Typical blinkered response from a Wigan fan.

McIlorum is not even among the best 8 hookers England has. Slow hands, slow feet, slow brain. Runners/playmakers have to stop to take his passes. He has no guile. It's no coincidence that Chase and Sinfield look slow and lumbering with McIlorum on the pitch - we start most of the plays pretty much static. And the lad isn't even a good defender.

One thing McIlorum does do, is make the interchange dummy half look brilliant. 45 mins of McIlorum against Fiji, 0 points; 35 mins of Burrow, 34 points. Burrow and Roby both come out of dummy half and ask the defence to make a decision, whether that be off a scoot, a short run and flat pass or quick ball to Chase, Sinfield. Burrow is also an unconventional opponent for NRL players and earns penalties. He misses tackles, of course, but he can be taken out of the heavy traffic at right centre and you only want to play him for 30 mins anyway.

Whilst I think that not being in the top 8 hookers is a bit of a stretch, I agree he is a completely average player.

Mcillorum actually misses a lot of tackles. Burrow in D against NZ is a worry though. I'd probably take a risk and go with the latter - Burrow is at least capable of a big play

Its all very well saying you can let burrow defend out wide, but that means your halfback, who is already hiding out there, has to move one in and mark a 2nd row. Its also taking away the massive workrate in defence you tend to get from a hooker, which will save the energy of your big men.
I appreciate his qualities, but I do think in a test match, he'd be shown up.
*saying that, his best performances for Leeds seem to come in big games*

France probably wasn't the best way to showcase McIlorum's strengths. We didn't want to get sucked into any sort of fight. He may come into his own in a tough test against the Kiwis.
I don't particularly buy into the whole "he does all the little things well", theory. I think he's a pretty good hooker, but his service is no better than Roby's and his play selection doesn't seem as good. Added to that, he doesn't carry Roby's
threat.

Whilst people said that Lunt and Houghton were too similar to Roby, I think we'd have been better with two similar hookers sharing the load and staying fresh.

And can we please avoid any posts saying Roby is [ijust a scooter[/i. If you're under that impression, I suggest you have another look at him.

I have sympathy wth this but Watkins regularly defends at 4th man in for Leeds and Sinfield at 3rd man in is bigger than most other half backs. And this ought only be for 30 mins tops.

We have a forward playing at 7, he covers Burrow, it's no big deal plus if you go with Ablett to sure up the channel insteas of Watkins you have another tough uncompromising forward in the backs that can step up the defence

This has been a massive failing for Leeds this last season. It doesn't work.

You want your hooker defending down the middle, and your two half backs defending out wide, not three half backs. If you are having Burrow in, it should be as a half back, for which just like hooker he is not as good as the other alternatives, and should not be in the side.

Leeds have used Burrow at centre for about 3 or 4 seasons now.

The one big plus in having Burrow on the bench, is that when he comes on, he usually creates a couple of chances, which against the big boys, will be scarce.
Definitely worth a spot on the bench.
Roby to start.

When he has been one of the halfs, like I put, and on that basis it is over 10 seasons.. He's only been playing hooker for two seasons, and in the first he had Lunt come on for him and Burrow was only one of two defending out wide. Last season as a regular hooker, there was him and the two halfbacks out wide, which was a failing for Leeds.

I havnt watched Mcillorum rthat much for Wigan but based of his England performances he shouldnt be anywhere near the squad.

Anyone who can say he is worthy of a place after his stints in the last couple of weeks is on another planet.

Him, T Burgess and Mossop where bad inclusions into the squad and a bed error from banana man.

Sinfield is not a forward.

Don’t see the point in Mcilorum on the bench. Roby can do 80mins, why bring on an inferior version of him to spell with? If we go with a hooker on the bench it should be Burrow or we go with another forward.

Id be tempted to go with Burrow because as big and strong as those Kiwi forwards are they aren’t the most agile or fleet-footed bunch.

My biggest fear for Burrow is the high amount of head shots he goes through (very difficult for tacklers not to hit him there due to his speed, size and low centre of gravity/running style).

I like him at 7, he can destroy teams from that position

Because it's a discussion board. Otherwise, why bring anything up. Marketing? Then all we get are wannabe marketeers. Rules? Then all we get is wannabe refs. Transfers? Who do you think you are, a wannabee agent? Catering? Wannabe chefs.

Could you hep us out here and list all those things it's OK to bring up without being a wannabe-something?

Sinfield moved Stand Off from loose to reduce his defensive workload, his attacking game hasnt really changed all that much, But he was moved out of loose so that he wasn’t defending up the middle all the time. He is still perfectly capable of defending there for 20/30mins and his defence is outstanding for a halfback.

Didn't Burrow come off the bench to win Harry Sunderland back in 2011? My recollection is that Burrow, Sinfield and McGuire have spent a lot of time on the field together for quite a number of seasons and certainly longer than just 2013. Looking at Grand Final line-ups from 2011 and 2012 suggests as much. Also, even if Lunt and Burrow interchanged in 2011, that still means Burrow, Sinfield and McGuire were on the pitch together whilst Lunt wasn't - doesn't it?

In any case, looking at Burrow's tackles/misses ratio on the Super League site, he's defended at 266-22, 217-15, 235-21. That's fine for me. Moon's defence one in doesn't seem to have been impacted either.

From what I remember, when you used to pick McGuire and Burrow in the halves, you played them left and right and Sinfield took up responsibility in the centre. This, imo, meant he was playing a half back's game all along and was no more a loose forward than say, Ryan Bailey is when he's named at 13. You'll remember better than me, though.

It doesn't change my stance, his defence may be very good for a half, but I don't want the teams chief organiser being out on his feet because he's doing a load of defending against big guys.

He is in no way comparable to Roby. There are no comparisons. He is a very, very, destitute, poor man's Isaac Luke.

Yeah, from an attacking point of view Sinfields game is pretty much the same as it has always been, whether you put 6,7, 13 or 9 even 8 on his back he is pretty much playing that game. The whole move to stand off has pretty much been a defensive change to take some of his defensive work away from him. He can still pick it up for 20/30mins a game but he just isn’t up to doing that job defensively 80mins a game 40 times a season like he used to. But he can defensively cover for burrow for a portion of a game.

Burrow starting on the bench as he can also give cover to the halves. Therefore for me it's a choice between Mcillorum or Roby starting with the one missing out relegated to water carrier.

If McIlorum isn't playing the full 80 I see no point in playing him. His strengths lie in his aggression and durability over a full game. I'd also say using Liam Farrell for just 20 mins a game is a little pointless as well tbh.

Roby to start with Burrow on the bench for me and I'd also bring in Lee Mossop for Farrell so that we can leave Sam Burgess in the backrow for a full game.

Neither.

Roby for 80 and Turgess on the bench.

We need size off the bench to match what the Kiwi's have. McIllorum seems to slow our play down and Burrow will get slaughtered in defence. Roby is by far the best hooker we have and should be on all the time.

I'd go with Widdop and Sinfield half backs.
Roby at 9 with Burrow on the bench.
Mossop back at prop so S Burgess can go to 2nd row.
McIlorum is best doing 80 mins where he can and does play any other SL 9 off the park and has done for the past 4 years.
If he's not going to play 80 then leave him out.
To me the main decision is Widdop or Chase. Widdop and we can get to the final.
Play Chase and it's all over!