They are competing against all the hundreds of other ways people can go and spend their money on entertainment, including all sports teams that people follow which have either been part of the community for decades and decades, or have been supported in the family for decades and decades.

I'm sure you could identify lots of target markets from a population of millions, but I'm equally sure you won't be able to identify a cost effective way of targetting them from a tiny marketing budget, that's the problem.

We've done ticket deals, but then our threadbare team plays the turgid rubbish we've been offering for a long time now and they don't come back, we've put together entertainment packages, but George Sampson doing backflips at half time isn't really going to put bums on seats even if the kiddies like it, we've done Antipodean theme days, but the bulk of Aussies in London think SL is a substandard competition and are too parochial to support any other club than their own even if the claim to be the world's biggest "footy" fan. In a previous I did marketing effectiveness for a major ISP, so I know how much even minor, localised, marketing/advertising costs, I doubt we can even afford to put posters on tube trains.

Basically you are stuffed then

No I'm not saying this, I'm not aware of any audience that needs talking round who we're not bothered with, and I don't know how you managed to get to that?



All of the ways of promoting the club need money to make them work, we can bring in new people on cheap deals, but then they watch a substandard team and don't come back.



We have lots of potential target markets that we cannot tap into in the short to medium term without substantial investment.



It really depends on whether you buy into the line of the RFL and more importantly Sky (the game's major backer) that having a club in London is strategically more important than another club on the M62, or a club in Cumbria, the latter is not going to significantly boost SL crowds, and neither will raise profile of RL more than a London club.'"

Without significant, sustained investment, yes we are stuffed.

Quote ="Kelvin's Ferret"Without significant, sustained investment, yes we are stuffed.'" Maybe not Kelvins. viewtopic.php?f=2&t=449363 Saturday could be the turning point for your club. I await with interest to see what happens

Quote ="Kelvin's Ferret"Without significant, sustained investment, yes we are stuffed.'" Maybe not Kelvins. viewtopic.php?f=2&t=449363 Saturday could be the turning point for your club. I await with interest to see what happens

No ! Nonesense. There is another place.

It's dark.

It's quiet.

It's where the Mutants live (no, not Widnes!)

It's a place where you can thrive without sustained investment. Come join us.

Come join us in The Championship

Or you become a Championship club

Is the second option viable ?

Does a fat dog fart?

Everyone is welcome down here ................................

So its Haven then , not glowing much though are they ?

So who exactly is ' Thriving ' down here ?

I meant thriving in the sense of "culture". You know - mould. Don't tell me that Leigh doesn't fester like a cess-pit.

lewis didnt let SL lose its welsh club, he wont give up if quins fail

theyll just find another partner, preferably a soccer club

the culture is just too different with union

it needs to be with a club whose fans have a similar background to RL ones

I am struggling to find an argument to your post

Barnsley is too far north though.

Not much call for flat caps and whippets in london , as for ferret fanciers , no chance

ive given up on quins, its a waste there

whats going on at wrexham shows it doesnt always need to be such a struggle

soccer fans are more like RL fans than union ones.

quins has failed to get union fans to crossover

all a new club needs is around 3000 new fans to go with the 2500 hardcore london fans.

linking with a soccer club shouldnt be too hard to get 3000 people across

I think that's too simplistic a view.

I agree that RL in London needs RFL support like The Storm in the NRL for it to flourish properly.

London is a tougher market than North Wales.

I wouldn't be so sure. And as for Wrexham - let's not pop the champers just yet. It's a new fad at the moment and as great as it is let's not proclaim it as a success to loudly yet lest we look complete twonks - at least lets have a season to evaluate. If they're averaging 7-8 thou come September then bloody great but three home games out of 12 is it? Let the magic sink in first before marching onto Plymouth and Windsor.

=#BF8040I can't remember anyone from Quins (or under any prior name) mentioning that the top league needs a London club. However this was the line fed to everyone by the people running the game when London Broncos were promoted despite finishing 5th in the second tier and about half a dozen clubs were relegated to form Super League. If they believe that then they are unlikely to demote Quins no matter how bad things get.

The attitude of the people running Quins is of minor interest to me now, investment is really what matters. Melbourne Storm is Australia have built their success on dollars from News Ltd. Sustained investment in expansion is a winning model, but whether it is achievable is another matter, and that's before the parochial tendency start wailling.

=#808000They have been funded for 30 years now and have spent half of that time at the elite level. If after 15 years at the top level and with the security of a three year safety net they are not seen as a good investment then they are not likely to be. There has to come a point where people say enough is enough and to stop holding back clubs that could advance better than Quins have simply due to geography (this is not the fault of Quins as a club but of those making the decisions). If a point is reached where Quins are the poorest option of the 14 due to a number of factors and the best of the rest are better equipped then Quins have to go down.

Statements like these are just daft, nobody is going to magic another London SL club out of their booty and not face the same problems, or even worse problems. It's about investment, that's all!'"

:34fnyawi

=#80BF00:34fnyawiI know that an instant club is not an option and wasn't suggesting it. I just perhaps didn't make my point properly with a glib statement. Quins at SL level are not sustainable it seems as lack of interest and resources are driving them backwards. Skolars are doing poorly in a lower league but are at a more sustainable level. Quins should drop down to find a level where they can exist sustainably (you can't keep hoping for investment that may never come) and can continue to help development in the capital. As you say the fruits of such work take time and in the future once this has borne fruit a sustainable top level club in London may be possible though it may not be Quins.


Thanks for bringing my Glaucoma on with your multi coloured offering

They are one potential market; one we have tried repeatedly to attract, but many Aussie RL fans are just as parochial as their UK counterparts and lots of them have no interest in SL, let alone a poor SL team. We can target them till we’re blue in the face, but if it really was as easy as some people trot out we’d be awash with them by now, yet we’re not and we never have been.



The only games we’re likely to win are those against weaker sides and they’re not entertaining, we play boring RL, and have done for some time. Dropping down to the Championship would not be helpful because we almost certainly couldn’t sustain the things we are good at which are development related.
One of the great contradictions of anti-expansion positions (and I’m not saying yours is) is that whilst they’re against expansion, they complain about the problems RL faces as a result of a limited player pool and lack of national exposure (this also applies to those who claim they’re not against expansion but then place conditions on expansion that that make it practically impossible).



We have tried various deals along these lines, what impact they have is generally weakened by the offering on the pitch.



There was an obvious desire to get London represented, just as there is a desire to raise RL’s national profile, something that is necessary if RL is to be anything other than a marginal sport going backwards. But it may not even come down to relegation; I can’t see how the club can continue existing without investment.



Conspiracy nuts aside, Quins have never received any more funding than any other SL club despite the glaring difficulties of being an alien sport in one of the most expensive cities in the world. Melbourne are successful because they got the investment needed, we’ve never had anything comparable, now it’s probably true that the RFL/Sky are not prepared to make that kind of investment, but even if they were the parochial element would scream the house down. Think about the conspiracy nut fantasies that already exist about Quins and imagine what they’d be like if Sky/RFL actually did make a Melbourne Storm type investment?



Quins sit at the centre of development in London I doubt that could be continued if Quins were to drop down, we’ve used 8 players in the first team this season who came through the development programme. Skolars also get the benefit of dual registration and former academy players. Besides I don’t realistically see how any other London SL club could emerge without the same funding that Quins RL currently lack.

In an interview with Sky's Vic Wakeling in the history of the first ten years of SL he said that a London club was a condition of the agreement although it isn't now - the inclusion of a French club wasn't (Sky subscription channels weren't officially available there) and neither was summer rugby although we'd have got less money. As far as the Crusaders are concerned, they are doing what Fulham did in their first season and so a comparison with Quins isn't really valid.

=#FF0000As I said already being in the second tier still allows for exposure on TV and doesn't mean that development has to stop. Clubs in the Championship can still produce young players, Widnes are a prime example. Although dual registration would not apply there is nothing to stop young players being loaned to Skolars, the only real difference would be that you couldn't recall them in the first month (a teenager's salary should not affect the cap too much at that level). Although there is no real chance of another London club emerging now that is not what I was saying. With a sustainable Skolars and a sustainable Quins (at a lower level than SL) the presence could be maintained for long enough for the young kids now playing in London to start playing for those clubs. With such a strong foundation in place then in another 10, 15, 20 years there may be the right things in place for a London club in SL whether that be Quins stepping up or a new club coming through with either one having access to the funds needed and backed by someone who has seen and wants to build on what has been achieved by then.