McGilvery saw the ball once in a decent position and scored, Hall saw the ball once in space and scored. On both occasions the centres were not in the move. Not sure that is a coincidence.

Widdop's kicking was spot on, as was his speculative flick to Hall. He tried but there didn't seem to be a lot of options when someone tried something. Thought Gale was relatively annomomous.

There is a query as to whether some people have actually trained together as players seemed to have to stop for the ball to arrive reducing their speed and impact on contact.

And how long did the Kiwis get to lie on the player every tackle. Whether it was different for us can't say but all seemed very slow at the play the ball.

Bateman and Gale were picked out from the get go, then they sniffed out Hodgson and Sarginson. In terms of our attack I thought it was like watching Hull under Agar. Would guess Betts has had too much to do with it.

Truth is we weren't that bad. We had all the vplay and ball in the first half hour and on another day we would have posted a couple of tries in that period and the game would have been different. We didn't but still should have taken a point from the game the game with a bit of savvy. People are talking as if we took a beating.

Its high time we got another win over the Aussies, what is it, a decade now? no better time than in two weeks. Iron a few things out, blitz Scotland and we i'm confident we will give it a good go.

I would drop Widdop not enough creativity and just passes the ball on most of the time. Bateman also, seems to enjoy the contact to make into a wrestling game not enough punch and dynamic. Lomax not got the experience at this level but I,m not sure if Ratchford would be a better replacement. For me throw Williams or Brown in at 6, running or kicking plays would increase pressure.

The Kiwis didn't just win by a drop goal. They scored three tries to two.

Only four players stood out for England: the two wingers and the two hookers.

Three tries to two. Enough said.

Every England player who doesn't play for my club side were rubbish.

Every England player from my club side stood up and played well.

I will not have any of the England players who play for my club side scapegoated either.

Oh, and if there had been several more players from my club who had been selected, England would [i'of'[/i won.

And finally... the ref was crap and favoured the Kiwis who were allowed to lie on in the tackle all game, mess about at the PTB and get away with it for 80 minutes.

Apart from that... England dominated because they have the best pack of forwards in the world.

Yep.

Widdop to full back, Williams to five eighth, Lomax to the centres. That will make a huge difference.

BTW has Paul Sculthorpe got some official position in the England set-up?

Sarginson was the worst player on the pitch by a country mile, Bateman started off ok but was soon found wanting at international level, Watkins looked too disinterested.
I think the loss of Ferres didn't help and I'd have given houghton a chance at this level

Yeah but the Johnson intercept was an absolute gift from Widdop.

Nothing in it mate, one point. Johnson the difference, fair play to him a great player and he stood up like great players do in these games. Unfortunately we don't have a game breaker close to him.

As for the thread starter, please continue to watch a game with just the one eye open.

That's what the vast majority of RL fans do.

After all, there was only one team playing this afternoon.

Anyone else care to assess the Kiwi performance player by player?

No?

Thought not.

Marks out of 10...

[uENGLAND[/u
Lomax 6
McGillvary 8
Watkins 4
Sarginson 5
Hall 6
Widdop 7
Gale 6
Hill 7
Hodgson 7
Graham 7
Bateman 6
Whitehead 6
S. Burgess 6

T. Burgess 6
G. Burgess 5
Cooper 5
Clark 5

Total = 102

[uNEW ZEALAND[/u
Kahu 7
Nightingale 6
Kata 6
Kenny-Dowall 5
Rapana 8
Leuluai 6
Johnson 8
Bromwich 6
Luke 7
Waerea-Hargreaves 5
Proctor 6
Harris 6
Taumalolo 7

Brown 6
Taupau 8
Ma'u 7
Blair 6

Total = 110

As a Saints fan id drop Lomax. There is no excuse for that attempted tackle. There are under 10s who would have completed that tackle and in offence someone needs to tell him that running in the direction of the touch judge isn't really what we need. Sarginson is another. Absolutely woeful. I don't think I've ever seen a poorer effort ever. Get him stacking shelves because he isn't a rugby league player. everyone else can at least hold their heads up bar Watkins. I know the Leeds fans think he's the best super league centre since Jamie Lyon but the reality is he is average (if that) at best as was shown today

Regards

King James

[uPlayer Stats[/u

[uENGLAND[/u
Most metres: Graham 160m, S. Burgess 147m, Hill 96m
Tackles: Graham 35, Hodgson 33, S. Burgess 33
Hit-Ups: Graham 18, S. Burgess 18, Sarginson 15
Offloads: Hill 4, S. Burgess 3, Sarginson 3
Missed Tackles: Gale 3, Hodgson 2, McGillvary 2
Errors: S. Burgess 3, Sarginson 2

[uNEW ZEALAND[/u
Most metres: Taumalolo 213m, Rapana 165m, Taupau 128m
Tackles: Harris 30, Proctor 28, Blair 26
Hit-Ups: Taumalolo 24, Bromwich 15, Taupau 15
Offloads: Taupau 4, Proctor 2
Missed Tackles: Blair 3, Johnson 2, Rapana 2
Errors: 9 Kiwi players made 1 error

Alex Murphy was a pretty good half back with a pretty good kicking game.

Top level games are won by small margins.
For me, our centres aren't good enough. We don't have a half anywhere near as good as Johnson (or Thurston or Cronk).
Also thought Taumalolo was superb. Best forward on the pitch, despite the hype surrounding the Burgess brothers, James Graham etc.

I thought Widdop was one of our better players. The only thing he really got wrong was the intercept pass. I appreciate he's not the most off the cuff creative, but he was pretty much managing the game himself for England as Gale was anonymous (I don't think Gale is really good enough for this level where defences are going to be much tougher). If we need creativity bring in Williams for Gale, but dropping Widdop would be a mistake, he's the half with the most experience at the highest level. I trust Widdop to put in a solid performance against the likes of the Aussies and Kiwis, I don't get the same feeling from any of our other options, I think his critics don't properly factor in that this isn't like SL where halves can look classy against softer defences.

Not convinced Ratchford offers more than Lomax, who wasn't disgraced, but like Gale suffers from tighter defences snuffing out the attacking space that SL offers. Sarginson had a poor game, but If he looked poor it was because he was visible, which is more than can be said of Watkins. Thought the wings did what was required of them, with McGilvary looking the more industrious.

It's disappointing, but we shouldn't overreact, we were always competitive in a close game against a good side. If we could find from somewhere one world class half and one world class centre we'd be ahead of them.

Thinking back to the G.B v NZ in 1985. We had gamebreakers all over the backline.....Drummond,Hanley,Lydon,Schofield,Myler. Compare to todays backline or who could/should replace them in 2016.

Its a sad reflection on Super League.

Graham was our best player by miles . Pointless Gale playing if they are not going to give him any responsibility . Sarginson was dire and no excuse for not passing to Hall for an almost certain try . Switch Watkins to left centre its not his fault he never gets any quality ball . Get a proper ref not one who thinks if he lets the Kiwis mess about at the play the ball they will want him again for an international .

I can see smith being called up again if its allowed.
Madness leaving him out in the first place

Given James Graham's stats why did you rate him a 7 like, for example, you did Widdop?

The stats show what was clear at the time - NZ made easy yards. Was that Bennet's defensive structure?

Because he conceded two penalties.

I think we lost that game because we didn't capitalise early on when we dominated possession. Watkins dropping Mcgillvary's pass.. Sarginson keeping hold of the ball when all he had to do is pass it onto Hall who would have had a walk in.

I thought we defended pretty well. Our support play was shocking though.

Poor game management at the end with us not being able to score one drop goal with 15 mins left. So frustrating.

Sarginson had a shocker. Watkins, well I don't think he's ever going to fulfill his potential sadly.

Everyone else seems to have watched a game where Watkins was ever given the ball. He wasn't given the ball more than half a dozen times and only once with any space - give him the opportunities Sarginson had and I'm confident he would have delivered, as it is he got nothing like that so it's only really fair to judge him on his defensive performance which was actually very good.

Or am I just supposed to agree he was rubbish because that's the thing at the minute?