To be honest tb, I agree that we should have more ambition and use Wembley for internationals, but I also like the idea of having a purely RL Stadium. Maybe it's not the worst idea in the world to build a 40000 seater in Bradford.

I think it's ambitious rather than small mindedness to want a national RL stadium as well as wanting to use Wembley to it's potential.

Which part of the statement "Rugby League NEEDS a national stadium", did YOU not understand?

RL does not have a national stadium. The FA do. They simply let us use it from time to time. That, for a sport spouting 'expansion' and 'development', is not good enough. Wembley, as good as it is, is 200 miles from the heartlands of RL. It's a showpiece stadium - perfect for the CC final, but we've also got the rest of the game to think about.

I suggest you remove that chip from your shoulder - everyone else understands we're talking about a RL Stadium. A true home of RL in the UK.

Care to answer any of the points I made? Or happier making cheap little one-liners?

It's not the FA's national stadium. It's [ithe[/i national stadium. And it's been host to rugby league, as the national stadium, for over 80 years.

[url=http://www.wembleystadium.com/pressbox/features/features-27.htmsee here[/url

[url=http://www.wembleystadium.com/StadiumHistory/greatmemories/challengecup.htmhere[/url

[url=http://www.carnegiechallengecup.co.uk/page.php?id=764here[/url

or to quote another [url=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wembley_Stadium_%281923%29source[/url



But no, let's throw all that history away and build a small regional stadium for a small regional sport.

So where does the money for this come from?

The build cost on a brand new 40-50,000 all seater stadium is going to run into tens of millions of pounds, wherever you locate it.

You can't take it from the money the RFL receives in TV deals, as this is the primary source of funding for clubs and a fair few would be bankrupt if you diverted these funds elsewhere.

You can't borrow it, as any commercial lender will want to see evidence that the stadium is going to viable - half a dozen big games a year for which it might or might not be full isn't going to persuade them in the current climate.

The RFL (as far as I'm aware) isn't sitting on the sort of funds needed to pay for this kind of project.

The FA has multiple revenue streams it can use to pay the running costs of a facility like Wembley. Where is the RFL going to get that funding from, other than out of existing budgets?

It's a great idea in principle, but it's not realistic IMO.

I think thats why Cronus suggested the Salford project , the cost of building doesn't neccessarily double as you move twice as big , however your problem with funding is correct

As for running costs . I think he answered that one

But it is the FA's stadium. It is owned by Wembley National Stadium Ltd, who are a subsidiary company of the FA.

Wembley is owned by the FA. It is the FA's stadium. Yes, we know it's 'the national stadium', but - to repeat myself - we're talking about a RL national stadium. For RL. What is it about that concept you don't understand?

So, Wembley has hosted the CC final, 7 GB internationals and a few England internationals [size=50(maybe some other bits I've missed)[/size. we knew that. No-one has mentioned moving the CC final from Wembley - that's a glorious tradition no-one wants to lose. However, a few internationals is hardly a tradition at all; there's very little history on the international scene worth clinging to. You're not stupid, so I can only assume you're being deliberately stubborn. Wembley would be used as it has been since 1929 with a couple of exceptions - for CC finals. No-one has suggested otherwise.

What we're talking about is a home base for RL in the UK. A base for the national side, various semi-finals and finals, player development and the RFL. Somewhere we can make money by hosting other events - concerts, other sports, etc. A stadium like that at Barton would have been perfect.

But we cannot fill wembley for an international at the moment can we ?

This was part of my post before




A 40,000 capacity would have been perfect for everything apart from th SL GF and the CC final , that could still be held at Wembley

As for the reason we cant fill Wembley , reread some of the earlier posts , it isn't just fans of certain clubs fault , it is the lack of competition at that level , plus we are by nature club orientated , we always have been

Do we concur with Steve Coogan's (or 'Steve Coogan's') recent contention that the North 'might as well be' a country?

The M62 corridor has a population of 5-6 million. More than Wales and similar to Scotland. They can support the Millenium Stadium and Murrayfield in cities smaller than Leeds.
On the other hand the most recent figures for turnover I can find:
RFL: £21.9m
SRU: £33.5m
WRU: £58.5m

Although the SRU and WRU effectively own the pro clubs iirc, so that might distort the picture.
For completeness - the RFU: £112m (down from £119.2m). For context Manchester Utd: £63.3m per quarter, so roughly a quarter of a billion a year!

The original Barton concept had plans for a casino, hotel and other facilities - a larger stadium could integrate these facilities quite easily. Of course there would be a degree of debt and like any development there's an element of risk. Start-up funding would probably be the main stumbling block but Peel Holdings are not known for their lack of ambition (or lack of cash) and as Starbug says, additional capacity would require additional capital on top of the current plans; not the entire lump sum from scratch. It wouldn't be easy but there are ways and means. It's just unfortunate a major recession came along just as the original larger scale plans were starting to gain momentum.

The best investment a RFL stadium could make would be a top-notch marketing and sales team, who could initially go out and sell sponsorship (similar to Emirates at City Stadium). Simply drive them past the site and point out that hundreds of thousands of people drive past Barton every single day and their brand would be in full view, attached to a stunning new stadium - as well as SL and international RL TV exposure, among others.

They then go out and pitch the stadium at any number of touring events (concerts, NFL, wrestling, boxing, motorsports, etc, etc) and attract corporate sponsors and sell hospitality. As I've said, it also hosts all England internationals, CC semi-finals, Co-op and Northern Rail finals, amateur and youth finals, even 9s events. Sale could be tempted to play there. Other minor sports then come in - international lacrosse and hockey have been hosted at local stadiums in recent years. It could be a busy and profitable stadium.

Yes. And it was going to make Salford the richest club in the history of sport. Turned out to be slightly less than factual though, didn't it?



A 20-40k stadium?

This is, at best, a fantasy. Even more so that than the Casino, hotel etc in Salford.

Monster Trucks? Haye vs Klitschko? WWF? Bon Jovi? I see no problem with a 40k stadium hosting these events.

The loss of the casino was hardly Salford's fault, was it? A great idea that floundered due to outside influences, just as the larger scale plans were binned as the world entered financial meltdown.

Of course, a hotel next door to the massive industrial and business parks at Trafford Park and around Manchester and right on the M60 would be a disaster.

Not quite sure what your point is. You think a central hub for RL would be A Bad Thing?

If that’s what you think, then why did you spend 4 pages of posts arguing with me when I said the same thing earlier in the thread?

Admittedly, the first one of those is a club game … but "we can't fill Wembley"?

No , you said it was the main reason , I said it wasn't the main reason , why did I do that

Simple , I have been to lots of Internationals , but I'm that fed up of dissapointment , I'm not bothered any more , that and a general dissatisfaction with how the game is being run are the main reasons I have lost interest in International RL , read what is there , not what you think is there

I must say that if English RL needs a permanent home, so does Wales.


Devil's Advocate

They have one , its at Neath

There are a lot of "I's" there, did it not occur to you that I was talking about the whole of the Rugby League world and not just what you thought about international rugby?

That the site is also right next to a sewage works may well count against that flash hotel idea though.

The cold hard facts are these.

Rugby League is effectively a minority sport in the UK played almost exclusively by clubs from what has been called the M62 corridor.

And it has always been that way.


Until schools all across the country play league as their preferred code of Rugby rather than union then thats the way it will stay.


Also when you factor in the fact England/GB have won nothing at international level since a very high % of this forums users were born really doesnt help.

What on earth is the point in even thinking about holding an RL international at Wembley? Last years 4 nations clash between England and Australia at Wigan couldnt even sell out the DW. And Wigan is arguably in one of the biggest rugby league supporting areas in the UK.

Times have moved on since the game was drawing lots of fans for RL fixtures at Wembley.

Why should your average English supporter (who is most likely to be living in the north) have to travel to London to watch his national side get a flogging...when he can just watch it on Sky down the pub (if you can find a pub that is not showing soccer instead)

Think that may summarise part of the reason why that's a non runner

Surely to god most pubs in the RL heartlands that have live sport showing would show an RL international?

It's actually finding PUBS!!!

They are closing at about 40 a week in GB!!! and have been doing so for many years.

It will be the highly priced warm beer and the small bags of fried pig skin and fat (scratchings?) they sell behind the bar thats causing the punters to disappear faster than a labrador who has just seen Joel Monaghan reaching for the peanut butter.

British pubs are pretty ordinary.


Thats why Barry McKenzie refuses to drink in any other establishments other than Shepherds Bush Walkabout during the week and The Church on a sunday lunchtime.

You are at the moment living in London Barry,I thought all the beer darn sarf was warm anyway.