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| Quote ="Bulls Boy 2011"For me the only big decision is who goes in at centre alongside Watkins?
Hardaker
Eden
??
Watkins
Hall
Widdop
Gale
Graham
Hodgson
Hill
Whitehead
Bateman
S. Burgess
For me that is our starting line up, or move Burgess to prop instead of Hill. And bring O'Loughlin in at LF.'" Whitehead as a second row is the best we have & should be played with Sam Burgess, Bateman is to small I would have O'Loughin at 13. I would like to see Hill Watts & Taylor in the squad. Hodgson at 9 along with Widdop at 6 are the best we have for the spots. Widdop has been the best half in the NRL this year. Not sure if I would have either of the Burgess twins in the team certainly in the starting 13 I have seen every game they have played this year & they have been bang ordinary at times. Is Shenton still playing internationals as he is back at the top of his game with Cas.
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| My starting team and squad would be-
Hardaker
McGillvary Watkins Percival Hall
Widdop Gale
Graham Roby Watts
Whitehead S Burgess O'Loughlin
Subs
Walmsley Hill Bateman Hodgson
Rest of squad
Shaul Eden Gildart Williams Taylor T Burgess McMeekan
I doubt that's the squad which will be picked because I think Bennett will go with George Burgess and Heighington over Taylor and Wattsand I think he'll take Ratchford over Shaul but I'd go with that. The only two I wasn't sure on was Gildart over Shenton and Williams over Sneyd. The Williams decision is because he can back up the two hookers as well as the halves and Gildart would get more out of being back up centre long term then Shenton would. They've both had fantastic seasons so that ones debatable.
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| I don't think that Eden will make the trip TBH and if he does Hall and McGillvary will start against both of Australia and NZ IMO
I would not pick Heighington as he isn't English by my criteria, but Bennett will pick him.
Stevie Ward would have been my choice IF fit and selected for the squad
Wayne Bennett's run on side v Australia
1:Hardaker
2:McGillvary
3:Watkins
4:Shenton
5:Hall
6:Widdop
7:Gale
8:S Burgess
9:Hodgeson
10:Graham
11:Whitehead
12:Heighington
13:O'Loughlin
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| Quote ="The Biffs Back"I don't think that Eden will make the trip TBH and if he does Hall and McGillvary will start against both of Australia and NZ IMO
I would not pick Heighington as he isn't English by my criteria, but Bennett will pick him.
Stevie Ward would have been my choice IF fit and selected for the squad
Wayne Bennett's run on side v Australia
1:Hardaker
2:McGillvary
3:Watkins
4:Shenton
5:Hall
6:Widdop
7:Gale
8:S Burgess
9:Hodgeson
10:Graham
11:Whitehead
12:Heighington
13:O'Loughlin'"
Gutted for Stevie Ward to be missing another big game on Saturdsy. He's such a great prospect but he just can't seem to steer clear of injury. He was probably only 50/50 for the World Cup squad anyway so you can't see them taking a punt on him now.
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| Stevie Ward will be in the squad.
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| My team would be:
Hardaker
McGilvry
Watkins
Shenton
Eden
Widdop
Gale
Graham
Hodgson
Sam Burgess
Whitehead
McMeekan
O'Loughlin.
Walmsley
Taylor
Watts
Burgess.
Firstly, I hope Bennett sees the sense in maintaining the Castleford left edge. Gale, Hardaker, Shenton and Eden have been the best attacking combination in SL this year, and spend hour after hour training together and know instinctively what each other will do. The timing and execution of the plays that these players can run are a potent attacking weapon. As an individual, I rate Percival more than Shenton BUT the advantage of having a unit that already plays together regularly and to a very high standard outweighs this, in my opinion.
Ryan Hall. He's been England's best over the last decade. But he isn't any more. His game has never been based on blistering pace, but he can't score the kind of acrobatic tries that is now expected of wingers. I hear talk of his kick returns, but the extra metre or so he makes on contact doesn't compensate for the metres that could be gained by players with more pace on the kick return(i.e. Eden). If Eden can make six or seven metres more ground before the chasers get to him, it's worth far more than an extra metre or two at the point of contact.
Mike McMeekan. I might be accused of Cas bias here, but McMeekan played very well in the Samoa game and has just earned himself a place in the Super League Dream Team. However, more importantly, I'm tired of us picking forwards who are too small (Bateman and Farrell). They may hold their own in SL (and more), but watching them against Australia's or New Zealand's forwards is like watching men playing boys. All too often, the best they can manage is literally dragging down other forwards, clinging on for dear life. They have no defensive impact and no ability to dominate when they carry the ball. McMeekan, on the other hand, has the size and strength to actually dominate in the tackle, whether this be in attack or defence.
Oh, and if Kevin Brown is anywhere near the squad, it's certain proof that Bennett hasn't watched a SL game all year.
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| Chris McQueen could be an option at centre
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| Quote ="nottinghamtiger"My team would be:
Hardaker
McGilvry
Watkins
Shenton
Eden
Widdop
Gale
Graham
Hodgson
Sam Burgess
Whitehead
McMeekan
O'Loughlin.
Walmsley
Taylor
Watts
Burgess.
Firstly, I hope Bennett sees the sense in maintaining the Castleford left edge. Gale, Hardaker, Shenton and Eden have been the best attacking combination in SL this year, and spend hour after hour training together and know instinctively what each other will do. The timing and execution of the plays that these players can run are a potent attacking weapon. As an individual, I rate Percival more than Shenton BUT the advantage of having a unit that already plays together regularly and to a very high standard outweighs this, in my opinion.
Ryan Hall. He's been England's best over the last decade. But he isn't any more. His game has never been based on blistering pace, but he can't score the kind of acrobatic tries that is now expected of wingers. I hear talk of his kick returns, but the extra metre or so he makes on contact doesn't compensate for the metres that could be gained by players with more pace on the kick return(i.e. Eden). If Eden can make six or seven metres more ground before the chasers get to him, it's worth far more than an extra metre or two at the point of contact.
Mike McMeekan. I might be accused of Cas bias here, but McMeekan played very well in the Samoa game and has just earned himself a place in the Super League Dream Team. However, more importantly, I'm tired of us picking forwards who are too small (Bateman and Farrell). They may hold their own in SL (and more), but watching them against Australia's or New Zealand's forwards is like watching men playing boys. All too often, the best they can manage is literally dragging down other forwards, clinging on for dear life. They have no defensive impact and no ability to dominate when they carry the ball. McMeekan, on the other hand, has the size and strength to actually dominate in the tackle, whether this be in attack or defence.
Oh, and if Kevin Brown is anywhere near the squad, it's certain proof that Bennett hasn't watched a SL game all year.'"
I don't think you're bias on McMeekan at all, he deserves a place in the squad but I would dispute that he did well against Samoa. It was probably his quietest game of the year with him making just 4 carries IIRC but he'll have obviously been nervous and a bit alien to the rest of the team.
He gets in the squad for me but will need to take his chance and play better then that when it comes.
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| Quote ="musson"Chris McQueen could be an option at centre'"
He’s injured.
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| Quote ="nottinghamtiger"My team would be:
Hardaker
McGilvry
Watkins
Shenton
Eden
Widdop
Gale
Graham
Hodgson
Sam Burgess
Whitehead
McMeekan
O'Loughlin.
Walmsley
Taylor
Watts
Burgess.
Firstly, I hope Bennett sees the sense in maintaining the Castleford left edge. Gale, Hardaker, Shenton and Eden have been the best attacking combination in SL this year, and spend hour after hour training together and know instinctively what each other will do. The timing and execution of the plays that these players can run are a potent attacking weapon. As an individual, I rate Percival more than Shenton BUT the advantage of having a unit that already plays together regularly and to a very high standard outweighs this, in my opinion.
Ryan Hall. He's been England's best over the last decade. But he isn't any more. His game has never been based on blistering pace, but he can't score the kind of acrobatic tries that is now expected of wingers. I hear talk of his kick returns, but the extra metre or so he makes on contact doesn't compensate for the metres that could be gained by players with more pace on the kick return(i.e. Eden). If Eden can make six or seven metres more ground before the chasers get to him, it's worth far more than an extra metre or two at the point of contact.
Mike McMeekan. I might be accused of Cas bias here, but McMeekan played very well in the Samoa game and has just earned himself a place in the Super League Dream Team. However, more importantly, I'm tired of us picking forwards who are too small (Bateman and Farrell). They may hold their own in SL (and more), but watching them against Australia's or New Zealand's forwards is like watching men playing boys. All too often, the best they can manage is literally dragging down other forwards, clinging on for dear life. They have no defensive impact and no ability to dominate when they carry the ball. McMeekan, on the other hand, has the size and strength to actually dominate in the tackle, whether this be in attack or defence.
Oh, and if Kevin Brown is anywhere near the squad, it's certain proof that Bennett hasn't watched a SL game all year.'"
4 props on the bench?
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| Eden was a wet lettuce in contact when he was at the Broncos. He seriously looked like he'd lose the ball every time he was tackled. As did Sargison this year and Hardaker last year. I'd have Eden in the squad because he can play full back, but people seriously underestimate just how much physically tougher the NRL is for outside backs.
I think Hodgson will be given first chance, but he needs to show better decision-making under pressure than he has this year.
It will be interesting to see if Bennett goes for the same sort of team as the mid season test. He likes a genuine ball handler at full back and tends to pick strong centres so may again opt for Hardaker in the centres.
Given some of the movements announced today re Tonga, it will be interesting to see if there are any NRL bolters in the England squad. I don't actually expect any, but I also wouldn't be surprised.
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| Hardaker
McGilvary
Watkins
Shenton
Hall
Gale
Widdop
SBurgess
Roby
Graham
Bateman
Whitehead
O'Loughlin
Hodgson
Walamsley
Watts
TBurgess
Reserves
18.) McMeeken Backrow/Prop
19.) Eden Wing/FB
20.) Percival Centre
21.) Williams Halves/ Hooker
22.) Farrell Backrow
23.) Hill Prop
24.) Tomkins Fullback/ Halves
Standby
25.) Ratchford
26.) Taylor
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Apr 2010 | 15 years | |
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| Quote ="Wigg'n"He’s injured.'"
He's not English. Neither is Heighington, nor Cuthbertson.
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| I don't get this Bateman is too small. He's one of our best players IMO he was immense for Wigan in the final against Hull. He's not big but he's bloody strong.
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| Quote ="Willzay"He's not English. Neither is Heighington, nor Cuthbertson.'"
Both have English fathers and are entitled to British citizenship with no hoops to jump through, no residency to complete. How much more English do you want them to be?
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| Quote ="NickyKiss"My starting team and squad would be-
Hardaker
McGillvary Watkins Percival Hall
Widdop Gale
Graham Roby Watts
Whitehead S Burgess O'Loughlin
Subs
Walmsley Hill Bateman Hodgson
Rest of squad
Shaul Eden Gildart Williams Taylor T Burgess McMeekan
I doubt that's the squad which will be picked because I think Bennett will go with George Burgess and Heighington over Taylor and Wattsand I think he'll take Ratchford over Shaul but I'd go with that. The only two I wasn't sure on was Gildart over Shenton and Williams over Sneyd. The Williams decision is because he can back up the two hookers as well as the halves and Gildart would get more out of being back up centre long term then Shenton would. They've both had fantastic seasons so that ones debatable.'"
I don't understand the hype regarding Hodgson. I think Clark is a much better player and better in defence.
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| 1. Hardaker
2. Eden
3. Percival
4. Watkins
5. Hall
6. Gale
7. Widdop
8. Hill
9. Roby
10. Graham
11. Whitehead
12. McMeeken
13. S Burgess
14. Clark
15. Walmsley
16. Bateman
17 Watts/T Burgess
Unsure why there's even a debate about leaving out a player who's scored 37 tries this season but each to their own.
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| Quote ="Bull Mania"I don't get this Bateman is too small. He's one of our best players IMO he was immense for Wigan in the final against Hull. He's not big but he's bloody strong.'"
He is but it's a different kettle of fish in Test rugby. He comes up against much better opponents than he does at SL level. Size is a big factor. If he plays in the forwards we'll lose IMO.
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| Quote ="Lord Tony Smith"1. Hardaker
2. Eden
3. Percival
4. Watkins
5. Hall
6. Gale
7. Widdop
8. Hill
9. Roby
10. Graham
11. Whitehead
12. McMeeken
13. S Burgess
14. Clark
15. Walmsley
16. Bateman
17 Watts/T Burgess
Unsure why there's even a debate about leaving out a player who's scored 37 tries this season but each to their own.'"
Anyone can score tries on that Wing for Cas, as have been proven in previous years. It is the attacking structure leading up to the pass to the winger that creates those tries, not Greg Eden. Even the young lad who made his debut against Hull got 3 tries
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| You can tell when someone is too small for test rugby - Wikipedia has them 3" taller than they actually are. A brilliant club player but would get thrown around like a rag doll - just as Jon Wilkin did.
Eden is the same. Hall & McGilvary by plenty.
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| Quote ="Wilde 3"Anyone can score tries on that Wing for Cas, as have been proven in previous years. It is the attacking structure leading up to the pass to the winger that creates those tries, not Greg Eden. Even the young lad who made his debut against Hull got 3 tries'"
Yes but my point is Eden is in great form and we should be picking players in form.
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| We need size everywhere IMO. If we pick small wingers, they will get dominated in the early tackles and our sets are off to a poor start, I think that's going to be a bigger factor than finishing at international level.
1. Hardaker
2. McGillvary
3. Watkins (Needs to pull his finger out at this level)
4. Percival
5. Hall
6. Widdop
7. Gale
8. Graham
9. Hodgson
10. Hill
11. Whitehead
12. S.Burgess
13. O'Loughlin
14. T.Burgess (Forget the cards, Watts is a penalty machine. We can't afford it)
15. McMeeken
16. Roby
17. Taylor/Walmsley (See who is training better/looks less knackered from the long season.)
Reserves: Ratchford, Eden, Williams, Taylor/Walmsley, Watts, Houghton, Farrell (Bit bigger than Bateman, runs lines which may cause them trouble, less likely to get binned/sent off)
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| Quote ="Lord Tony Smith"Yes but my point is Eden is in great form and we should be picking players in form.'"
Yet you've left out Shenton who's put most of Eden's meat pies on a platter.
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| Quote ="Towns88"Yet you've left out Shenton who's put most of Eden's meat pies on a platter.'"
Eden's tries are created inside of centre, even those that end with a Shenton pass.
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| Quote ="BrisbaneRhino"I'd have Eden in the squad because he can play full back, but people seriously underestimate just how much physically tougher the NRL is for outside backs.'"
Whilst he is a very good winger, Eden's attempts to play at full-back at club level this year have been disasterous.
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