Long way to go so hard to truly judge them yet but Wigan don't look the team they were a couple of years ago. Disorganised and not clinical. Not how you would have described the old Wigan. They have lost their 'intimidation' factor and teams can rattle them easily.

There is a lot of pressure on Williams but I think he played well in parts and their front row is unconvincing. Tautai apart they look vulnerable. Felt sorry for Crosby, he was getting smashed on every hit up.

I felt more sorry for Mellor - he was consistently hit late throughout the game.

Well done Widnes.was thinking masacre at 16-0 and man red carded.

Despite the result tonight though no chance of top 8 for that widnes side.sorry

if he doesn't get at least 3 games for putting his head in I would be extremely suprised. It would give sufficient weight behind the 'Wigan Bias' argument relating to disciplinary procedure.

Performing poorly is par for the course in Round 1 for us, which is a vast improvement on the Noble years when we only started playing in Round 7 or so. Quite a few of our players didn't perform well enough and didn't gel, whereas a few others have let themselves down in other ways.

Logan Tomkins seems to have been watching videos of his big brother from a few years ago. There was no need for it then and no need for it now. Not only is it grubby play but trapping defenders will only win you a couple of (unjust) penalties while the rest of the time it will merely slow down your attack. He isn't good enough for the Wigan squad, and I think he knows it. We need a better back up for Micky Mac.

Joel Tomkins reverted to type. When Widnes scored their last try he went looking for trouble, in the words of ThePrinter, "like a kid who's had too much fizzy pop". Embarrassing and shines the light on us in totally the wrong way yet again.

Marty Smith let himself down in the same incident. I do think it's grubby to barge into a player in order to "celebrate" but to react to it by kicking out is utterly unprofessional. He was lucky to get a yellow on the night and he'll be incredibly lucky to avoid further punishment at the panel.

James Child had a 'mare, and while lots of fans will only see decisions going Wigan's way he made some right clangers both ways. The Ah Van red stands out, of course. It was harsh, I'm sure Ah Van had no malicious intent, but let's not forget it ended Charnley's game and was pretty reckless. If refs are consistent with head shots (intentional or not) we can't really complain. That remains to be seen though.

Well done Widnes.

I admit, I only watched the first half and the last 15 mins as I had some other stuff to do, but what I saw wasn't pretty. Can't really think of anything else to say lol.

Matty Smith has lived off his HB partner. He is completely unable to run a game where Wigan aren't dominant.

Excellent!

Wigan are a fine rugby team when they want to play but time and time again (© Alan Hansen) their discipline is awful.

And that Burgess on the wing looked like he was already imagining playing for Sydney, that was a dreadful individual showing from him.

Difficult to watch wasn't it... Wane really is starting to drag rugby league through the mud.

Hey, there's no mud on that pitch

Rumour has it that Wane was seen in the changing room pre-match injecting the players with some unknown substance.

I know what that substance was. It was the testosterone of Kelvin Skerrett.

If you're handing out league positions after 1 game, I assume you don't think Wigan will make the 8 either?

Just as playing with no half backs can also do a team no favours against 12 men...wonder if Wigan fans still think we are champions "by default" or has it suddenly become harder to beat 12 men over the off season?



Joking aside, sad that yet again we are focussing more on bad refereeing/negative incidents rather than recognising the character and determination shown by Widnes to fight back from 16-0 down with 12 men and rescue a point against "the strongest squad in SL" according to pre-match comments. It was a great comeback for them and thought Heremaia & Mellor in particular were outstanding, well done Widnes

TBF to Child with regards to the red card. Should a player be allowed to stay on the pitch if the player he has injured with a high tackle has to sit out of the rest of the game?

No

You can't really go there, as then depending on personnel involved in an incident, some coaches may deem some players to be nfit to carry on to get someone sent off. Anyway they have 15 minutes. What do you suggest, get sent off 15 mins later if a player "can't resume"?

I think it's fine as it is, the ref can and rightly does take the outcome of the incident into account, sure Child couldn't "know" how bad Charnley was but made the same judgment as all other speccies, aided no doubt by his earpiece, and the result was the same as what you suggest.

Look at it this way, Ah Van does exactly the same thing, but marginally misses contact, he doesn't get sent off.

But looking at the incident retrospectively, The decision was correct because Charnley could play no further part in the game.

Look at it this way. If Sutton's challenge on Brown was high, should he be sent off? He would literally have just taken out Widnes main play maker for the rest of the game.

Poor performance by Wigan, in more than one respect. Nothing less than expected though these days.

The decision was correct (just about, on balance) because Ah Van recklessly swung his arm and made contact with the head of another player. The consequences for Charnley should have little or no bearing on the punishment for Ah Van.

I've seen Rob Burrow cop plenty of head shots that he's just bounced up from. If you start encouraging people to stay down because it'll influence how the referee punishes the offender, you're heading down football's slippery slope.

What's more disappointing is that despite three on-field officials and a VR, Matty Smith wasn't given a red for lashing out at another player with the boot. Indeed it appeared that up until Robert Hicks decided to get involved at the restart, the rest of the officials were quite happy to turn a blind eye to the offence.

Why wasn't Farrel carded for his late high shot on the kicker

Not even penalised

I think you've answered your own question there.

But they should. As I pointed out elsewhere, if Paddy had done exactly the same motion but missed the head, he wouldn't have been sent off. And it's not just the RL disciplinary. Any court will always take into account the consequences for the victim, if Paddy did that to a stranger in the street, it would be an assault, if the stranger had an eggshell skull and died it would be manslaughter. Same act, wildly different consequences. And that's as it should be.


Well yes, I saw Paul Deacon take more, but absolutely nobody is advocating that. The ref is experienced and I've watched a bit of rugby in my time, and it was plainly obvious that Charnley wasn't doing a performance.


How it "appeared" isn't worth a comment as I don't know what was said or by whom. If Smith had been sent off he couldn't have complained, he kicked out at the player but "lashing out" is exaggerating it. Personally i would have sent him off as I don't want to see that on a rugby field even half-hearted, but I don't go so far as to say a yellow card was unjustifiable so i'm not bagging the ref for it, especially as I don't know just how much teh officials saw. But personally I hope the disciplinary is able to look at it and he cops a match and a fine, as it was ridiculous, and wants nipping in his petulant bud. I suppose if they can depends on what he was carded for, exactly.

It should be - and I believe is - part of the sentencing guidelines. I don't think it should form part of the on field decision making of a referee though. It's the act that needs to be dealt with, not the consequences which are to a certain extent subject to random chance anyway. Two virtually identical high tackles on the same player can have very different short term effects. If a player is high and reckless - which IMO Ah Van was - then it's a red, whether the recipient comes up with a cut, a concussion or without a scratch.



IIRC the ridiculous rule that if a referee deals with it you can't use video which the FA apply isn't yet part of rugby league, and the match review panel can go back and retrospectively apply a punishment?

Can't work, though. As I've said, Ah van does that exact same thing but misses, he would almost never be sent off. That's random chance - but that's how it is.


Certainly hope so.

of course they can retrospectively deal with it, as can be seen by previous panel outcomes (Flower was dealt with by the ref and then the RFL panel dished out a 6 month ban). Sending off sufficient in Ah Vans case, Matty to get a ban