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| Quote ="Bartholemew Smythe"All that tonights game proved is that JJB,Wilkins et al are not worthy of playing at International standard.
So maybe McBanana stumbled unexpectedly on some fortunate news.
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What about the younger players though? They should've been trying to prove their worth and show why they should be selected above some of the more established (so called) 'failures' but most looked like they couldn't be d. |
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| Quote ="Charlie Sheen"We tried it for 2 seasons, if we gave up on everything that wasn't a succes in that amount of time we'd probably have no game at all.. It wasn't great but the crowds were OK, and because of the history and rivalry it could've been a real success. You can't expect every new concept to be an instant success, it takes time. SOO was first played infront of 25k crowds, now every game is pretty much a sell out.'"
I get what you're saying but come on that match tonight was awful. I also don't understand the obsession with everything origin and the fact that because it works in Australia means we must copy it. Aussie rules football is very popular over there but no one here gives two hoots.
If we must have a mid season International then play either France/Ireland/Wales and build the International game over here. Let's face it, with the new tv deal down under we will be light years behind them for many years, so forget it. Try and aim towards an eventual competitive 4/5 nations and even if the quality isn't the highest, if the games are close and intense (which will take a while) then people will watch. Hell we might even get someone to sponsor the thing. |
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| Quote ="Hillsborough Lad"I get what you're saying but come on that match tonight was awful. I also don't understand the obsession with everything origin and the fact that because it works in Australia means we must copy it. Aussie rules football is very popular over there but no one here gives two hoots.
If we must have a mid season International then play either France/Ireland/Wales and build the International game over here. Let's face it, with the new tv deal down under we will be light years behind them for many years, so forget it. Try and aim towards an eventual competitive 4/5 nations and even if the quality isn't the highest, if the games are close and intense (which will take a while) then people will watch. Hell we might even get someone to sponsor the thing.'"
I don't disagree the intensity wasn't what it should be and I don't necessarily think we should go back to a county of Origin, and I too don't share the fascination with everything Aussie (including SOO), I just think we dissmiss experiments as failures without really giving them a chance to grow. |
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| Quote ="Hillsborough Lad"England v England Knights please.
The England soccer team used to have England v Young England (which was the Under 23's I believe) in the 50's and 60's. Anything but Yorks v Lancs.'"
You have got to have a contest that people have a side to support, we have that with the Exiles. England v Knights is nothing other than a trial game and no one would pay to watch it. |
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| Quote ="Mark_W"Quote ="Hillsborough Lad"England v England Knights please.
The England soccer team used to have England v Young England (which was the Under 23's I believe) in the 50's and 60's. Anything but Yorks v Lancs.'"
You have got to have a contest that people have a side to support, we have that with the Exiles. England v Knights is nothing other than a trial game and no one would pay to watch it.'"
Exactly.
The Exiles concept is a good one imo but the RFL need to a - stop trying to market it like SOO and b - put something in place that stops the England players pulling out left right and centre. Playing one match on a stand alone weekend would have been enough imo. We can build it up to a 2 match and then a 3 match series when it takes off. |
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| Quote ="Mark_W"You have got to have a contest that people have a side to support, we have that with the Exiles. England v Knights is nothing other than a trial game and no one would pay to watch it.'"
SOO is a trial game for the Aussie team. |
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| Just play one test against france away on a weekend.
England will get more intensity from that game. Also I want an explanation from the RFL on why they turned down a tour to New Zealand this year?
Quote ="Hillsborough Lad"SOO is a trial game for the Aussie team.'"
It use to be. Them days are long gone! |
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We do need to do something on the international scale IMO. The state of origin is a three game test where full teams are fielded on every occasion. England exiles is a two game test where on the second test we rested a handful of the best players and got beat by the exiles. Absolute pointless game for me unless your going to play a nearly identical team to the one we will use against the Aussies and all blacks.
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| Quote ="Hillsborough Lad"SOO is a trial game for the Aussie team.'"
But people have a team to support. People from NSW support NSW. People from QLD support QLD.
Who would you support if England played England? I'd personally find it difficult to want England to lose. |
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| Quote ="Conroy"Exactly.
The Exiles concept is a good one imo but the RFL need to a - stop trying to market it like SOO and b - put something in place that stops the England players pulling out left right and centre. Playing one match on a stand alone weekend would have been enough imo. We can build it up to a 2 match and then a 3 match series when it takes off.'" The Exiles match will never take off, It will continue to be a ridiculous contrived farce no matter how much 'time you give it'. I don't understand why people make excuses for this match, TBH I'm surprised it has lasted this long. Though the majority of people decrying it appear to be the regular whiners, in this case they are right. Hopefully the concept will be dropped ASAP along with 'England Knights' when McNamara is removed as England coach. |
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| Quote ="Hillsborough Lad"SOO is a trial game for the Aussie team.'"
No it isn't. |
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| Quote ="headhunter"The Exiles match will never take off, It will continue to be a ridiculous contrived farce no matter how much 'time you give it'. I don't understand why people make excuses for this match, TBH I'm surprised it has lasted this long. Though the majority of people decrying it appear to be the regular whiners, in this case they are right. Hopefully the concept will be dropped ASAP along with 'England Knights' when McNamara is removed as England coach.'"
Then where do we stand? |
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Any successful concept needs a season built around it
With the magic weekend, 14 teams, challenge cup and play offs for a month where is the space
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| Quote ="headhunter"The Exiles match will never take off, It will continue to be a ridiculous contrived farce no matter how much 'time you give it'. I don't understand why people make excuses for this match, TBH I'm surprised it has lasted this long. Though the majority of people decrying it appear to be the regular whiners, in this case they are right. Hopefully the concept will be dropped ASAP along with 'England Knights' when McNamara is removed as England coach.'"
Do you include yourself in this exclusive club of whiners?... |
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Personally I would look to build it as the exiles looking to come over to the Super League for an easy ride and being disrespectful to the competition as opposed to 'mate v mate'. Do everything possible to try and make the England fans dislike them.
From an England POV then I would have the game played on a stand alone weekend and as a one off test match. Only the NRL based players are exempt from selection and if an England player opts to pull out then he must be assessed by the England doctor and if he deems him fit then he plays. You don't get players pulling out of SOO willy nilly. The RFL need to tell the clubs that England selection takes priority like in Cricket. It's one game. Yes injuries can happen, but they can happen in training as well.
They need to stick with this concept though because it is clearly a better game for England then playing the Knights, France, Wales, Scotland etc etc
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One game vs the Exiles on a standalone weekend is all that should have happened. The 2nd game was pointless.
I think it needs to be continued with, there is no room in the current schedule for a proper series, either Exiles or County Origin, we need ONE mid-season international against quality opposition. We should also put pressure on the Aussie clubs to release Burgess, Widdop, Graham and Reed. One game watching a full strength England against a full strength Exiles would be worth watching and with sensible scheduling/ticket prices/marketing etc should be able to bring in 20k supporters. The game should have its own sponsor also!
The only problem with the future of the Exiles concept IMO is the reduction of the oversees quota and the increased NRL salary cap is going to lead to a lower player pool for them to choose from. I think it should have been brought in years ago but the RFL kept persisting with France and Wales, I'd have loved to have seen Barrett, Lyon, Jones etc playing in this fixture.
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| Quote ="Conroy"They need to stick with this concept though because it is clearly a better game for England then playing the Knights, France, Wales, Scotland etc etc'" No, it's not. I didn't watch either of the Exiles matches, but I fail to see how it's better in any way, especially the second game which was pretty much a 2nd or 3rd string England side. At least nations like France will be motivated to play, the Exiles are a made up team with no incentive whatsoever and, as I said at the time it was announced, this concept is completely doomed to failure no matter how much people want to try and hype it up or make excuses for it.
Ultimately, this is a poorly implemented idea based on dubious reasoning by an unintelligent man who is extremely bad at his job. Unless a mid-season fixture is more intense than a top Super League game, then nothing will be gained from it other than being a run-through for the team. At least matches against France, Wales or others would be genuine internationals which could benefit the sport, and actually would have the potential to grow and develop into intense fixtures given time and improvement in the opposition. The Exiles is just a joke. |
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| Quote ="headhunter"Quote ="Conroy"They need to stick with this concept though because it is clearly a better game for England then playing the Knights, France, Wales, Scotland etc etc'" No, it's not. I didn't watch either of the Exiles matches, but I fail to see how it's better in any way, especially the second game which was pretty much a 2nd or 3rd string England side. At least nations like France will be motivated to play, the Exiles are a made up team with no incentive whatsoever and, as I said at the time it was announced, this concept is completely doomed to failure no matter how much people want to try and hype it up or make excuses for it.
Ultimately, this is a poorly implemented idea based on dubious reasoning by an unintelligent man who is extremely bad at his job. Unless a mid-season fixture is more intense than a top Super League game, then nothing will be gained from it other than being a run-through for the team. At least matches against France, Wales or others would be genuine internationals which could benefit the sport, and actually would have the potential to grow and develop into intense fixtures given time and improvement in the opposition. The Exiles is just a joke.'"
So what do we gain by sticking 60/70 on Wales or France? |
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| Quote ="Charlie Sheen"We tried it for 2 seasons, if we gave up on everything that wasn't a succes in that amount of time we'd probably have no game at all.. It wasn't great but the crowds were OK, and because of the history and rivalry it could've been a real success. You can't expect every new concept to be an instant success, it takes time. SOO was first played infront of 25k crowds, now every game is pretty much a sell out.'"
Yorks v Lancs is not a new concept these matches were played for years prior to SL but were stopped due to lack of interest, that was in the days of winter rugby-pre super league when everything with RL was great!!
There is not an appetite for this type of contest |
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| Quote ="Conroy"So what do we gain by sticking 60/70 on Wales or France?'" England have only topped 50 points against Wales twice in over 100 years. |
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| Quote ="headhunter"England have only topped 50 points against Wales twice in over 100 years.'"
And France?
EDIT - Our last 3 results against Wales: 74-0 48-12 42-4
Our 3 results v the Exiles: 12-16 18-10 20-32
Wonder which were the tougher games? |
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Quote ="headhunter"No, it's not. I didn't watch either of the Exiles matches, but I fail to see how it's better in any way, especially the second game which was pretty much a 2nd or 3rd string England side. At least nations like France will be motivated to play, the Exiles are a made up team with no incentive whatsoever and, as I said at the time it was announced, this concept is completely doomed to failure no matter how much people want to try and hype it up or make excuses for it.
Ultimately, this is a poorly implemented idea based on dubious reasoning by an unintelligent man who is extremely bad at his job. Unless a mid-season fixture is more intense than a top Super League game, then nothing will be gained from it other than being a run-through for the team. At least matches against France, Wales or others would be genuine internationals which could benefit the sport, and actually would have the potential to grow and develop into intense fixtures given time and improvement in the opposition. The Exiles is just a joke.'"
Totally agree. Its all very well people saying 'give it a chance', but the point of leadership is being able to make decisions based on intelligent predictions not random ideas then 'giving it a chance'. Anyone who predicts the exiles game will succeed long term is as daft as people who thought it was clever scrapping GB to replace it with teams from nations where the interest in RL is minimal.
There's a clue in the WCC. That didnt need time to catch on. Remember the first one? Probably the most electric atmosphere at a game in the modern era, still gives me goose bumps.
www.youtube.com/watch?v=X_4HSnEkyiI
Unfortuantely we cant make it happen without the NRL believing in it, but something akin to the Champions League (which i heard talk of a few months ago) is the next logical step to expose the cream of British players to the highest standard (other than them going to the NRL) Two groups of four, 2 Aus in each. You play both your away group matches in one 7 to 10 day trip overseas, to minimize the problems of distance.
We should be working our backsides off, and spending our marketing salaries to convince sponsors and the NRL to go for it. You can put adverts on the side of trucks all you like, but give the press a proper elite competition and its worth 1000 times as much in marketing. |
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Quote ="headhunter"No, it's not. I didn't watch either of the Exiles matches, but I fail to see how it's better in any way, especially the second game which was pretty much a 2nd or 3rd string England side. At least nations like France will be motivated to play, the Exiles are a made up team with no incentive whatsoever and, as I said at the time it was announced, this concept is completely doomed to failure no matter how much people want to try and hype it up or make excuses for it.
Ultimately, this is a poorly implemented idea based on dubious reasoning by an unintelligent man who is extremely bad at his job. Unless a mid-season fixture is more intense than a top Super League game, then nothing will be gained from it other than being a run-through for the team. At least matches against France, Wales or others would be genuine internationals which could benefit the sport, and actually would have the potential to grow and develop into intense fixtures given time and improvement in the opposition. The Exiles is just a joke.'"
Totally agree. Its all very well people saying 'give it a chance', but the point of leadership is being able to make decisions based on intelligent predictions not random ideas then 'giving it a chance'. Anyone who predicts the exiles game will succeed long term is as daft as people who thought it was clever scrapping GB to replace it with teams from nations where the interest in RL is minimal.
There's a clue in the WCC. That didnt need time to catch on. Remember the first one? Probably the most electric atmosphere at a game in the modern era, still gives me goose bumps.
www.youtube.com/watch?v=X_4HSnEkyiI
Unfortuantely we cant make it happen without the NRL believing in it, but something akin to the Champions League (which i heard talk of a few months ago) is the next logical step to expose the cream of British players to the highest standard (other than them going to the NRL) Two groups of four, 2 Aus in each. You play both your away group matches in one 7 to 10 day trip overseas, to minimize the problems of distance.
We should be working our backsides off, and spending our marketing salaries to convince sponsors and the NRL to go for it. You can put adverts on the side of trucks all you like, but give the press a proper elite competition and its worth 1000 times as much in marketing. | |
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Quote ="RLBandit"Totally agree. Its all very well people saying 'give it a chance', but the point of leadership is being able to make decisions based on intelligent predictions not random ideas then 'giving it a chance'. Anyone who predicts the exiles game will succeed long term is as daft as people who thought it was clever scrapping =#FF0000GB to replace it with teams from nations where the interest in RL is minimal.There's a clue in the WCC. That didnt need time to catch on. Remember the first one? Probably the most electric atmosphere at a game in the modern era, still gives me goose bumps.
www.youtube.com/watch?v=X_4HSnEkyiI
Unfortuantely we cant make it happen without the NRL believing in it, but something akin to the Champions League (which i heard talk of a few months ago) is the next logical step to expose the cream of British players to the highest standard (other than them going to the NRL) Two groups of four, 2 Aus in each. You play both your away group matches in one 7 to 10 day trip overseas, to minimize the problems of distance.
We should be working our backsides off, and spending our marketing salaries to convince sponsors and the NRL to go for it. You can put adverts on the side of trucks all you like, but give the press a proper elite competition and its worth 1000 times as much in marketing.'"
It is to do with Sport England funding, they won't put money in unless it is 100% for England. Unfortunately I would rather see GB being the pinacle and the path ways being the home nations. |
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Quote ="RLBandit"Totally agree. Its all very well people saying 'give it a chance', but the point of leadership is being able to make decisions based on intelligent predictions not random ideas then 'giving it a chance'. Anyone who predicts the exiles game will succeed long term is as daft as people who thought it was clever scrapping =#FF0000GB to replace it with teams from nations where the interest in RL is minimal.There's a clue in the WCC. That didnt need time to catch on. Remember the first one? Probably the most electric atmosphere at a game in the modern era, still gives me goose bumps.
www.youtube.com/watch?v=X_4HSnEkyiI
Unfortuantely we cant make it happen without the NRL believing in it, but something akin to the Champions League (which i heard talk of a few months ago) is the next logical step to expose the cream of British players to the highest standard (other than them going to the NRL) Two groups of four, 2 Aus in each. You play both your away group matches in one 7 to 10 day trip overseas, to minimize the problems of distance.
We should be working our backsides off, and spending our marketing salaries to convince sponsors and the NRL to go for it. You can put adverts on the side of trucks all you like, but give the press a proper elite competition and its worth 1000 times as much in marketing.'"
It is to do with Sport England funding, they won't put money in unless it is 100% for England. Unfortunately I would rather see GB being the pinacle and the path ways being the home nations. | |
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I think the Exiles is the best of a bad job. A couple of mistakes by the RFL this year.
One match was enough this year but it was diluted before it even began this year.
No official sponsor for it.
I can see why they chose the Galpharm for last nights match (central location in the heartlands). But Leeds or Wigan would have been better as there would have been more of a crowd and better atmosphere.
Talking of atmosphere, Why don't they close off the stand where the TV cameras are? This at least on the TV show a more fuller stadium and at least make it more appealling to TV viewers.
I would like to see England play two matches mid season. One England v England Knights as a trial game. I think for the vast majority of people would like to see the Knights win so there will be a team for people to win. Then the Exiles match, marketed as they think they're better because the played in the "superior "competition.
Whilst they are going on get Scotland, Wales, Ireland and France playing each other.
After typing all that another thought popped into my head. The RU 6 nations, with a mid season competition where the regular season is going on whilst the international competition is going on.
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TO BE FIXED |
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| Quote ="fatbaztod100"I think the Exiles is the best of a bad job. A couple of mistakes by the RFL this year.
One match was enough this year but it was diluted before it even began this year.
No official sponsor for it.
I can see why they chose the Galpharm for last nights match (central location in the heartlands). But Leeds or Wigan would have been better as there would have been more of a crowd and better atmosphere.
Talking of atmosphere, Why don't they close off the stand where the TV cameras are? This at least on the TV show a more fuller stadium and at least make it more appealling to TV viewers.
I would like to see England play two matches mid season. One England v England Knights as a trial game. I think for the vast majority of people would like to see the Knights win so there will be a team for people to win. Then the Exiles match, marketed as they think they're better because the played in the "superior "competition.
Whilst they are going on get Scotland, Wales, Ireland and France playing each other.
After typing all that another thought popped into my head. The RU 6 nations, with a mid season competition where the regular season is going on whilst the international competition is going on.'"
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