Grounds are just one part of it, but the league is all about expansion now and wakey/ cas are too close to leeds and bradford. Out of Cas/Wakey my personal opinion is Cas have a better squad with some good homegrown talent coming through and seem, again in my opinion to have a better chance of getting a new stadium.
I'm not have a go at wakey, i have never had a away game there i didn't enjoy and think the atmosphere is great, but i think they have a lot of work to do.

I'm not even going to go there cos that can be debated till the cows come home. I'll just say my opinion is Wakey have a better squad and each teams have an equally good youth system which is showing in both first teams at the moment.

As for SL all been about expansion, I have to disagree, it's about having a sound and stable competition. If it was all about expansion we would could just skip all the formalities and kick the bulk of northern SL teams out (not your own team of course). Bring in teams from all over Northern Europe packed out with 2nd grade aussies. What a competition we would have.

I'm sorry but I think your comments are badly thought out. Your obviously from the [i"I'm all for expansion as long my own team doesn't have to make sacrifices" [/icamp.

I'm not reallt for expansion, but i can see the argument. I actually think rugby league should concentrate on its historical clubs and any new side should get there on merit, not be given an unfair advantage.

From Wigans point of view i'd be suprised if come 2012 Ian Lenagan hasn't got us right back on track as a major force. I'm not saying we'll be dominating again but i think we'll be back challenging on a regular basis for trophies.

He is placing the emphesis on homegrown players and unlike Lindsay won't release them all at the first sight of a big money import becoming available.

It also helps that he has his head screwed on enough not to be offering overseas players silly money as in the long run Wigan won't be seen as an easy touch for Aussie agents anymore.

I'm all for expansion and always have been, but kicking one team out to make way for another isn't expansion, it's replacement. The geography might shift, but the game wouldn't 'expand' by any measure.

Agree but if you dont where does that leave the clubs outside SL now ?

Im not Sure what the expansionist dream in 2009 has added..................probably nothing, and yet , they(whoever they are) would have you believe it is a success.................Lets not believe the total fallacy that is Welsh Rugby League

Or the one that somehow Widnes (or Leigh for that matter) are ever going to be contenders again.
A prediction for you..... Crusaders will win a major trophy long before either of our teams will.

Bookies offering 6/4 on them finishing bottom this year. Looks a good bet as even if it just comes down to their visit to Wales points difference will play into the Crusaders hands but I think Celtic will pick up 2 or 3 other wins....not convinced Salford will.

Making a case for a 16 (or more) team Super League...?

30 games plus play offs (and perhaps a Edinburgh/Cardiff type weekend) ???

Can see some greedy club treasurers going for it but coaches and players perhaps not

Possibly , but in my opinion we dont have 12 let alone 14 SL clubs at the moment and are unlikely to have them in 3 years time

Plus once you go past the 14 mark the fixtures become a bit of a problem

No doubt the RFL will have a ' plan ' for every eventuality

Kyle Eastmond is injured. He played over 10 games last and impressed for the league winners and Challenge cup winners.

saints will be in the top 4 under the benefit of wayne bennetts coaching.

souths stand a good chance at the top 8

but we did franchising 10 years ago, why is it being mentioned now

You're assuming everyone at home and everyone away once (+ magic) but the precedent for not doing that has already been set. Sure, it'd be nice and there's probably and optimum number for an RL league, but IMHO expansion with preservation is a far more important priority.

Is this based on fact or feeling?
As it is, we field as many (if not more) english talent than other SL teams. Our reserve grade were 1 bad ref away from the semi's last year and we now have kids in the England age group squads.
Whilst we don't have the "big name" stars in our side, we do have 3 England Internationals and were the only team outside of the top tier who had someone on the plane to Australia. I'll add, that pudro was one of a handfull of players who came out of the WC with his rep in tact.
What we have lacked for 3 years is consistency, but as for just "occasionally beating leeds", we will give any team a game and I doubt any coach looks forward to playing us.
As for 3 years time, the only worries we have are off the pitch.
If you are going to post drivel, can I suggest that in future, you research the topic before posting.

You are then back to the very obvious 2 divisions of 10, with 1 up 1 down and 27 fixtures plus a weekender.

The stupid thing is there is an odd number in the Championship (11) and only 10 teams in Championship 1. Perhaps on ability that is the right format but really there ought to be a better way to split the 35 clubs especially so the lower teams get more games (more expansion at the bottom maybe the way to go but then again do any of the RL Conference clubs want to take that extra step which will require more finance with perhaps not the reward of perticularly bigger gates).

Feeling.

Can I just add that I don’t watch all the other SL teams obsessively and therefore for some I’ve given a dire prediction. This thread was created for your opinions and other peoples opinions rather than myself causing mild controversy.



I’m a big fan of Purdham no doubt and he is as good as their get in super league. You’ve got a good youth system coming on at Harlequins but it is debatable that it’s (waits for echo’s about Leeds Academy lost to Celtic Crusaders Academy) a good few years behind the likes of Leeds and Wigan. However I don’t think it’s the academy that is your problem!



That’s probably the reason why I think your going to do poor and I’m sure you’ll accept my opinion on that.



A few people have criticised my original post that has created debate. In future I’ll make sure I spend hours and hours putting this together so that we can have a marathon of thumbs up..

But yeah for real I’ll put more effort and research in next time..

the game would expand by plenty of measures, in fact, the only way it wouldnt expand is the number of clubs in SL

what a strange thing to say

Go on then... What are these 'plenty of measures'?

What have you based this on precisely?

It seems you have watched a couple of games on SKY to come to the conclusion for Wigan.

I like Tomkins, I think he will be a real talent, but then it is hard to understand the contradicition in your remarks between Saints and Wigan depth.

I seem to recall Saints winning last years reserve final, and being finalists in the academy final. I think it was pretty much the same the year before.

With the likes of Eastmond, Frodsham, Foster, Wheeler, Dixon and Macgennis already breaking through with bolters such as Armstrong then I think we will be ok thanks very much. This to be complemented by Scott Moore who seems to be progressing well at Huddersfield.

I would stake money that at least 3 of these will go on to gain international honours.

geographical, representative numbers, potential player pool, elite player pathways, these things would be done automatically simply by admitting a club from a new area, regardless of its success,

and you would choose certain areas in hope of expanding audience, sponsorship portfolio, audience within targetted demographics, participation, revenue,

in fact, pretty much everything you would measure it by bar the size of the league

Other way round

We (Wigan) won the reserve final and St Helens beat us the U18's.

Cosmetic change only - already dismissed.


Really? Explain how a club in an area with limited roots in RL is so much better equipped to produce players than one which has been doing it for years.


Hope? You're not getting desperate after just four are you?


Apparently you are. 'Audience within targetted demographic' is frankly just bullsh*t speak for 'expanding audience', while 'participation' (presumably playing the game?) is in effect a more active form of audience engagement than just 'being a fan'. So let's save time and address these together....

It makes no commercial sense to disillusion the audience (passive or active) you already have in the vague and unproven hope that you'll attract a new, presumably bigger, one somewhere else. It's far, far better to keep the one within the family while at the same time pushing the boundaries outwards. Expansion, not replacement - any fool can see that.


I don't buy this argument. Things like 'history', 'continuity', 'tradition', are just as effective selling points as 'new', 'fresh', etc. It's all down to the marketing. Even if it weren't the case, you still haven't explained why getting rid of one club to make way for another is apparently better than keeping the one club AND including another.

So come on, you haven't got all day. You've got a marathon to train for.