I absolutely agree that it would strengthen their case immeasurably if they were stating what they did want to happen, as opposed to complaining (however justifiably) about what they don't want to happen.

I'm broadly supportive of the competent, financially viable clubs taking the initiative. I do think far too many RFL initiatives since Lewis lost interest have originated with the smaller chaotic clubs, and have been designed for their benefit. Certainly the proposed bizarre split league system and the abandonment of licensing look better and better the further down the table and into the championship you go. I think Nigel Wood has been a significant step backwards since Lewis, who had the heft and nouse to deal effectively with clubs, government and sponsors. No offence, but I wouldn't want Nigel going in to negotiate on my behalf in any deal which I was dependent upon.

So I'm up for a shake-out, and also up for the top clubs to punch their weight a bit more - especially as we have, in Lenegan and McManus, two serious guys of a quality all too rare in League. However, as you say, they need to put their cards on the table if they're not to be dismissed as simply having a hissy fit.

The game is now reaping what Lewis sowed. Like many 'managers' he made changes that looked great short term and got out before the emperor's new clothes were exposed.

After listening to Ian Lenagan on Sunday night, the SL chairmen know exactly what they want, how they want it and when they get it how to run it.
After Wood and Rimmer running the game, Lenagan, McManus, Davy, Hughes, Pearson etc are far better equipped business wise to take the game forward than that bunch now in charge at the RFL.

Then that's a good thing, right?

Afterall, you [irelentlessly[/i ram down our throats how much better things were pre super league when it was semi professional. You quote attendance figures for internationals and CC and show how they've decreased. You talk about how the week in week out games and CC have been devalued. You talk about how much worse off england/gb are and how much more competitve they were pre super league.

Right?

given SL got handed its viewing figures by darts this summer, I doubt I'd be doing anything of the sort.

What might be happening is an attempt to get SKY involved in the "running/ownership" of the sport more.

So having SL people running the RFL is good for the game as a whole? No, if they want to go it alone let them but outside of the RFL without all the support structures and finances paid to the RFL.

Agreed.....Let SL split away and manage itself....let the RFL deal with internationals and the rest of the domestic game, but I suspect if you want to see the best English players playing for England, then the SL group will push for some form of centrally funded contracts.

I couldn't disagree more. Before Lewis we were in just the same sort of drifting mess we are in now. Lewis came in, provided direction, purpose and a long-term plan. He turned round a massive deficit into a healthy profit, and left the game far healthier than when he arrived. I don't think it's unconnected in any way that the deterioration we've seen in the health of the game has coincided with his move out of the game and replacement with a more "traditional" RL type in Nigel Wood.

Government funding

Agreed, although how much of a say did Lewis have in the stobart deal, or had he gone by then????

Yeh that'll work! RL really prospered in Australia under news ltd rule!

In amongst all of this, I've renewed my season ticket for me and my lad for next season. Why? Because I've supported Fax for nigh on 40 years and no tinkering with the league structure will change that. Whilst 17 blokes wear the blue 'n' white, I'll be there to cheer them on - whatever league they're playing in.

1. The UK isn't Australia....RL is a hobby played by northern clubs who can't make a profit.
2. The RFL and the game itself has again proved it can not be left to its own devices.
3. If SKY get ownership or part of, then SKY get responsibility......remind me again who propped up the Melbourne Storm for 18+ years as well as bailing out the Cowboys and turning Brisbane into the best supported team by a long stretch?

This News hate us bollox from Australia is as bad as calling C9 "Nein" because they don't schedule the way some fans want....you took the Billion $......you can't start whining when you get ***ked up the as a consequence.



Without News and the SL war, you'd be playing NSW footie.....

You like to defend a dysfunctional organisation? hmmmm

The Storm are still a financial basket case after a decade and continue to require significant propping up and the game in victoria has not progressed at Jnr or grass roots level at all and is still behind WA as shown by the affiliated state championship results for the last 6 years. during News ltd ownership of Storm they took $8million a year out of the game and put $4mill into the Storm, yep great for the game!

Cowboys were financially in strife UNTIL news ltd sold them and new owners took over and have made them financially stable and doing well.

Brisbane are 75% of what they could and should be. If you compare them to the WC Eagles who are their AFL equivalent they are doing pretty poorly.

Stagnation under News Ltd rule has very much been the order of the day for the game in oz.

and without news ltd/SL we would still have a team in perth and a second team in brisbane!

I would take those 7 named clubs, get Lenagan to convince Catalans to come on board, and then make a move for a breakaway Super League of 10 or 12 clubs, with Toulouse invited as number 9 club, and one or three spots left open as dangling carrots for Leeds, Bradford, and one other club. Licensing will be retained.

Sky will go for that, and so will Leeds, and probably Bradford and Salford.


Then its bye bye to Wakefield, Castleford, and Widnes.

Wasn't Nigel Wood running Halifax when it went under financially about 10 or 12 years ago?

Are we to guess London are one of the seven?, ....and oh what a surprise you pushing Toulouse again!.

Are you a players agent working in that area?

Ps. cannot wait for France to flop again in the World Cup

The breakaway will hurt initially then turn out to be the best thing that every happened to RL
Completely isolate the breakaway clubs and make the amateur clubs in those towns choose who they affiliate to, those with the breakaways only play each other under the new body
Move the season back to winter and the CCF to May as you will not compete head on initially

This game was incompetently run before Richard Lewis took over. He revolutionised the administration with licensing (which is so successful in the NRL) and bringing a French team, the Catalans, on board. He realised that rugby league had to expand its horizons or die. But some of his efforts were stymied by the provincials, and his work was never completed.

Once Lewis became head of Sports England he delegated some of his powers to Nigel Wood, and we saw the downward slide begin. Once Lewis departed completely, Red Hall reverted to pre-2002 idiocy. The financial mismanagement returned. There was no naming sponsor for Super League in 2013!

The Wood restructuring policies, which include abandoning London, will revert the game back to a northern provincial pastime that the vast majority of British citizens know nothing about and care even less for. There will be less opportunities for commercial sponsorship of the game. Outside of Wigan, St Helens, Warrington, Hull and Leeds, the game will slowly wither and die in the face of the much more competently run English, Irish, Welsh and Scottish rugby unions.

Those who say otherwise are just making excuses not to go.

Whilst I agree with you and HX sparky, this puts us (the fans) in a position where we could be taken advantage RL in the UK is drifting like a rudderless ship at the moment and the self interest of the big boys in SL is not doing the game any favours.
The folk in charge should be giving direction and working to a plan, instead of all the utter nonsense about meaningful fixtures !!!
We have a 27 round competition to qualify for the end of season tournament, how meaningful is that ? especially when 6 out of the 8 are pretty much guaranteed a play off berth and as we have seen over the past few seasons, as long as you finish top 4 or 5, you can be crowned champions.

IF another expansion club (Toulouse) is to come into the game in the next 2-3 seasons, the RFL should grow a pair and tell folk what they expect will happen, because it is highly likely that they would want to play SL and this would mean having a mechanism for "helping" them get there, which naturally would be at the expense of one of the heartland clubs.

I feel the same way but the key words to me are "whatever league they're playing in".

I used to be a RL supporter, now I am a Halifax RLFC supporter. I used to go to all the internationals, Challenge Cup finals, Premiership Finals and, if Fax didn't have a game, I would choose what looked like the best game available to attend for my RL fix. Now, if Fax aren't involved, I'm simply not interested. When Sky dropped Championship RL I cancelled not only Sky Sports but my entire Sky package and subscribed to Premier Sports. This may seem pathetic to some, for that I make no apology, but I no longer feel a part of a RL "Family".

I now feel that crunch time has come. The SL clubs are holding the game to ransom as they have had plenty of time to voice their concerns without leaving their rebellion until the last minute. The top-end Championship teams have already invested heavily in next season's squad as the death of licensing and the return of P&R was already supposedly agreed. The only issue was 2x12 or 2x12 going to 3x8. If we are now back to "as you were" it could have a serious financial effect as the climbdown is bound to further reduce attendances.

I believe that the time has come for SL to break away entirely. Let them run SL as a circus if they wish. I have asked the question on these forums several times: "If SLE is a separate company run by it's members and responsible for sharing out the Sky money why is it left to the RFL to bail out their member clubs when they are in financial trouble?" The question has been met with a deathly silence. If they wish to break away then so be it but they can then do their own bailing out although I suspect that if a club gets into difficulties they will not take a cut in their money to help one of their members but will rub their hands with glee as the club goes bust and then split their share of the Sky money between the remaining members. So it begins until the next one and the next and so on.....

That’s fair enough. I think the best outcome would be for 10/12 SL clubs to set themselves up exactly like the NFL with a focus on growth and expansion (not necessarily geographical) of that league.

The question would be that if the entire game doesn’t want to set itself up like that, if they aren’t happy with SL going its own way and there is some kind of amicable settlement with more SL autonomy but still some solidarity. Where does the RFL/Championship money come from? SL goes its own way immediately there is a £2.5m per year drop in funding to the RFL/Championship. The Challenge cup, if SL clubs don’t compete its value and visibility dies. Are SL clubs going to compete if they are for all intents and purposes competing with the RFL/Championships? Internationals? Well Oz/Nz aren’t going to bother sending over a side to face a championship select team. SL sides aren’t going to allow their players to play for an RFL international side without some serious recompense so it isn’t going to be a money making exercise for them. Sport England money is strictly for increasing participation so the Championships can access that pot.

The fact is that whether directly or indirectly, the funds the RFL use to ‘bail’ (which have taken the form of loans or advances, not free money) comes from SL. Without SL the RFL doesn’t not only have that money, but any money. Almost all of the RFL’s income comes directly or indirectly from SL, without it, the RFL probably doesn’t exist.

I can understand the frustration championship clubs must have in being beholden to SL clubs but that’s the position they are in, and only they, not SL can get them out of it. You can’t complain about a lack of independence whilst also asking Daddy for more pocket money, you can’t complain the SL clubs are being selfish at the same time as begging for scraps at the table.

The international game is key to the profile of the sport. Look at the last few weeks, we have had more coverage of the World Cup squad selection in the mainstream media than the whole Super League playoffs did. We have had a players (well 3 players') mum being interviewed live across all national BBC radio stations.

Before the SL clubs think about a breakaway, or any restructuring, they need to consider the international as the pinacle of whatever is created.