on the part of The Guardian. If the club are found guilty of anything untowards then I will admit I was wrong, but I do not think this will be the case. | |
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' might have been involved 
