And we all know it.
Even though we get Freaky and crew going oonn and ooonnn.
THE best athletes play League, everyone says you could field 4 teams to beat us, you couldn't..nowhere near, but in your First/Second choice positions you have ATHLETES that we just dont have. If you took your first choice player from each position you'd still have a VERY strong team but I think we'd stand a much much better chance. You certainly dont have 4 that would beat us e.g. Look how Ellis has gone over there.
The nearest thing we have to your freaks is Burgess, who at 18 was a big game player

You miss one major reason we are good.


We have the most dynamic mix of players and coaches from so many different backgrounds, giving so many different perspectives.

That means things get tried, tested, people learn from their own mistakes and the mistakes of others. The game and the players evolve as changes are made.

In England, none of that happens. You're still in 1982 wondering how the f*ck Australia got so good all of a sudden, then you look at your own belly buttons and think the answer will come from there!

Loads of ways you can make you cap go further around how you pay appearance and win bonuses, and the granularity of payments versus the assumptions you are told to base payments on in the Salary cap rules. E.g. appearances are to be based on a figure of 18 per season.

pay your player 2k per appearance it's 36k on the cap even if he plays 21 games at gets 42k from it

pay him 14k every 7th appearance, and it's only 28k on the cap even if he plays the same 21 games and gets 42k from it

Just a tiny example, i'm sure somebody with a bit of savy at possibly more than one of the clubs has spreadsheeted and analysed this and all the other rules to determine the 'optimal' way to pay a player to create as big a difference as possible between his earned income and his 'salary cap value'

The way most clubs get players on good salaries at low cap figures is a brown paper bag full of money.

Whilst slightly harsh on the last paragraph (I think some are acutely aware how Australia got so good, just maybe it's only just sinking in with some of the people who can make the decisions), you're dead right. Whilst we remain a pretty insular sport over here in coaching respects - the RL old boys club if you like, we're never going to take a large step forward, we need to be inclusive of ideas from all sports and all nations. Bring in as many different views and ideas as possible, and work a damn site harder and have the patience to see it through rather than expecting quick results.

Possibly, I just can't comment on that type of thing due to the AUP.

It just show's over here though there is a lot of scope to work within the rules and pay more for less cap figure - I suspects some clubs have better accountants than others

I want Warrington and Russel Crowe's accountants.


They have worked miracles in the last few months.

I must admit, i wish they were doing my tax liability as well.

What's getting around the cap got to do with accountants?
The whole idea of getting around the cap is to pay players by methods that won't involve accountants, SL clubs, The RFL or in fact the UK.
It's as easy as that to get around the cap, I just don't understand why clubs don't do it!
Sorry, what did you say...............

Maybe there would (fairly likely), maybe there would not; but that was not the point I was making.

Its easy to say that you'd support a free-for-all, when you know or believe its highly unlikely your own club would suffer.

The brown paper bag, or its more sophisticated equivalent - the transfer from an owner/mates overseas bank account to the player's offshore personal service company's overseas bank account - is one of the methods of getting round or stretching the cap.

Most of the others (and I listed a few on here a few days ago) need accountants or at least some element of financial planning and organising.

ahh it was you!
Definately will be financial based, there's no way a SL club would risk the brown paper bag

A club might well not...

There is always the ' promise ' payment method , you know , the one where you get a recently retired GB international to come out of retirement and agree to play for free , he then gets a paid coaching position at your club the following year

I (and a number of others) were at a meeting very recently where someone with impeccable credentials to know about such things made a particularly good point: the salary cap auditor can only audit what is recorded in the club's books.

Surely a cross reference with the audited accounts will throw up any anomalies.

That's an incredibly optimistic view of the world, ade's already pointed out just a few ways that players might be indirectly be earning more than their salary cap.

Some of which would never appear on the clubs accounts audited or otherwise.

Er...no. If its not in the books, it won't be in the audited accounts.

Edit: sorry, see the guy above just made the point already

that may be the case (and it certainly is in some areas, though not all) but Australia is a much much smaller country than GB, about 5 times smaller, the fact 55% of the kids play is immaterial in real numbers where the difference in player numbers (at youth and amateur level) is surprisingly small,

the main difference is that from youngsters to pros, RL in australia has quality coaching and quality competition, youth grade and reserve grade players in Australia are playing at a massively higher level than their british counterparts, our reserve comp isnt even worth comparing to the Aussie reserve grade comps, which are a higher level than the championship never mind our reserve comps which are barely above amateur level,

this gives them massive strength in depth, but also a clear path from youth, to reserve to first grade which allows players to develop,

here players like Kallum Watkins are stuck in limbo, they are far too good for youth and reserve grade, not yet good enough or developed enough to be playing week in week out super league, something like the Queensland cup or Bundeberg cup would be ideal for him, a mixture of seasoned players and youngsters perparing him for Superleague.

Australia have strong competitions providing huge numbers of talented players, we dont, we challenge and often better the rest at youth level, but we, as a country, arent bringing enough to the next level for us to ever have a competitive comp, we simply dont have the numbers right now

i would agree, the salary cap has nothing to do with it, its the quality of coaching, facilities, and pathways

Can you stop refer to me as an Aussie, I just happen to live here

I do agree with what you are saying, I just think the reason they have these pathways, and vast mount of talented players is a lot to do with the profile of the sport, something unfortunately the game doesn't have in the UK.

In Sydney and Brisbane the majority of young kids playing sport want to be RL players when they grow up (nothing to do with money) in England they want to play Soccer, it's something that RL in England will always battle with.

If it was a pure numbers game then why do the pacific Islands produce players so much better than England?

Largely due to genetics and economics (in that order)

according to Tommy Raudonikis aussie coaches do nothing different from british ones with young players.it's just if one player doesn't make it or drops out then there is another 10 just as good in each position. we don't have that.
his words not mine and he was a damn good judge of players