And we will also watch some top players stay in the game. I hope we do not see a mass exodus to Union because as much as it hurt against Warrington watching Myler breeze past our defenders with such ease was quite a sight, just like watching Tomkins becoming the player we all love to hate but would love our own little Sam!!

I think with the NRL and Union trying to poach all of our better youngsters we have to feel proud of how well our youth structures are even though they are heavily criticised by many in our sport. We do not have a strong youth league for our players to develop in and a lot of the time they are thrust into first team action too young but how good could our players be if we were able to iron out those issues? Now that is worth dreaming about!

Also look at the positives, players like Burrow, McGuire, Sinfield must have had offers or at least scouts looking at them from the Tykes. Those players stayed loyal to the sport and there is no reason why a large percentage of others will not. Eastmond is making the right choice for himself, the money is hard to turn down but at the end of the day has he gone too early? Hardly made a dent on the England set-up when he promised so much and now his below par performances are making him more of an enemy of the sport.

id take a strong club game over a strong int. game anyday

i wouldnt swap what RL has got for what RU has got on a world wide basis

It would be great if our international game could become more popular but I have no idea how to be honest. When England play Australia in the heartlands we still struggle to sell out the stadium.

I just think we have to accept that our game is more about the clubs. We have a strong club based game in Europe and Australia/NZ and this is a good thing.

You are wrong and obviously have no understanding of the games history then. You are using ignorance to justify the status quo and small mindedness.

When did the RL start the World cup and when did RU.

there are two problems for RL in regard to the international game

complete mismanagement of the international game by the RFL and the ARL. eg constanly changing riules competitions, no longer term workable strategy, ignoring overseas markets for too long.

The ARL has enough money to have a team in PNG ( even now most RL fans in this country would be happy to say goodbye to catalans and oppose Toulouse getting a franchise). a second NZ team would almost wipe out RU in NZ from a competitive point of view


they could quite easily set up semi pro teams in plces like samoa, fiji etc and then filter the best players into a pacific islanders joint team to give a professional career path.

When attempts to set things up they have been half d and planned ie PSG.

In this country trying to run before they can walk has destroyed the international game. having home nations instead of home nations and GB for big competitions undercut any possibility of having meaningful international matches.

People like you are those who will lead this game into terminal decline although i do accept that you are in the majority as the club vs country thread showed.

Most RL supporters are thick, parochial, one eyed numpties unfortunately. So i doubt that anything will change and we will be having these same debates in 20 years time at which point RL will cease to exist except as an amateur game or as feeders to RU teams. The only thing that saves RL at the minutes is RU is too focused on international stuff. But if they were to put their huge financial muscle into expanding RL ( in this country at least) they would wipe RL out. All this guff about the RL being the greatest game is , because at the end of the day Money talks. We cannot comptete without a radical sea change in RL attitudes.

By being competitive. You probably wont watch England vs France because it is too one sided. If England or better GB looked like they could give australia a game they might turn up.

You make some strong points. Good post!

Have you ever been to NZ? RU may ebb and flow there but it'll always, ALWAYS be the number 1 sport.

excellent post

give the nrl time when it gets more money it will be taking over in places like fiji, samoa and tonga

i agree on a PNG NRL team and a 2nd NZ NRL side would puts RU in a lot of pressure

"Most RL Supporters are thick" also translated to "Most RL supporters have a different opinion to mine and they are all wrong".

With a strong club game the RFL and ARL probably thought by then taking the best players and putting them in international jerseys the fans of ALL clubs would come out and support them.

You might travel to watch England (or GB) on a regular basis I don't know but at a guess the general RL supporter is from the North, they have an average salary of somewhere in the region of 20k per year. They probably have families to keep, mortgage or rent to pay, bills...etc you know the things that allow you to survive. Out of whatever they have spare and sometimes what they have to beg for they spend on a season pass for their club. Is this because they are "Thick"? No it is because RL is a hobby for most people, a pastime, something they can release from their daily worries and think about something else for 80 or so minutes. They do not however feel a connection with our national team, the most clubs out of the top 3 get are usually 1 player at the most so they don't even have much to go and watch from the club they love so dearly. Would I pay to go and watch EVERY Hull KR game? Yes I would. Would I go and watch England if they played at the KC stadium? Yes I would. Would I go to Wigan to watch them? No I wouldn't. I can hardly afford to go and watch all the Rovers games but then having to shell out about £20 for a ticket and £40 fuel for an international game that I can watch on TV would be taking it too far.

I am not trying to be small minded or one of the status quo I am trying to be realistic. The ship has sailed from when international RL was a big thing, watching Hanley running through a gap and Offiah going the length used to be something to go and watch because it was rare to see it, now you will see a 95kg stand off go 90mtrs with a two wingers and a centre chasing him down. Int RL used to be about seeing the best of the best, I can do that by watching the SL or NRL on the TV every week.

As for Union's international game doing so well, that is because they have diluted their leagues with so many teams that the average fan in the south wants to see all those best players come together and watch what is usually not a bad specatacle of a game compared to the rubbish they are served up on a weekly basis, just like RL used to be pre-1995.

:15z81anh

That is why i used the word =#FF0000:15z81anh=#FF0000COMPETIVELY if you creamed off the top 20 or 30 NZRU players you would tun them from being in the top 3 in the world to maybe the top 10.

There would be a market because you just need to look at all the top NZRU players who are plying their trade in Europe because money talks

People have been predicting a mass exodus of players to Union ever since Union went pro. I remember Steve Ryder, ahead of a challenge cup final, sneeringly remarking could the game withstand the Union scouts being present in the crowd with the cheque book in hand.

The reality is that so far we have seen nothing of the sorts, with some players making a success of their move and some coming back. No player is bigger than the sport itself and while the players certainly deserve to be on higher wages, the game and/or clubs should not be bankrupting themselves in an effort to keep them. Also, if you give in to players demands for more money or they go to Union, at what point do you say no? and who do you say it to? I've said it all over the place over the past few days, the issue of the salary cap is merely the symptom of the problem, the real problem is that RL does not bring in enough £ - if you fix that problem, then the salary cap level can be fixed as a result of an increased revenue.

Ultimately, if a RL player can earn more money from a RU club, then I say good luck to them and I hope they make a success of it, no job is worth more than your next pay cheque.

And he got Penrith to take him off our hands.

Should send the guy out to the middle east. He'll have peace inside a month

Well, I agree with a lot of that, two of Bradford's best players of the last 10 years was the wing/centre partnership of Vainikolo and Hape. However, both struggled with knee injuries and fitness, they both got offered England RU shirts and went to get a pension in a game that was easier on the knees.

To those of you who think the clubs are holding out on the players' salaries. Read this: www.liverpooldailypost.co.uk/liv ... -26944440/ In a season where Warrington won it's first major trophy in 35 years, took in huge amounts of money through the resulting merchandise sales and boost in interest and awareness, they only made a profit of £28k on a turnover of £5.74m. In short, and I keep saying this like a stuck record, Rugby League as a whole needs to increase it's revenue streams, preferably through sponsorship and TV contract deals, if it doesn't, the logical conclusion is that inflation will force all clubs to start putting up matchday ticket prices substantially.

To those of you who think the clubs are holding out on the players' salaries. Read this: www.liverpooldailypost.co.uk/liv ... -26944440/ In a season where Warrington won it's first major trophy in 35 years, took in huge amounts of money through the resulting merchandise sales and boost in interest and awareness, they only made a profit of £28k on a turnover of £5.74m. In short, and I keep saying this like a stuck record, Rugby League as a whole needs to increase it's revenue streams, preferably through sponsorship and TV contract deals, if it doesn't, the logical conclusion is that inflation will force all clubs to start putting up matchday ticket prices substantially.

I think Offiah makes some pretty decent points. If we really want to promote International RL and thus finally get the media attention we deserve a la union and cricket then we need to promote the players. People in my office who have no really idea about rugby can name sculthorpe and farrell as the most recent 'semi-famous' players!

I'm not saying that players should start haggling for better wages but help get them agents, get them out in the media and promote the game via other methods such as selling products etc. Good players (ones that don't look like a shoe & sound distinctly northern, sorry peacock) who will be on the International scene for a while, Tony Clubb, Sam Tomkins, Jamie Foster, Lloyd White, Elliot Kear etc...

Quote ="Paul Thexton"To those of you who think the clubs are holding out on the players' salaries. Read this: www.liverpooldailypost.co.uk/liv ... -26944440/ In a season where Warrington won it's first major trophy in 35 years, took in huge amounts of money through the resulting merchandise sales and boost in interest and awareness, they only made a profit of £28k on a turnover of £5.74m. In short, and I keep saying this like a stuck record, Rugby League as a whole needs to increase it's revenue streams, preferably through sponsorship and TV contract deals, if it doesn't, the logical conclusion is that inflation will force all clubs to start putting up matchday ticket prices substantially.'" Well said. I notice Offiah has been going on about how some players in the nineties and even late eighties were earning more than current SL players. What he fails to mention is that Wigan buying him nearly bankrupted them and similar at Widnes with Jonathan Davies (hence he was released to Warrington who took over his contract thanks to a generous sponsor). Pre-salary cap the clubs were way out of their depth with what they were paying players and as a result, at best facilities and youth development suffered and at worst they got themselves into serious trouble. Even with the cap, clubs are not finding it easy. As shown above, Warrington only just made a profit in a Cup winning year, despite being one of the most financially secure.

Quote ="Paul Thexton"To those of you who think the clubs are holding out on the players' salaries. Read this: www.liverpooldailypost.co.uk/liv ... -26944440/ In a season where Warrington won it's first major trophy in 35 years, took in huge amounts of money through the resulting merchandise sales and boost in interest and awareness, they only made a profit of £28k on a turnover of £5.74m. In short, and I keep saying this like a stuck record, Rugby League as a whole needs to increase it's revenue streams, preferably through sponsorship and TV contract deals, if it doesn't, the logical conclusion is that inflation will force all clubs to start putting up matchday ticket prices substantially.'" Well said. I notice Offiah has been going on about how some players in the nineties and even late eighties were earning more than current SL players. What he fails to mention is that Wigan buying him nearly bankrupted them and similar at Widnes with Jonathan Davies (hence he was released to Warrington who took over his contract thanks to a generous sponsor). Pre-salary cap the clubs were way out of their depth with what they were paying players and as a result, at best facilities and youth development suffered and at worst they got themselves into serious trouble. Even with the cap, clubs are not finding it easy. As shown above, Warrington only just made a profit in a Cup winning year, despite being one of the most financially secure.

If in business you 'stick to your strengths' you die. A company which is more adaptable, more innovative and more dynamic will come and take all your customers.

If we dont have a worldwide interest in the game, we build one. Its where the rewards are.

It may be hard for you to hear, but the strength and future of the game doesnt lie in small northern towns.

Apart from in Aus, RU has both a stronger club and stronger international game throughout the rest of the world.

Quote ="Paul Thexton"To those of you who think the clubs are holding out on the players' salaries. Read this: www.liverpooldailypost.co.uk/liv ... -26944440/ In a season where Warrington won it's first major trophy in 35 years, took in huge amounts of money through the resulting merchandise sales and boost in interest and awareness, they only made a profit of £28k on a turnover of £5.74m. In short, and I keep saying this like a stuck record, Rugby League as a whole needs to increase it's revenue streams, preferably through sponsorship and TV contract deals, if it doesn't, the logical conclusion is that inflation will force all clubs to start putting up matchday ticket prices substantially.'" I agree that it isnt a case of Clubs making millions in profits and keeping wages down, but the SC hasnt risen for 10 years. We seem to have been so distracted by the SC making sure that all clubs are spending the same we seem to have forgotten to make sure they are spending the right amount and in the right ways. There are more intelligent ways we can spend money in the game, and more intelligent ways we can bring money in but the current SC is too prescriptive, too rigid and in some ways counter-productive.

Quote ="Paul Thexton"To those of you who think the clubs are holding out on the players' salaries. Read this: www.liverpooldailypost.co.uk/liv ... -26944440/ In a season where Warrington won it's first major trophy in 35 years, took in huge amounts of money through the resulting merchandise sales and boost in interest and awareness, they only made a profit of £28k on a turnover of £5.74m. In short, and I keep saying this like a stuck record, Rugby League as a whole needs to increase it's revenue streams, preferably through sponsorship and TV contract deals, if it doesn't, the logical conclusion is that inflation will force all clubs to start putting up matchday ticket prices substantially.'" I agree that it isnt a case of Clubs making millions in profits and keeping wages down, but the SC hasnt risen for 10 years. We seem to have been so distracted by the SC making sure that all clubs are spending the same we seem to have forgotten to make sure they are spending the right amount and in the right ways. There are more intelligent ways we can spend money in the game, and more intelligent ways we can bring money in but the current SC is too prescriptive, too rigid and in some ways counter-productive.

The SC not rising is indeed a bad sign, and I do feel that RL players deserve more money than they get. However, the cold hard reality of the matter is that if Warrington barely made a profit at all in a cup winning year, while spending to the full cap allowance, then it says one of two things to me

1) The SC level originally was too high for clubs at the time to sustainably afford (this works on the assumption that turnover is higher now than it was 10years ago)
2) The RFL and clubs have done little, or nothing, to increase revenues and turnover in a decade.

Neither case is a palatable one.

If you make a good Curry open an Curry house, you make a good steak open a Steak house.

The future of the game? It has lasted 100+ years with "small northern towns" and did it without full time players. Not saying I do not want to see the game grow I certainly would love to travel to Devon, Nottingham, Edinburgh...etc to watch a good competative game against HKR. I would love to watch Australia take on England at a packed out Wembley.

I just can not see where or how you expect these things to happen when the general public do not see the game as an entertaining sport. And the majority of people that do go to games as I say are not prepared to travel so the international game relies on where the games are hosted.

It certainly isn't hard for me to hear your opinions but it seems you would rather pin your hopes and dreams for the game on something that just isn't going to happen or certainly not for a fair few decades.

Just a slight edit for accuracy.