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| Quote ="Biff Tannen"I shouldn't have to go into again but i will, his father is England so that entitles him to play for England or Australia.End of.Mcnamara has made no qualms about selecting non english players in the past,some far more non english than Cuthbertson so we can only assume he has deemed him not good enough,hence my surprise.'"
I'm not bothered about his eligibility under the current rules, I'm more interested in maintaining the integrity of the honour which should come from representing your Nation!
Someone who clearly sees England as his second choice shouldn't be considered. My opinion is that he's Australian and therefore I don't want him in the England team, same as Chase, Heighington etc.
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| Quote ="Nothus"If McNamara plays Matty Smith at 7 ahead of Luke Gale then it really is all about club colours.'"
He won't, he will play Widdop at 7 and Tomkins at 6, you know, because Tomkins has had a truly superb season and fully deserves to be in the squad..........
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| Quote ="The Avenger"He's Australian !
He's been around for 10 years or more and wanted to play Origin and rep for Australia. In those 10 years he never felt patriotic enough to say he was available for England because he's not English.
Now, in the twighlight of his career when Origin and Australia are never going to happen he suddenly feels English.
Nope, not for me!
Apart from that, in the second half of the season his form hasn't been good enough!'"
Well said.
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| Looking at that squad I'm in full agreement that it looks unbalanced.
Only 2 centres suggests either Hardaker or Bateman have been picked as a centres. The big worry is not enough props. IMO there should be a minimum 5 in the squad.
I think we should be building towards the four nations next year and the next World Cup. For that reason I wouldn't have Westwood or O'loughlin in. I don't think Smith's form has warranted selection, neither do the Wigan fans after a quick read of their forum. I think he's been selected because McNamara was happy with him in internationals last year rather than just because he plays for Wigan as some suggest.
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| Genuinely surprised that there is no Liam Watts. He would be better to have in the squad that Westwood, considering the lack of props.
Can't believe Smith is still getting selected. He didn't seem to do anything last night, besides a few errors.
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| Hardaker
Burgess / Hall
Watkins /Bateman
Williams / Widdop
Graham / Roby / Hill
Whitehead and Farrell
O'Loughlin
Burgess / Cooper / Hodgson / Currie
- Shame that Burgess and Walmsley miss out through injury. He hasn't selected much depth up front.
- I can't see how Tomkins can play over Hardaker and I can't see how he can play over Williams, at #6, who has been outstanding. So I wouldn't pick Tomkins at all.
- How players like Smith, Cudjoe, Westwood and Ferres can get selected I don't know. Why continue with these players? This is the perfect opportunity to give younger players the chance to experience an England camp. From Saints the likes of Greenwood and Percival would benefit greatly.
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| Tomkins form hasn't warranted him to including in the squad, but no doubt he'll be squeezed in somewhere. He shouldn't be at 6 due to how long it's been since he last played there, and he shouldn't be at full back due to Zak's form. It just hope his inclusion to mean Zak gets put out to centre because that would just be a waste of his talents! Like others have said I don't think smith really warrants the shirt. Half backs would be Gale and Widdop for me
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| Has Danny McGuire retired from international footy? Because going off big finals he's been in recently he's ahead of Williams at the moment (Williams is a good runner of the ball and will improve, is actually really good but no McGuire in the biggest games yet), never mind Matty Smith whose inclusion is a ing joke.
Harry Sunderland winner last night, Lance Todd winner last year, good kicker, good try scorer, good support player, good passer, quite good defender...never picked for England anymore. And a player who has well out of his depth in the last two Grand Finals and every time I've seen him play for England gets in? Smith must have something on MacNamara.haha
Really unsure about Westwood and Farrell's inclusions too. Westwood is getting on and Farrell is a penalty machine but are both good players in their day.
I've not seen Ferres play well for two years though. I do not rate the guy at all for England v Kiwi level.
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| Quote ="Nothus"If McNamara plays Matty Smith at 7 ahead of Luke Gale then it really is all about club colours.'"
I'd play:
Widdop-McGuire
Widdop-Gale
Widdop-Williams
Widdop-Tomkins
McGuire-Gale
McGuire-Williams
McGuire-Tomkins
Gale-Williams
Gale-Tomkins
Williams-Tomkins
Westwood-Ferres
...in the halves before I'd let Matty Smith anywhere near the #7 jersey for England.
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| Quote ="Hasbag"Genuinely surprised that there is no Liam Watts. He would be better to have in the squad that Westwood, considering the lack of props.
Can't believe Smith is still getting selected. He didn't seem to do anything last night, besides a few errors.'"
Watts plays for the wrong team. He's been one of the best back rowers in the league this season and if he played for a team higher up the table he'd probably be an automatic starter but Farrell Westwood (who I love as a Wire) and Ferres get it. Bizarre that one!
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| Strange selections aside, and with the big player injuries we have, it looks a good strong team.
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| Quote ="BuckleyStreetWire"Watts plays for the wrong team. He's been one of the best back rowers in the league this season and if he played for a team higher up the table he'd probably be an automatic starter but Farrell Westwood (who I love as a Wire) and Ferres get it. Bizarre that one!'"
Watts is a prop not a back rower and is very unlucky not to be picked.
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| It's beyond belief that some of you are saying Farrell shouldn't be in the team. I'm not sure what more he could do to prove how good he is, his defence is second to none, he makes more breaks than any other second rower I can think of, his footwork is brilliant, he can kick if needed and his passing is very good. The amount of tries he scores and sets up is pretty outstanding for a second rower. He was the best forward on the field last night.
With regards to Smith, I really wish McNamara didn't pick him. He's not had a good enough season and I think this is the worst thing for him, it's not like we're devoid of halfbacks this season. Last night will have done his confidence some damage and if he gets picked for England he'll only get more abuse. I'd like to see Williams/Gale then Widdop/Gale and as much as I want the team to move forward I think Danny McGuire is unlucky not to be included.
Disappointed Walmsley won't be playing, think he'd have made a serious impression against the kiwi props.
One last point about Tomkins, how many of you actually watch New Zealand Warriors games? Because if you did you'd see that he's been far from poor. He's been injured for a lot of the season so hasn't really stood out. The team he's playing in are not very good at all, Johnson never wants to pass for one. The games he has played in he has played well, his first two games this season he was their best player and the NZW fans all thought they were a much better team with him on the pitch.
No he's not has a good a season as Hardaker but he's playing in a team in a harder competition having been injured. Tomkins is a once in a generation kind of player. Hardaker is a better defender but if the side is good enough then your fullback shouldn't be getting tested all that often in defence. Tomkins attack is better in every aspect of the game.
Hardaker may deserve to play this season but to suggest he's a better player than Tomkins is ridiculous. The international team needs to have a core of senior players and Tomkins is one of those.
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| Three props in that squad, but eight back-rowers. Only two specialist centres.
Couple of injuries or withdrawals in the wrong positions and England are well and truly screwed. Unless people have withdrawn through injury but not made it public, I could name three or four props ahead of Burgess, who has been picked on his surname alone. Westwood and Currie had a mediocre finish to the season, as did Ferres who was anonymous in the big games at the end of the year.
Smith ahead of anyone is a nonsense. Very one-dimensional player who benefits from playing in a big team.
It's a shame in some ways that the Kiwis have had so many key withdrawals. A defeat in this series might have seen the back of McNamara, unfortunately a win might keep him in a job.
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| Cuthbertson should be in. As should another centre.
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| Quote ="The Avenger"I'm not bothered about his eligibility under the current rules, I'm more interested in maintaining the integrity of the honour which should come from representing your Nation!
Someone who clearly sees England as his second choice shouldn't be considered. My opinion is that he's Australian and therefore I don't want him in the England team, same as Chase, Heighington etc.'"
nobody is bothered about your opinion on someone elses nationality.
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| i agree about Cuthbertson, he may be a good player, his father might be English, but as others have said, he showed no desire to represent his father's country until it became obvious that the chance to represent his state and his country had gone.
although i wouldn't be too upset if he did get called up, but i believe that there are young, English guys that deserve a chance over and Aussie who hasn't previously been bothered.
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| Did Cuthbertson say he wanted to play for England though?.Watts is very unlucky and Matty Smith WTF.....id have picked McGuire. Over him.
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| Quote ="SmokeyTA"nobody is bothered about your opinion on someone elses nationality.'"
He has a valid point though but in this day and age where heritage and residency now count,it's a lot easier to play for any nation.
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| Watts would have been a good call with some props missing. Even as a Wigan fan I can't believe Smith has made the squad.
From the 24 selected I'd go-
Hardaker
Burgess Watkins Bateman Hall
Tomkins Widdop
Graham Roby Hill
Farrell Whitehead O'Loughlin
Subs-T Burgess Cooper Westwood Williams
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| Quote ="Gronk!"Few stand outs that shouldn't be anywhere near the England squad in Cudjoe, Farrell, Smith & Westwood.
Outside of that it's a strong looking squad.
Is Shenton unavailable for selection? Because Cudjoe over him is pretty laughable if not.
McGuire for Smith
Cuthbertson for Westwood
Shenton for Cudjoe
Watts for Farrell
Would make the squad much better.'"
I really can't understand the bagging that Farrell gets. The guy is a machine and had finished the season like a house on fire. He was quite easily the best forward on the field last night with 165 meters from 16 carries and he does this on a regular basis. He is a brilliant defender, makes breaks, scores trys, sets trys up yet the plaudits never quite seem to come his way.
One of the first names on the team sheet for me both at Wigan and for England (certainly after a slow start to the season).
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| Quote ="SmokeyTA"nobody is bothered about your opinion on someone elses nationality.'"
Oh give us all a break and have a day off you sanctimonious príćk
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| 5 pages and no one has mentioned Clark being completely dropped from the squad? Thought he was supposed to be better than Roby?? One season wonder or just an off season?
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| Quote ="ToffeeLady"It's beyond belief that some of you are saying Farrell shouldn't be in the team. I'm not sure what more he could do to prove how good he is, his defence is second to none, he makes more breaks than any other second rower I can think of, '"
Bateman, Wardle, Ablett, Whitehead, Tomkins, from eligible players all make more, not that I am suggesting they should all be in the squad. Farrell is a cracking SL player but not big enough for international.
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| Quote ="BuckleyStreetWire"...in the halves before I'd let Matty Smith anywhere near the #7 jersey for England.'"
I'd play Alex Murphy & Andy Gregory before Smith.
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